anyone want to take a shot at comparing the handling of these two cars?

pretty much the 44 turbo is gonna outrun a wrx, but a friend of mine up here at work just bought a wrx (allwheel drive in case you didn't know) and I want to know if my 951 can out-handle his car.

-pretty stock 951 - koni adjustables all around.. stock sway bars - stock springs/torsion bars.

vs

stock subaru wrx.

 

actually the wrx has variable AWD. At low speeds, the car has AWD, but at higher speeds, the car becomes two wheel drive. The audi's are the only cars out there now, that have full time AWD. But, I drove the WRX. I thought the lag was incredible. It feels much much slower than my 951. I tried to down shift and it seemed like the turbo never kicked in. it was pretty pathetic. anyway, I think the 951 would win. (from my experience)

 

My experiences with wrx's in Oz are that they understeer real bad nearing their limit.
I've never raced one directly with my 951, but I have driven a few wrx's and would say 951 all the way.

 

Timely question! Just 3 weeks ago I was on the track with my buddy who was driving his WRX and I was in my 951. Not a lot of comparison since I have a race prepped 951 and his was a bone stock WRX. Observations: The WRX stock suspension is not very good. While driving behind him on the track I was actually laughing watching the car transition in the corners. The entire car would sway to point of where it appeared that it would go onto 2 wheels! The turbo lag is suppose to be pretty bad as is the understeer push coming out of a turn apex.
With all that said, my buddy held his own against some pretty fast BMW's so with a good driver the car is pretty fast. With a few suspension mods I will bet there would be a vast improvement.
I am still waiting for the Lancer EVO VII though!!

 

One thing that no one has touched on about a WRX that I have read a lot of complaints about is the brakes. I think that the spec is like 185 feet from sixty. Don't quote me on that but it is something long like that.

 

I have a friend with a WRX. My 944 out handles it on the road. But we took his WRX on some gravel roads and it was awesome. It truely is a rally car.

Oh, and we observed very neutral handling at the limit, not understear, at least on those gravel roads.

 

One of students had a WRX at Buttonwillow in the rain several months ago. This is one bad-a** 4WD car!!! It was so much more nimble, responsive and better-handling than an Audi S4 at the limit. By the end of the day, we were doing 4-wheel drifts coming out of corners under full-throttle. It would then spin all 4 tires for 40-50ft down the straight with perfect control! No understeer or excessive body-roll. I wouldn't even be able to keep up with it in the rain in my 951.

 

In the absence of a particular question, I guess I can take a shot at this. I’m the guy 951racer was talking about in his post above.

I am assuming that the original question was posted with regard to driving on the street? If so, I would say the two cars would be pretty close. Although the cars claim pretty similar peak HP numbers, they are very different in how they seem to deliver it, and the 944’s got a pretty substantial torque advantage. If I’m not mistaken, the WRX is rated at 227hp/217ftlbs, while the 951 posts 217/243. Keep in mind that these are engine dyno numbers, not at the wheels. I think driveline losses are considerably higher for the Scoobie, so I would expect the 951 to post better hp AND torque numbers at the wheels. Both cars are very similar in weight.

I’ve never driven a stock 951 – mine’s very much un-stock : )! But here’s how I would compare them based deduction from my experience in a 951 with only a chip:

Standing starts: Given the 951’s torque advantage, I think the 951 wins in “everyday driving” starts. Let’s face it, until these cars come on boost, they behave as normally aspirated, and it’s a 2.5L vs. 1.9L. HOWEVER, if you are willing to beat the snot of your driveline (aka 4,000 rpm clutch dumps) I think the advantage goes away because the WRX is all wheel drive, and the 944’s never been much of a drag racer in stock form. So under the conditions of a magazine 0-60 test, the WRX may win.

Top end: No contest – the 951 would run away. At Pocono, running the Long Course the WRX would track out of the NASCAR bowl at around 110 mph. With my foot flat on the floor all the way down the Long Pond Straight, I would only reach 125 or so before the Tunnel Turn. The WRX runs out of breath looonnng before the redline! I could hit 135-140 there in the 951 easily.

Overall street handling: Close, but I may give the WRX the edge for “feel”. That car is just soooo forgiving, and it feels lighter than it is on the street. If it rains, the guy in the 944 may as well forget about it. I don’t have much experience with stock 951 suspension, but the WRX just feels great on the street as a daily driver. It is more fun than the C4 Cab I sold! I would guess that with its rally pedigree, the car was designed around a pretty long-travel suspension that will still perform well. This translates into a car that feels more plush than the 944, but still has a ton of grip. I’ve yet to have the WRX get really unsettled on the street.

Turning up the wick – driving on the race track: Unless it rains, give me the 944. Here the WRX needs some serious help. The stock suspension is too damn "soft" to really get it done on the track. I think it really goes back to (a) lots of travel, and (b) really tall ride height. The result is that in long high speed sweepers, like the NASCAR turns at Pocono, if you can stand the, errr…excitement…from the car squirming all over the place, the WRX will surprise everyone. Ask 951racer! But on a more technical road course it gets ugly. There is a lot of weight to transfer all around, and the excessive suspension travel and body roll cause big problems. The camber situation gets particularly ugly, for instance. The thing does push like a pig. (Good news is you can throw it into a corner practically sideways under braking and power out ala 4wd!)

Braking: I can’t comment on Kool’s experience, but mine was different. I would guess that poor braking numbers posted by the WRX had something to do with wheels and tires. No 944 ever produced had tires as pathetic as the stock WRX rubber. In my opinion, the true test for a brake system only happens at the track, and the WRX handled it like a champ. With Porterfield R4 pads and stock everything else, I had NO fade, NO rotor warpage, NO noticeable rotor wear, NO cracking, NO soft pedal, and always plenty of stopping power. So, they’re OK by me.

Hope this helps. If you’ve got any specific q’s, fire away.

 

One of my employees just bought a wrx wagon yesterday. I took it out for a spin this morning, it's running less than 200 miles on the odo so she didn't want me to rev it beyond 4,000. It doesn't feel as quick as my 951, lots more lag than the 951, doesn't brake as firmly, and the ride is a lot plusher than the 951 with Koni sports and big weltmeister swaybars.

All that said, my wife wants me to get one to haul the kids around in. That means ditching one of my vehicles though, something I'm reluctant to do.

 

Thanks for the first hand account John. My observations were only from articles that I had read in magazines. As we all know numbers don't necessarily reflect in the real world feel and behavior of the car. I just looked at Road and Track and they quote the 60-0 distance of 138ft. So I was wrong. Sorry about the misinformation

 

Interesting that the turbo lag makes it feel so slow, because the car rag tests show it as fast as, if not faster than the standard 951 in 0-60. I've also heard that, like most Japanese turbocars, there's a bunch of cheap speed equipment available that makes it substantially faster.

 

I've driven a friend's WRX that had basic exhaust mods and a manual aquarium-bleeder style boost controller and there was virtually zero lag involved in driving the car. It was quite abit quicker 0-60 than my stock (at the time) 951, but on the highway I would crush it.

 

So the consensus is:

0-60 forget it...the 951 will lose
60 UP the 951, weather permitting, has an excellent advantage with a few mods?

 

2 more points:

1. The WRX can be modified to have boost come on WAY sooner than stock for not much money (just a chip, I think). This will also increase max boost in 1st and 2nd.

2. The current incarnation of the WRX 5-speed has bad synchro problems. Some people keep getting transmissions replaced under waranty every 6 months.

WRX is going to release the STi 6-speed sometime soon and this problem should be fixed. The 4-speed Auto is supposed to be bullet proof, but is oh so boring.