ADVICE::: Water, Water, or Air????? (long)
05-31-2003, 07:14 AM
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Three Wheelin'
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ADVICE::: Water, Water, or Air????? (long)
August 24th... my smart-buy is over... I will be turning in my Chevy ZR2 Blazer. I will be buying my second Porsche. BUT.. I can't decide what to buy.
My first was an 86 951 black/black. While I had this, I discovered the 968 and love the updated look of those cars. But while pricing 968s, I discovered that a 911 (964) C2 is also in my price range...
Now I can't decide if I want another 951 (although I'd get an S this time around), or a 968, or spend a bit more and get the attention of a 911. If I get the 951S, I'd be doing some mods, probably go with Danno's (GuruRacing) Stage II MAP kit and eventually a larger turbo. I would love to have this setup. If I get a 968, I'd probably not do any mods and just use the money keeping it in perfect shape. If I get a 964, I'll probably do some minor mods and use the money on the more expensive repairs.
So.. I've come to the table of 951 enthusiasts for some advice. For my $15-$25k, I could get a super clean 951S and even a fairly super clean 968, or a higher mileage 964 C2.. A big part of me wants a 911, just because it's a 911 and I've wanted one since I can remember... But I loved having that turbo under the hood in my 951. HP #'s for the 964 are at 250, but I don't know which had more torque, the 951 (or S) or a 964. Anyone got good numbers to match these two cars up? Which one (stock) would be faster? I know eventually a 951S that I would modify would have bigger numbers.. but..
I got to go around Motor Sport ranch with an experienced DE instructor in his 911,and I was speechless.. that car was amazing. I am hooked on DE's and track driving and nearly hooked on getting a 911, but everytime I see a 951 on the road, I loose my thoughts and start all over again.. WHAT TO GET!?!?
Not sure anyone here can help.. just thought I'd post my thoughts and see if others have had the same split decisions.
My first was an 86 951 black/black. While I had this, I discovered the 968 and love the updated look of those cars. But while pricing 968s, I discovered that a 911 (964) C2 is also in my price range...
Now I can't decide if I want another 951 (although I'd get an S this time around), or a 968, or spend a bit more and get the attention of a 911. If I get the 951S, I'd be doing some mods, probably go with Danno's (GuruRacing) Stage II MAP kit and eventually a larger turbo. I would love to have this setup. If I get a 968, I'd probably not do any mods and just use the money keeping it in perfect shape. If I get a 964, I'll probably do some minor mods and use the money on the more expensive repairs.
So.. I've come to the table of 951 enthusiasts for some advice. For my $15-$25k, I could get a super clean 951S and even a fairly super clean 968, or a higher mileage 964 C2.. A big part of me wants a 911, just because it's a 911 and I've wanted one since I can remember... But I loved having that turbo under the hood in my 951. HP #'s for the 964 are at 250, but I don't know which had more torque, the 951 (or S) or a 964. Anyone got good numbers to match these two cars up? Which one (stock) would be faster? I know eventually a 951S that I would modify would have bigger numbers.. but..
I got to go around Motor Sport ranch with an experienced DE instructor in his 911,and I was speechless.. that car was amazing. I am hooked on DE's and track driving and nearly hooked on getting a 911, but everytime I see a 951 on the road, I loose my thoughts and start all over again.. WHAT TO GET!?!?
Not sure anyone here can help.. just thought I'd post my thoughts and see if others have had the same split decisions.
05-31-2003, 09:24 AM
#2
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Performance wise nothing comes close to the 951. It's the best bang for the $. The C2 (stay away from 89-91, unless the cylinders have been updated), will cost you more to purchase.
It appears that you already answered your own question.
" A big part of me wants a 911, just because it's a 911 and I've wanted one since I can remember... "
You already experienced the 951, get your 911. Sooner or later you'll own both
.
The 951 is easier to drive on the street or track. The 911 is more prestigious (if you are into those kind of things).
If you plan on modifying the 951, no need to get the 951S as you'll be paying for items you intend on replacing anyway (Turbo, chips, suspension..). However if the price between a 951 vs 951S is close enough then go for the S.
The 968 is a nice car. And a great car is you turbocharge it...
It appears that you already answered your own question.
" A big part of me wants a 911, just because it's a 911 and I've wanted one since I can remember... "
You already experienced the 951, get your 911. Sooner or later you'll own both
. The 951 is easier to drive on the street or track. The 911 is more prestigious (if you are into those kind of things).
If you plan on modifying the 951, no need to get the 951S as you'll be paying for items you intend on replacing anyway (Turbo, chips, suspension..). However if the price between a 951 vs 951S is close enough then go for the S.
The 968 is a nice car. And a great car is you turbocharge it...
05-31-2003, 05:03 PM
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Three Wheelin'
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15-20k will allow you to buy a pristine 951 and still put some money into performance, not a bad place to be... stock i think the 951 is fairly close to the 911 of that age for torque, but with just the map kit it will blow it out of the water.
if you're hooked on DE, spend your mod money on suspension after you buy the MAP kit... the car already handles great, but there are unlimited levels of what you can do to improve upon any car. start with something simple like m030 swaybars or kokeln ones (more$ but more adjustable) and go from there... coilovers, t-bars (or the kokeln/lindsey piece which eliminates it) and so on.
or you could do what i've done, buy a fairly cheap 951, wait for stuff to break, and upgrade like hell when it does.... certainly not going to save you money, but it's been a lotta fun and quite the learning experience. i'm expecting my car to be scary when it's done (soon, but i'm taking time off for my sr. thesis film)
if you're hooked on DE, spend your mod money on suspension after you buy the MAP kit... the car already handles great, but there are unlimited levels of what you can do to improve upon any car. start with something simple like m030 swaybars or kokeln ones (more$ but more adjustable) and go from there... coilovers, t-bars (or the kokeln/lindsey piece which eliminates it) and so on.
or you could do what i've done, buy a fairly cheap 951, wait for stuff to break, and upgrade like hell when it does.... certainly not going to save you money, but it's been a lotta fun and quite the learning experience. i'm expecting my car to be scary when it's done (soon, but i'm taking time off for my sr. thesis film)
06-03-2003, 05:23 AM
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Three Wheelin'
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interesting input from you guys.. thanks.
My first 951, I already said, was an 86, and I only spend $6500 up front (120k miles), but it help up very well and the interior was near perfect. I was very pleased with it. A part of me is saying, how could I spend $15-20k on a car that is just a couple years newer, less miles, but 3 times as much up front, when I could get a 911 for around the same price?
I know no one can tell me what to get or make my decision, but it helps to get opinions from some of you who drive these cars still. I think I'll have my decision when I go an actually drive a C2 (hopefully in the next couple weeks) since I've only seen them from a distance while checking out the last DE at MSR. I"ve driven a 968 and owned a 951, but haven't even sat in a 964 yet, so we'll see.. I think I like the interior of the 951/968 better than the 964 (from pictures)
what are yalls opinions of the 964 interior?
My first 951, I already said, was an 86, and I only spend $6500 up front (120k miles), but it help up very well and the interior was near perfect. I was very pleased with it. A part of me is saying, how could I spend $15-20k on a car that is just a couple years newer, less miles, but 3 times as much up front, when I could get a 911 for around the same price?
I know no one can tell me what to get or make my decision, but it helps to get opinions from some of you who drive these cars still. I think I'll have my decision when I go an actually drive a C2 (hopefully in the next couple weeks) since I've only seen them from a distance while checking out the last DE at MSR. I"ve driven a 968 and owned a 951, but haven't even sat in a 964 yet, so we'll see.. I think I like the interior of the 951/968 better than the 964 (from pictures)
what are yalls opinions of the 964 interior?
06-03-2003, 06:06 AM
#5
Seems to me you are ready for 964. It's nice car, feels different than 951. There's not that boost-thrill but flat six feels (sounds) nice. Early models have cylinder & distributor belt issues, but they can be modified to newer specs quite easily. If you want to modify 964 it would cost a lot more than modify a 951. I would like to own both 951 & 964
06-03-2003, 07:54 AM
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Three Wheelin'
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Olli Snellman:
<strong> I would like to own both 951 & 964</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Ah... this is my problem!
Really though, I'm not sure I would modify a 964, other than suspension, wheels/tires, brakes, ("track stuff" -- not really "go fast" stuff), but this would all be over time as I grow into the car on the track, learning the limits and expanding on them as I go..
a 951 would find itself on the track less I think, and I'd want to make it fast and make it handle (read--good suspension) as much power I could give it (in budget).
Oh to have both... I'm envious of FC-Racer... 965 & and 951S
<strong> I would like to own both 951 & 964</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Ah... this is my problem!
Really though, I'm not sure I would modify a 964, other than suspension, wheels/tires, brakes, ("track stuff" -- not really "go fast" stuff), but this would all be over time as I grow into the car on the track, learning the limits and expanding on them as I go..
a 951 would find itself on the track less I think, and I'd want to make it fast and make it handle (read--good suspension) as much power I could give it (in budget).
Oh to have both... I'm envious of FC-Racer... 965 & and 951S
06-04-2003, 10:29 PM
#7
If the difference in power is acceptable I'd recommend an '87-89 Carrera. More reliable than a 964. Not just the engine/drivetrain but remember the 964 used more electronics in the car.
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06-04-2003, 10:37 PM
#8
Nordschleife Master
Danny, Farzaan (FC racer) had a 951S then sold it for a 964 turbo (965?). Anyway, he's moving to a 993TT, or so I've read.
He didnt have them at the same time, though.
If I were you I would go test drive a nice 964.
He didnt have them at the same time, though.
If I were you I would go test drive a nice 964.
06-05-2003, 01:42 PM
#10
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964 is a great driving car, lots of torque, they can bleed you to death with oil leaks and other minor problems. Personally I prefer the body of the 78-89 911 or the 993. The 964 is a much more civilized car than the earlier 911s, much easier to live with on a daily basis.