Gains with just MAP
06-24-2003, 06:27 PM
#1
Drifting
Thread Starter
Gains with just MAP
I'm seriously thinking about going with a Guru Stg.1 MAP setup. What kind of boost in power and HP can my 951S expect by adding the link stuff to my current setup? How dificult is the installation?
Thanks in advance,
Justin
Thanks in advance,
Justin
06-24-2003, 06:43 PM
#2
Drifting
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Just a guess....
As an example: Rich's car with just Guru chips/MBC had 215RWHP.
My car with Map stage#1 had 240RWHP.
For the "S" you would probally see 275-290RWHP depending on boost levels and how well you could tune your fuel curve. But you gain the ability to adjust fuel amounts for higher boost.
HTH
Jason
As an example: Rich's car with just Guru chips/MBC had 215RWHP.
My car with Map stage#1 had 240RWHP.
For the "S" you would probally see 275-290RWHP depending on boost levels and how well you could tune your fuel curve. But you gain the ability to adjust fuel amounts for higher boost.
HTH
Jason
06-24-2003, 08:56 PM
#5
Race Director
I just added some dyno-charts for GURU chip-upgrades on our <a href="http://forums.gururacing.net" target="_blank">GURU Forums</a> for Turbo and TurboS cars.
Most people are getting 230-235rwhp with the chip-upgrade on a Turbo, 270-275rwhp with TurboS. Add about another +30hp on top of that for a MAP upgrade. This will be the absolute ragged edge of the stock turbo and injectors.
Most people are getting 230-235rwhp with the chip-upgrade on a Turbo, 270-275rwhp with TurboS. Add about another +30hp on top of that for a MAP upgrade. This will be the absolute ragged edge of the stock turbo and injectors.
06-24-2003, 09:32 PM
#6
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I have an appointment on the dyno next week (rescheduled from this week). That should provide some numbers for an MAP Stage 1 installation on a Turbo S.
06-24-2003, 10:27 PM
#7
Race Director
Try to get a boost-curve plotted on the chart as well. I'm wondering if the stock shimmed wastegate has the same drop on a Turbo and a TurboS... <img border="0" alt="[bigbye]" title="" src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" />
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06-25-2003, 12:59 PM
#8
Why is it that no OEM auto maker uses a MAP
device as an air/load input device anymore?
The last time Porsche used a MAP was in the
'70s on the D-Jetronic.
With a MAP you get "tons" of fuel at start-up.
It's very difficult to get a good air/fuel ratio
with it. I guess those turbos love "tons" of
fuel. Check out this website, Systemsc.com. It
may have some helpful info about fuel injection.
Good Luck
Loren
'88 3.2
device as an air/load input device anymore?
The last time Porsche used a MAP was in the
'70s on the D-Jetronic.
With a MAP you get "tons" of fuel at start-up.
It's very difficult to get a good air/fuel ratio
with it. I guess those turbos love "tons" of
fuel. Check out this website, Systemsc.com. It
may have some helpful info about fuel injection.
Good Luck
Loren
'88 3.2
06-25-2003, 02:33 PM
#10
Probably, because they're readily available
as a standard product to include with performance
systems and because they dump "tons" of fuel
at acceleration without regard to the air/fuel
ratio or emissions. It's like putting a 4 barrel
on your old Chevy that was designed for a 2
barrel carb w/o any engine mods, total performance
w/o concern for effectiveness/efficiency.
Again, ask yourself why Porsche/Bosch with
"unlimited" resources for street/race doesn't
use MAPs.
Good Luck
Loren
as a standard product to include with performance
systems and because they dump "tons" of fuel
at acceleration without regard to the air/fuel
ratio or emissions. It's like putting a 4 barrel
on your old Chevy that was designed for a 2
barrel carb w/o any engine mods, total performance
w/o concern for effectiveness/efficiency.
Again, ask yourself why Porsche/Bosch with
"unlimited" resources for street/race doesn't
use MAPs.
Good Luck
Loren
06-25-2003, 02:49 PM
#11
Nordschleife Master
Lorenfb,
Are you saying the a/f ratio will be way off under part throttle operation or full throttle & full boost?
It's obvious from dyno charts that the MAP kit provides good a/f ratio's at full throttle and full boost...
Also if you talk to people that have been running danno's MAP sensor kit, you'll see that they all enjoy good part throttle response. That doesn't sound like dumping "tons" of fuel in to me...
Where is YOUR proof that a MAP will just dump "tons" of fuel?
Are you saying the a/f ratio will be way off under part throttle operation or full throttle & full boost?
It's obvious from dyno charts that the MAP kit provides good a/f ratio's at full throttle and full boost...
Also if you talk to people that have been running danno's MAP sensor kit, you'll see that they all enjoy good part throttle response. That doesn't sound like dumping "tons" of fuel in to me...
Where is YOUR proof that a MAP will just dump "tons" of fuel?
06-25-2003, 02:49 PM
#12
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Lorenfb:
<strong>Again, ask yourself why Porsche/Bosch with
"unlimited" resources for street/race doesn't
use MAPs.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">On the other hand, I find it hard to imagine a more archaic boost management system than the stock system Porsche designed into the 951!
<strong>Again, ask yourself why Porsche/Bosch with
"unlimited" resources for street/race doesn't
use MAPs.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">On the other hand, I find it hard to imagine a more archaic boost management system than the stock system Porsche designed into the 951!
06-25-2003, 03:24 PM
#13
Drifting
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So far everyone with the guru MAP kit is happy and there have been alot of dyno charts with a/f ratios... I think the real question here lorenfb is: what are YOU trying to sell?
I checked though the posts you have made and i find this line repeated quite a few times:
"Check out this web site, Systemsc.com.
If may provide some helpful info about *insert current topic of conversation here*"
<a href="https://rennlist.com/sponsorship.html" target="_blank">https://rennlist.com/sponsorship.html</a>
I checked though the posts you have made and i find this line repeated quite a few times:
"Check out this web site, Systemsc.com.
If may provide some helpful info about *insert current topic of conversation here*"
<a href="https://rennlist.com/sponsorship.html" target="_blank">https://rennlist.com/sponsorship.html</a>
06-25-2003, 04:38 PM
#14
Drifting
Thread Starter
Loren,
I checked that website... I gotta tell ya man... not a lot of helpful info there. I'm not even sure what they do for the 951 other than rebuilding DMEs.
Instead of asking myself why Porsche doesn't use MAP (because I honestly don't know... I'm no engineer) I'm going to ask you why.
Justin
I checked that website... I gotta tell ya man... not a lot of helpful info there. I'm not even sure what they do for the 951 other than rebuilding DMEs.
Instead of asking myself why Porsche doesn't use MAP (because I honestly don't know... I'm no engineer) I'm going to ask you why.
Justin