Van

I was just looking at the PCA racing rules, and in G class, a Playboy-Escort Cup car only has to weigh 2920 lbs - while a Turbo S in F class has to weigh 3148 lbs.

I currently run in SP3 - because that allows me to delete the AC and run a non-factory DME chip.

If I wanted to run in the stock classes, those modifications would bump me up to G - but with a 228 lb penalty over a cup car (and we both have about 250 HP).

So, it seem that I'd be better off trying to "replicate" a cup car - and run as that. Then (probably) I wouldn't need AC and could put the car on a diet, rather than have to add ballast.

But, I'd have to find out what those cars had... my understanding is that the 951S is "based" on those cars - but I'm not positive about that, and don't know how they still might differ.

Any thoughts?

Tms951

My guess is that you have to have an actual cup car, and that if you tried to replicate one with your 951S, it would still be considered a 951S and held to those rules.

Oddjob

Van,

The biggest diferences between a Cup and a Street car were the suspension components. Since nearly all suspension is free to upgrade/change per PCA rules, you do not need to match the Cup suspension parts to meet update/backdate requirements.

Here is the list of items that I sent to Donna Amico a couple years ago for pre-approval of a street car conversion to Club Sport/Cup specs for PCA Club Racing (assuming you are starting with a Turbo S: 928S4 brakes, ABS, LSD/Oil-cooled Trans, K28/8).

ENGINE:

-MAGNESIUM INTAKE MANIFOLD (this might not be required)

-SINGLE RADIATOR COOLING FAN AND SHROUD. SAME PART AS EARLY 944 N/A WITHOUT AC, STOCK PARTS.

-MAGNESIUM OIL PAN (Donna waved this)

-CUP DME AND KLR CHIPS


SUSPENSION/CHASSIS

-MANUAL STEERING. MANUAL STEERING RACK, TIE RODS, AND STEERING SHAFT.

-ABS RESET/SHUTOFF TOGGLE SWITCH INSTALLED IN CENTER CONSOLE.


BODY:

-STRUT TOWER BRACE. FACTORY BOLT IN BAR W/ WELD IN BRACKETS (Since Strut Tower braces are free, Donna did not require the factory style bar)

-FIBERGLASS HOOD. WITH QUICK RELEASE CORNER LATCHES AND HOLD-OPEN STRUT (REMOVE HOOD SHOCKS).

-MANUAL DOOR MIRRORS. BLACK PLASTIC MANUAL MIRROR ASSEMBLIES WITH BASE AND GASKETS. (Any Porsche mirror is legal, so Donna did not require the Cup mirrors).

-MANUAL WINDOWS. MANUAL WINDOW MECHANISM WITH CRANK HANDLES. STOCK LATE MODEL 944 PARTS

-DELETE SUNROOF. STANDARD 944 NON-SUNROOF ROOF SKIN, INTERIOR TRIM, AND HEADLINER

-DELETE AIR CONDITIONING. REMOVE COMPRESSOR, EVAPORATOR, CONDENSER AND LINES. SWAP HEATER CONTROL UNIT (NON AC). INSTALL ALTERNATOR BRACKET AND POLYRIB BELT.

-DELETE CRUISE CONTROL. REMOVE CONTROL UNIT, CABLES, WIRING, SERVO UNIT, AND ARM ON TURN SIGNAL STALK.

-DELETE AIR BAGS. REMOVE AIRBAG WHEEL, CONTROL UNIT, SENSORS USE NON-AIRBAG DASH. (Not sure that the non airbag dash would be required).

-DELETE REAR WIPER. REMOVE WIPER MOTOR, WIPER ARM, WIRING, AND INSTALL BLANK PLUG IN HATCH HOLE.

-DELETE RADIO PREP KIT. REMOVE RADIO, SPEAKERS, WIRING.

-DELETE DOOR RUB STRIPS

-DELETE CENTRAL LOCKING AND ALARM SYSTEM. REMOVE POWER LOCK SERVOS, ALARM CONTROL UNIT, AND WIRING.

-DELETE CONSOLE CASSETTE HOLDER. INSTALL BASIC TRAY.

-DELETE DOOR PANEL MAP COMPARTMENTS.

-DELETE POWER HATCH RELEASE. REMOVE MOTOR, CABLE, SWITCH, AND WIRING.

-DELETE REAR SEAT BELTS.

-DELETE BODY UNDERCOATING. REMOVE SPRAYED ON POLY/VINYL SOUND DEADENING/CORROSION PROTECTION FROM FLOOR PAN AND FENDER TUBS. (This really sucks, so I would avoid at all cost...)


ELECTRIC:

-LIGHTWEIGHT WIRING HARNESS. ELIMINATE EXCESS WIRING FROM DELETED ACCESSORIES.



Donna also has some info that leads her to believe the Canadian Cups had a short 5th gear. All information I have shows that to not be true, but I did not persue the argument and we agreed that the US Escort/Club Sports had standard Turbo gearing - so my car is classed as an 87 Club Sport.

Thom

Jim, have you ever seen one of those Cup sumps supposedly made of magnesium ?

I have had the opportunity to look at several Cup cars here and could not notice a visual difference with the stock unit.

Fact or myth ? Just wondering.

jerome951

Van, if you can do it, you should be pretty competitive in G. I've overheard the 911 G drivers complaining about the Turbo Cup cars, which means they must be winning...

Oddjob

Yes, they do exist - have seen one on a car and a severial pictures of different dismounted pans. The '86 mag. pans were painted black. The 87 and later pans were not painted, were just raw metal. Color is slighter darker than the aluminum pans, more like a dull medium gray.

Attached pic is of the inside of an '86 pan - the outside is painted black, but the inside is approx the color that the later 87+ pans look like on the external surface too.

Oddjob

Drivers being equal, a 951 Cup has no problems running with (or ahead of) G-Class 964 RSA's and 993's.

Thom

Thanks for that Jim, that clears me up.

Van

Well, perhaps I've started down the slippery slope.. I just won a fiberglass hood on ebay! (Now, how to ship the darn thing from Ohio to New York for less than $175... it only weighs 14 lbs.)

Animus

A slippery slope indeed. The conversion sounds, exciting just reading about the idea.

Techno Duck

Van, did you bid on one of those IFC hoods? If so, please let us know how the fitment on them is. I have been considering one for a long time.

Chris White

Hmmm...extra port on the cup pan...I wonder what that was for?

Van

Yes a new IFC hood. I'm anxious to see how it fits too!

MM951

They also have a pic I took on their website . The prices are good I'd like to see the fit when you get the parts

Have you seen these guys?

http://s244276042.onlinehome.us/944pg.htm

Oddjob

Havent figured that out. The only other picture I have of '86 mag pans are installed on cars w/ the belly pans on, so I cant see if they also have this plugged port. The '87+ pans do not have it that I have seen.