went to Dyno
08-05-2005, 04:14 AM
#17
I was all set to buy the Link you have. I have since heard a bit more background, which I won't post on a public forum as it's hearsay, so I realise yours is not an evolution of the aftermarket MAP kit. Unfortunately the plot above was pulled, in front of me, about 3 days before I ordered my EMS and no way was I dropping $ on Link anything just after seeing that.
08-05-2005, 04:22 AM
#19
Here's the other car on the same day. This one is much more heavily modified, and it now runs a standalone system after the owner was unable to get the AFR sorted out on countless dyno hours. The owner is on here so he might identify himself. Alternatively let me know if you want the plots pulled 
Other plots from the same day are here so you can see it wasn't just the dyno... http://www.cannell.co.uk/944%200505%20Dyno%20Data.htm
Other plots from the same day are here so you can see it wasn't just the dyno... http://www.cannell.co.uk/944%200505%20Dyno%20Data.htm
08-05-2005, 04:28 AM
#21
I have nothing, but as I say if the owner of either car reads this they might be able to help. The first car has since been to an official UK Link dealer and they couldn't improve things much though...
08-05-2005, 06:46 PM
#26
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The second car is mine. The AFM Link is in the bin pending some 12 bore shotgun action ! A worthless piece of Junk.
I've now got the Wolf-3D and J&S safaguard from Lindsey Racing. Working through the teething problems at the moment ready for some proper mapping sessions. So far all looks good.
That lean spot just wont go away with the Link. That's after nearly 100 pulls on the Dyno Dynamics.
The other car is also on my site HERE . I've got some later plots taken at Weltmeister 3 days after it was supposedly tuned by a Link dealer in the UK, Thor Racing. I'll post those as well in a couple of days when I get time.
Interestingly, a third car with the Link AFM was also dyno'd the same session and can be seen HERE .
Note that all 3 cars so equipped have unbelievable AFR curves despite each having may hours spent on them ...
Andy, no pcl files - it's the AFM link, not the standalone setup.
In summary, three cars in the UK (the only ones to our knowledge to be accurately dyno'd and certainly the only ones from a trusted dyno cell with known good calibration and accurate gas analyser). All fitted with The Link AFM. All exhibiting the same type of AFR characteristics. Many independant hours testing and tuning. Same result.
Fortunately I've cut my losses now and moved on to a proper standalone system so I can move forward and realise the proper potential of my engine.
Rick
www.cannell.co.uk
I've now got the Wolf-3D and J&S safaguard from Lindsey Racing. Working through the teething problems at the moment ready for some proper mapping sessions. So far all looks good.
That lean spot just wont go away with the Link. That's after nearly 100 pulls on the Dyno Dynamics.
The other car is also on my site HERE . I've got some later plots taken at Weltmeister 3 days after it was supposedly tuned by a Link dealer in the UK, Thor Racing. I'll post those as well in a couple of days when I get time.
Interestingly, a third car with the Link AFM was also dyno'd the same session and can be seen HERE .
Note that all 3 cars so equipped have unbelievable AFR curves despite each having may hours spent on them ...
Andy, no pcl files - it's the AFM link, not the standalone setup.
In summary, three cars in the UK (the only ones to our knowledge to be accurately dyno'd and certainly the only ones from a trusted dyno cell with known good calibration and accurate gas analyser). All fitted with The Link AFM. All exhibiting the same type of AFR characteristics. Many independant hours testing and tuning. Same result.
Fortunately I've cut my losses now and moved on to a proper standalone system so I can move forward and realise the proper potential of my engine.
Rick
www.cannell.co.uk
08-05-2005, 09:18 PM
#27
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And the first graph was from my car.
The graph was the end result of the best part of a day on the dyno and a bespoke base chip. Granted the guy doing the tunning hadn't seen a Link AFM previously and spent half a day learning the system and melting my car.
Having been impressed with Danno's conventional chips the bespoke chip was subsequently changed for a Guru MAP chip at the same time I installed Eastenders redundant 55 injectors. I then took the car to Thor Racing to configure the Link AFM for the new set up. Despite being a Link agent they didn't seem to know any more about the Link AFM than the first bloke - this being very much evident in the way the cells were set up. Thor concluded that the unit was faulty. Net result; bigger injectors, new chip and dyno time demonstrated less power than previously, even more fuel, and a propensity to stall when pulling away. A track evening on the Silverstone GP Circuit saw no more than 110 mph (at a struggle) where the previous set up provided 120 mph.
A good few hours on the road subsequently with pen, paper and narrow band AFR meter has seen many fat cells changed by up to -12% with still more fuel to come out.
I have little confidence in the Link AFM and, if finances allowed, would ditch the little beggar. As it is, because of the poor way it has been set up previously, and, because I can't see a cheap alternative, I am sticking with it for the moment. I hope to get it adjusted so as to provide at least the same power as previous to the chip/injector change but fear I maybe wasting my time.
The cells are now set up with zero master and large cell modifications so as to work only within the small cells and try and reduce any influence through what would otherwise be two layers of interpolation. I greatly respect Eastenders comments and have little doubt that AFR curves will still look like a map of the fiords but, being disillusioned at those who set up the Link previously, I now have to prove it to myself.
The graph was the end result of the best part of a day on the dyno and a bespoke base chip. Granted the guy doing the tunning hadn't seen a Link AFM previously and spent half a day learning the system and melting my car.
Having been impressed with Danno's conventional chips the bespoke chip was subsequently changed for a Guru MAP chip at the same time I installed Eastenders redundant 55 injectors. I then took the car to Thor Racing to configure the Link AFM for the new set up. Despite being a Link agent they didn't seem to know any more about the Link AFM than the first bloke - this being very much evident in the way the cells were set up. Thor concluded that the unit was faulty. Net result; bigger injectors, new chip and dyno time demonstrated less power than previously, even more fuel, and a propensity to stall when pulling away. A track evening on the Silverstone GP Circuit saw no more than 110 mph (at a struggle) where the previous set up provided 120 mph.
A good few hours on the road subsequently with pen, paper and narrow band AFR meter has seen many fat cells changed by up to -12% with still more fuel to come out.
I have little confidence in the Link AFM and, if finances allowed, would ditch the little beggar. As it is, because of the poor way it has been set up previously, and, because I can't see a cheap alternative, I am sticking with it for the moment. I hope to get it adjusted so as to provide at least the same power as previous to the chip/injector change but fear I maybe wasting my time.
The cells are now set up with zero master and large cell modifications so as to work only within the small cells and try and reduce any influence through what would otherwise be two layers of interpolation. I greatly respect Eastenders comments and have little doubt that AFR curves will still look like a map of the fiords but, being disillusioned at those who set up the Link previously, I now have to prove it to myself.
08-06-2005, 04:09 AM
#28
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The third car is mine.
The big AFR spike at about 4,250 revs is where it was misfiring - now cured by switching plugs from Bosche Super 4 (now in the bin) to NGK BR7ES gapped a little closer than std - wow, what a difference that made!
Although I'm not really that happy with the Link, I haven't had the scale of problems the others have. The dyno plots shown were after only limited on the road tuning and I have since improved the AFR a lot - my datalogs look OK now, and I hope I have added at least another 20bhp, but I really need to get back to the dyno to check the results and fine tune.
Still need to get boost under better control first though.
Regards
Graham
'88 Turbo S
The big AFR spike at about 4,250 revs is where it was misfiring - now cured by switching plugs from Bosche Super 4 (now in the bin) to NGK BR7ES gapped a little closer than std - wow, what a difference that made!
Although I'm not really that happy with the Link, I haven't had the scale of problems the others have. The dyno plots shown were after only limited on the road tuning and I have since improved the AFR a lot - my datalogs look OK now, and I hope I have added at least another 20bhp, but I really need to get back to the dyno to check the results and fine tune.
Still need to get boost under better control first though.
Regards
Graham
'88 Turbo S
08-07-2005, 10:49 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by Tom M'Guinn
I would think a k27/8 could hold 20psi to redline, no? Is your boost dropping off on purpose or is that the most you can make?
i also just redid the reference and speed sensor wiring i was missing the connector completely on one end.
i do feel my car missfiring and i have new plugs gapped at 28