Is it correct to assume that the variable TPS signal to the KLR is used by the code in the KLR to control boost via the cycling valve ie some sort of table lookup based on RPM and throttle position(from the TPS) as well as giving a WOT signal to the DME. I read somewhere that Bosch/Porsche didn't have time to integrate all the functionality required for turbo engine management into one box so they added the KLR and kept the DME essentially the same as it is in a 944 NA

 

MildMax951

Your assumptions are accurate and are "right on" about the KLR development/functions.
The main function of the KLR is to retard the ignition timing determined by the DME maps
based on the boost (& other variables) being sensed. The 944 functions without a KLR
by just jumping pins 32 to 21 on the DME. Therefore, a non-turbo DME can be easily converted
to a turbo DME by sending its' ignition signal to a KLR & receiving the modified KLR ignition signal.

Nothing really complex about it.

 

These are completely wrong.

Never meant as an attack, just a response to the items you got incorrect above and kept repeating. All of your previous posts in this thread are correct. Sorry if I offended you, no harm intended. Late night spent battling a power window motor and broken regulator in an M3.

As for the TPS, part throttle is a very very important area of operation for the DME. A street engine spends the bulk of its life at part throttle. It is a very complex area of operation which is why the part throttle maps are three dimensional unlike the simple 2D idle/WOT maps. This area is also where the hard tuning work is done for emissions control.

Back to engine load, since it looks like we agree that MAP does measure load, lets stick to that. Again I pose the simple question:

An engine at 3000 rpm, air flow is 200 scfm.
Same engine at 6000 rpm, air flow is 200 scfm.

Would the intake manifold pressure (aka engine load) be greater at 3000 rpm or 6000 rpm?

 

I have a question: Can Jimbo scale timing by 37% to match the injectors?

 

Loren - starting trouble AGAIN!!!! I knew you would do it here, also.
I have your number, my friend. I had it last week. Cut the crap.

Also - TT could build you a 951 DME blindfolded with parts from his toaster, man. Don't you know who you are talking to????

 

Bravo

 

Yes load can be seen as torque. But the air flow signal should then be regarded as HP. The volt signal from a MAF represents mass/time or in another way energy/time=HP. To get load (torque) from the mass/time (energy/time) signal you have to multiply it with time. rpm is 1/time som if you take the flow signal (energy/time) and divide it with rpm (1/time) you get load (energy or torque).

Tomas

BTW, as already been pointed out, do a search on TT:s previous post before you question his Motronic knowledge.

 

Yes, by using 37% longer ignition wires!

 

When the DME uses the signal from the TPS as a switch (idle, partial, WOT) than a scale between 0 - 5V, would this mean that it's almost impossible to create a chip for a intake manifold with individual throttle bodies?

 

Thank you Tomas, that's a great solution

Now why didn't I think of it first

 

"Loren - starting trouble AGAIN!!!! I knew you would do it here, also.
I have your number, my friend. I had it last week. Cut the crap." - special tool -

Let's post somthing intelligent and/or make some contribution to the thread
instead of slams or post on the "other" forum with the other zeros!
I've yet to see any real technical knowledge expressed on any of your posts.
Are you capable, I doubt it based on what's been posted?

Again:

The state of NOT being at idle nor a WOT, does NOT provide any info to the 944 DME
as would a true TPS input (0-5 volts) input to the DME. The 968 has a true TPS
which can be used to further define points on a load map based on ANY value between
0-5 volts, not just at idle or WOT. The DME then "knows" what the actual throttle angles
are for ALL throttle positions.

That's the issue!

 

n engine at 3000 rpm, air flow is 200 scfm.
Same engine at 6000 rpm, air flow is 200 scfm.Would the intake manifold pressure (aka engine load) be greater at 3000 rpm or 6000 rpm?

Lorenfb, Answer the question

 

Again part throttle is a state the DME needs to be aware of. That state is information critical to the DME's operation. At part throttle, the throttle angle will be related to the intake manifold pressure and therefore Motronic load. The larger the throttle open angle, the larger the pressure for a given RPM. The larger the throttle open angle, the larger the load for a given RPM.

The 968 may get an angle related voltage input from a TPS just like the KLR, but in the end it still boils down to (even in the 968 Motronic and every other Motronic I have examined) idle, part throttle, and WOT. Those are the three basic Motronic operational states.

Sticking to the other issue at hand do you believe load is airflow and not airflow/rpm? I see no answer to my previous technical question.

 

Posted by Slow951: I have a question: Can Jimbo scale timing by 37% to match the injectors?

If TT is correct that load coincides with rpm. Than yes. When a maf meter and injectors are sized 37% larger you expand the 0 to 5 volt signal as well. It spreads out evenly from the center out. That's why the injector duty cycle drops and you could only go up to 72lb injectors. TT is doing the same thing. Just bypassing the afm conversion in the piggy back for a conversion on the chip. Thats why you also can't go past 72lb injectors. Get it john.

One thing TT and Lorenfb left out is that the dme reverts automatically to wot maps when rpm hits 5600. Not only when you are at 66% throttle.

 

Jimbo, you top them all!!