pcarphanatik

I bought my first 951 last Wednesday and I was happy until it came back from the inspection...

*SportHaus* – 9732 S. Virginia St. Reno, NV 89511

*Phone:* (775) 329-1447 *Contact:* Dolf - Service Department

VIN: WP0AA2950HN150460 197 Porsche 944 Turbo (951) – Red

Miles in: 112118 Miles out:112118 License Plate: CA 2DNZ938

*Boost gauge not working

*Front wheel bearings loose

*Transmission is non-turbo version and leaking at mainshaft seal

*Axles need repack

*Exhaust manifold cracked and leaking

*Oil pan gasket leaking

*Power steering hoses leaking

*Turbo leaking oil at center

*Spark plugs worn out

*Coolant over full

*Brakes ½ worn out front and rear

*Shocks worn

*Engine Compression

Test #1 – 90 (Down 20%)

Test #2 – 110

Test #3 – 110

Test #4 – 110 (Bleeds down to 100 in 5 min.)


I am most upset because I feel like I was professionally tricked. The technician even told me that it appeared that the engine bay and the car had been well cleaned to give the appearance of a reliable, well running vehicle. The car was just recently smogged and passed. The car has full maintenance records all the way back to the sell date. I bought from the second owner, an owner who has only had the car for 3mths and in that time performed all the "important" maintenance...belts, rollers, waterpump, etc. I even have the original window sticker and the historical documents from the same time period.

The buyer told me that the car was in great, immaculate running condition....which obviously; it is not! I asked him three days before purchasing the vehicle to have a PPI done. That I would even pay for the inspection. He sent an email saying that he had an inspection done and that the vehicle passed with flying colors. I asked him twice more on the day of purchase and he said the same...only that he had forgotten to include that paperwork in the records, and that he had forgotten the title. After purchase I did recieve the title in the mail...however I still haven't seen the reciept for the PPI.

I had the inspection done the day after purchase and sent the seller an email regarding the situation. I have also called him 4 times asking for negotiation.
On monday I will be sending him a formal letter asking for a fair resolution to this matter. I purchased the vehicle through craigslist and have informed them of the situation; they replied that they will help in any way possible.

Payment was in the form of a cashier's check and I would declare it stolen, but I am not sure how that would work out....and I know that it SHOULD be easier to find a solution privately.

Is there any other recourse I can take in this matter besides calling my lawyer and taking this individual to court???

I understand the principle of buyer-beware, but this experience has been truly frustrating and dissapointing!

Dal Heger

I would have done the PPI anyway before I bought it. Sorry to sound like a jerk, but it IS buyer beware!

All in all, other than the non-turbo tranny (did they tell you which one it was?) and the compression numbers of cyl #1, the rest sounds like minor maintenance items.

The loose front bearings on these cars are common, and can be repacked and set to the correct specs in less than 30 minutes. The axles usually need to be replaced at that mileage, normal wear item, the exhaust headers usually crack and can be taken off and welded. The worn spark plugs??? well that's a no brainer, for less than $20 YOU can replace them. Coolant over full?? WHO CARES? That's why it's an OVERFLOW tank. The oil leaks are typical of this age car. The brakes and shocks are wear items. It gives you an opportunity to upgrade!

Sorry, but I don't see a major reason for your to be upset, except for the tranny issue and potentially the compression issue on cyl#1. Those come under the caveat emptor clause.

I'm no lawyer, but I don't think you have a leg to stand on legally. It's an old car, most likely driven hard all of it's life. Should have done the PPI before handing over the check.

Dal. <=- currently rebuilding a 170k mile turbo engine.

User 41221

I disagree with Dal in that I think you have every right to be mad, but you can only blame yourself if you don't do a PPI prior to purchase, unless you make arrangements on what happens if the car doesn't pass the PPI .

I would be concerned about the compression readings and think you need to do a leakdown test to figure out whats really going on inside the engine. One thing, make sure the tech that did the compression test pulled the DME relay and blocked open the throttle plate, or the readings probably weren't valid. I'd dig into that very soon tho.

Regards,

stonecreek

What did you pay for the car?
Sorry your not happy.
I got my 951 last year. My first Porche was a 90 944S2 RIP, no one told me to check the damn timing chain, I replaced all the belts right away 1700 miles latter Boom timing chain failure. Wow are S2 heads rare and expensive to repair, I sold it and took a $1500 loss, not to bad I did drive it for half a year.

I have slowly been upgrading and reparing my 86 951, I got so lucky, the guy who sold it to me own's a large auto detailing shop, this thing is in better shape than my wifes 2004 Expediton.

Good Luck. 951

ehall

Sorry man. Dal is right though. Everything listed, except for the tranny, and leak down, are normal for our cars at this age. These cars are expensive to get right, but once you get them right, they are easy to keep that way. I hope you didn't pay too much. Good luck, most of this stuff you can do yourself, pretty easily.

special tool

And I am going to say that YOUR shop is trying to rip you off. First - it runs well.


They did that comp. check with the engine stone cold - I would PUT $1000 on it. And what the hell kind of comp. check guage shows leaKAGE?????? BULL****. Did he do a leakdown at the same time??

All 951 power steering hoses leak, it is probably a loose clamp under the resy, which a thief wouldn't tell you.

The turbo is not leaking, it is just the drain seal, but it is a bitch to change out. Drive it until it leaks very badly.

The exhaust is costing you 400 rpm spoolup. It should be $65 to weld them up. (just had it done this week)

Drive your car, man. Take it to someone who isn't trying to retire on you.

ehall

"And I am going to say that YOUR shop is trying to rip you off. First - it runs well.


They did that comp. check with the engine stone cold - I would PUT $1000 on it. And what the hell kind of comp. check guage shows leaKAGE?????? BULL****. Did he do a leakdown at the same time??

All 951 power steering hoses leak, it is probably a loose clamp under the resy, which a thief wouldn't tell you.

Drive your car, man. Take it to someone who isn't trying to retire on you."

special tool

No really, I don't like guys who do that ****.

"Sport haus" yeah, yeah how about "****haus"

ehall

"No really, I don't like guys who do that ****."

Really? I thought you were ambiguously HIDING some anger towards gouging mechanics. I could never have been able to tell what you REALLY meant! I agree! I switched because a guy didn't realize that I had my car in the shop to do work that I had already figured out, but didn't have time for. I wanted to see if he was honest, so I didn't tell him what was wrong. BTW, his list was worth about four hundred extra in parts alone. LOL Blown heater hose, (nope just had it fixed the month before, along with the entire cooling system, T-belt, pulleys, water pump, everything. All but the overflow tank, which had a pinhole leak. Guess what he never found? Yep the pinhole leak. I drips if it is not running. Hard to find huh? It was the only thing that needed to be done. Should take 30 minutes max, but I don't have a private garage to work in, and I'm extremely busy, so I figured even a half assed honest mech could handle it. Nope. So yes, I got it. lol

pcarphantick, the moral to the stoiry is that you had better read up, buy some tools, and ask questions here first. It will save you thousands of dollars. BTW, weren't you a bit suspicious of the idea that the car would have the wrong tranny, if you have all of the docs, including window sticker. Was this done at the Porsche dealer? If it was cancer wouldn't you get another opinion? The horse has left the barn on the purchase, but get a second (good) opinion about the real condition before you go after the PO. again good luck, and feel free to ask all the questions you want around here. Someone here could possibly even know something about that car. You never know.

alexands

You bought a 16-18 year old inexpensive Porsche. These are normal things for these cars, or any car this age. I think every person considering purchasing a 951 should look themselves in the mirror and ask "Can I turn a wrench well enough to fix this car myself?" Alternativly, you could ask "Do I have unlimited funds to pay a Porsche house to do the work?" If the answer to either of these questions is "YES" then buy it. Otherwise RUN!!!

So many people make the mistake of buying a $7000 Porsche to get into the "Porsche" club and then find out that the parts and maintenance costs on these cars are the exact same as the $100,000 Porsches. Except, because these cars are 16-18 years old they need ALOT of it.

"There's nothing more expensive than an inexpensive Porsche" we like to say.

PorscheDoc

Yup, should have gotten a PPI, but that is water under the bridge now. Most of those items stated are normal wear items on a 20 year old vehicle, nothing to be worried about. You can pick up a used turbo tranny for under 500 bucks, so that isnt a big deal. All of the other items you mentioned (besides the compression) you can do yourself easily, for probably 500 bucks or so, and a couple days labor. I have done everything on that list, and it isnt hard, in fact most are so easy it isnt funny. I would get someone else to do a compression check and a leakdown test. HYM8NC had a PPI done on his car that he was selling, came back with about the same numbers...from a reputable shop. He had it done a second time else where, and the numbers came back 150 across the board.

Here's my next question for you...and you should be more concerned about this....when was the timing belt and clutch done?

pcarphanatik

special tool: Thanks for the advice! I will go ahead and drive the vehicle!

You're right, the service manager gave me the, "damage is more extensive than value of the car" line.

I am no stranger to a wrench, their report just gave me that gut-twisting sensation where I felt that I shouldn't invest anymore time/money into the car.

karl2bdc: timing belt, rollers, waterpump, and clutch were all done about 12,000mi back according to the service records.


I knew I should have had the ppi done on my terms , but with all the documentation and records I felt confident at the time of purchase. I don't feel like the seller was dishonest...maybe ignorant to some of the problems. He did put brand new tires on the car the same day of purchase, a second set of phone dials with tires, a set of 200lb weltmeister springs for the front and an extra oil filter.

Thanks for the advice,...and the flames

special tool

Just so you know - I was flaming ****haus, not you

Dal Heger

Just drive the car. There is nothing wrong with it that a few more lbs of boost won't fix!

I'm really interested on how they found out it wasn't a turbo tranny. What code is on the transaxle? Oh yea, and I have yet to see a transaxle NOT leak from the flange seals. Don't worry about it.

Nothing on that list would even phase me from taking that car on a 1000 mile roadtrip.

Dal.

sweanders

You bought a used car, things get worn when being used and if they do replace them. The only thing I find a bit odd is that the boost gauge isn't working and the tranny being an N/A one, I wonder if the tranny really is from an N/A....