GWTurboS

I think the line of reasoning here is that air/water requires another cooler (aka the heat exchanger) to be plumbed into the system. In addition, you would need a small reservoir and a pump. If your heat exchanger is not very efficient at lowering the temperature of the cooling liquid, then your intercooler core is not going to cool down the air charge very much.

I've had some decent results with the Aquamist water injection system on a non-intercooled supercharged 2.0L 4 cylinder application. While it really wasn't a very good substitute for a proper intercooler, it did cool the intake charge down enough to prevent detonation at high rpm/load. The result was minimal timing retard from the ECU.

Greg W.

Mike1982

The crank case breather option, how do I go about getting one? What does it take to install? What does it do??.. I have heard of it before but really don't know what it does. Where are good places to get the parts?

Red1

I used this one:

http://www.lindseyracing.com/Merchan...e=BREATHERTANK

There are others, but this one works for me.

When you hook it up, and see how the original system was designed, you'll appreciate the heat you'll be taking out of your intake charge.

toddk911

"Air/water is less efficient, due to there being an additional heat transfer introduced into the system. The thermodynamic equation then has to run twice."

This might be the case, but nothing has a higher latent heat evaporation rate then water.

Sam Lin

Sure, when the water's cold nothing cools the intake air as much as an air/water interface. After a while of driving and the water heats up to charge temp, the water/ambient radiator then has to dump the heat and that transfer is no faster than the air/air transfer.

Drastically simplified: You take charge heat and put 80% of it into the water from the first heat transfer. (since you cannot have a perfectly efficient transfer) You then need to dump that heat to ambient air, and again, you cannot get 100% transfer, so you dump another 80% to ambient. The middle medium (the water in this case) is always stuck with some leftover heat, and after a bit of driving, the heat builds to where it's the same temp as the charge air. At that point it's doing NOTHING except being a restriction - that's the reason road racers don't run air/water ICs. Drag racers love them - ice down the water and you get even greater heat transfer in the first transfer, and you ignore the second transfer since you run for 1/4 mile + return road - 1 minute or 2 at a time total.

Sam

Darius Juca

I agree with Sam Lin..Lotus used air to water intercolers in their early Espirit SE and S4S but later dropped it if I am not mistaken..but however after a while of driving the temperature can only be dropped so much and it's by outside air..granted..at lower temps since we are at speed but where an IC just cooles directly ,an air to water would have to have a more complex system to achieve same results and still there would be no way it would be cooler since both are cooled by same air tem..just not efficient and worth it..however if water is cold or..cooled by co2 and other sources...very nice but not practical for everyday use..The only advantage tot eh water is the it's a VERY GOOD cooler when it its cold!! better than air!!

ABOUT the breather..how how or how much hot air does the crank case breather add?

Red1

How hot is your oil? Think about it - you're venting the crank case. It's hot, and it's connected to your intake boot 2" in front of the turbo.

Darius Juca

surebut what I really meant to ask was..how much is it pulling...I thought it really acted more like a crank case presure relief aid..since the hole in the air oil is so small.....besides I am thinking of using the stock set up with a filter an catch can combo..better than lindsey way and more venting..have to research more though.

Red1

Well, details like that I'm a little unsure on. What I can tell you though is that breather gets hot - I leaned on it once right after driving, and it was pretty hot.

I just look at it as a source of heat that I could remove without too much trouble. I didn't do it for purposes of heat removal, so I just look at it as a bonus.

That would be a good study though. A before/after test of intake air temps after installation of a breather tank, to see what/if any difference it would make.

Mike1982

I would like to see that test done. I am looking at getting that fresh air in so any degrees will help.

UK952

I was thinking the same about a filter in that breather line - Its right in front of the turbo and the metal pipe gets full of rust and carbon. It wouldn't take a very large piece to scrap the turbo. There isn't much space to work with though. I guess a combined /cooler catch can would make it complete.

Tony

Darius Juca

my guess is the problem is not the hot air amout but rather the content..oil vapors..wich can be filtered so the remaining air would give us really insignificant problem. now to fing good ways to vent...

Matt H

much cheaper than 2k would be to vent the nose panel and add intercooler "ducting".

What are you talking about?
Vented nose panel - free (thanks Brian)
Paint and body work to repair previous shotty body work - 150 dollars
IC ducting - 25 dollars (could have been done cheaper but I purchased an older SFR used setup

Total - 175.00

If you want a big intercooler then dump the AC and add a giant FMIC. Call Tim at SFR they have one ready to go. Have seen it in person, never lusted after an intercooler before that day. Still dont think it is necessary on a mostly stock car.
__________________
Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote

Tomas L

Maybe, but your missing one important advantage.
Water is perhaps ten times more effective as a cooling media. When you us a air/water IC it can be made much smaller than an air/air IC and yet give better cooling and lower pressure drop. This allows for easier IC mounting and shorter connecting tubing, thus reducing intake pipe volume.
In a car run only for short bursts it's possible to use a small secondary water cooler combined with sufficient water volume.
For a track car and other cars that se high load for longer duration the water cooler has to be larger. Due to the ease of routing water pipes, compared to running the intake pipes, it's possible to mount the watercooler in any possition where there is room and adequate air flow. You can even divide it in several separate smaller coolers.

I have not seen any pressure drop and cooling data for our stock IC so it's hard to tell how efficient it is. Improving the IC is costly and may not be the most hp per dollar but as Duke says, it's power gain with no downsides.

Tomas

poormans9fitty1

If you are looking to get a colder intake system with a maf, then look at lindsey racings maf trap and headlight duct. I have the headlight duct and it is very functional and looks great.