I am building a 1987 944 for track purpose only..I can't seem to find info on the headers available and the advantages they bring... The car will have some porting on the head and intake manifold, a bored throttle body, ligthened crank & flywheel and balance shafts are gone.

anybody have experience with headers and exhaust sizes/lengths ???

 

Bursch are good for low and midrange power, great for tight tracks or auto crossing, the MSDS are good high end power..the stockers...well...they are stock and they work.

On our NA we started with stockers on our 3.1 liter, then went to Bursch...wanted more and installed the MSDS. The NA runs on some pretty big tracks so top end is needed. We are very happy with MSDS.

I threw an MSDS and a BURSCH on a couple motors for you to see the difference.

<img src="http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/headers.JPG" alt=" - " />

MSDS is a 4 into 1 header, with a larger exit diameter than the Bursch.

Hope this helps a little.

Take Care

 

Thanks John,

That is the kind of info I was looking for... The car will be dedicated to track use and we run on a mix of small and long tracks... I think I will go for the MSDS.

I do have another question for you John.. what do you recomend as far as chip in the car with the mods listed ?? or will a stock chip and increased fuel pressure be good ??I have to kep the DME for this year ... for financial reasons ....

Thx ..

Michel.

 

Ditch the chips...I haven't really seen any great chip for the NA. Most say they are good for raising the rpm limit, but thats about it. If you plan to do some internal mods, then yes...it might do you good.

We ran our Racer NA for two races last year using the stock chips and stock airflow system, we only added an adjustable fpr...the engine was a 3.1 liter 14 to 1 compression...it worked fine. But more power did come from MAF, added later. Still running the stock chips though.

Take Care!

 

John,
Are you guys bringing the 3.1 ltr to WS? I've got to check that thing out.
Paul

 

I've had a Bursch header owner look at my MSDS and wished he had bought MSDS when he saw the quality difference. You might think of getting it Jet coated to keep it looking good over the long term. If you're not building the car for a specific class, the extra R's can come in useful when you can hold 3rd or 4th gear rather than upshift. You'll never feel extra power from the chip on a NA. PS: The MSDS isn't a bolt in, you need to do a little welding where it mates to the cat bypass.

 

Paul,

The yellow car will not make it. We decided that I will just put the hours in the Red car to make the event. Believe me, I want the Yellow car out there, but I still have about 30 hours of labor to complete it. I'm still hanging wide body panels on the Red Car and will also need to finish up the finer details to get it completely ready for the weekend.

Take Care!

 

Do you by chance have any info on Billy Boat headers? or ever thought of fab. your own?

 

Any dyno charts of stock, MSDS or Bursch back to back? GRM did a test and I think the gain was around a hp or so.
Paul

 

The interesting thing is both headers basically look the same except for the collectors.

In theory, the Bursch should have less overall power, but a wider power band and the MSDS should have a narrower powerband but more overall power. In theory.

This is because the Bursch is a 4-2-1 and the MSDS is a 4-1. With a 4-2-1 you get two resonance points due to the two separate pulse merge points. But, because there are two, they aren't as strong overall as a single one.

I'm still interested in hearing about a dyno test of the Stahl header. Everyone tells me it's the best, but at double the price, I'd have to have proof. Jon Milledge specifies a custom-made header and specifies the lengths of all the tubes. This is a result of dyno testing. He seems to feel all the commercially available headers for the NA 944 are junk.

 

stahlheader.com

 

No dyno charts that I could see.

 

Thank's to everyone for the info...
for now I will moount the stock header with a 2..25"straight pipe to the rear...

will look at the upgrade later as I do more work on the rest of the engine... i'd be interested in seing dyno sheets as well..

have a good day ...

 

I ran my spec car for a while with stock headers and a 2.25 dia straight pipe. It was fine, but quite loud. I since have put the stock muffler back in but left the cat off. It is much quiter and more pleasant in the car. I have not noticed any change in power as a result.

I believe Paul did some dyno work with stock muffler vs test pipe only (no pipe after test pipe) and found no measureable change in hp.

 

We took a factory exhaust and cut it off before the cat. Nada!
I will sell the pipe if anyone wants it. Same for a early DME with WILK chip, cone filter with 944 n/a adaptor.
Paul