Don Carter

I'm trying to remove my CIS injectors tonight to test them. Any tips? I tried putting a deep 12mm socket on one, but the injector quickly jumped a notch in it's hex socket in the injector holder.

Is it best to just pull them out instead of trying to remove the injector holder? If so, is it tough to get them back in place? I sprayed the holder threads with WD40 a couple of days ago but I don't think there's any hope of getting them out.

(this is one the 81 euro)

Dennis Wilson

Don,

The rubber seal in the holder is large and compressed. If you pull the injector out, in all probability you will still need to remove the holder to get the injector back in. If the seal has hardened, pulling the injector will also necessitate a new seal. I would use a pair of pliers or channel locks to loosen the holder as you turn the injector. You can cover the holder with a shop rag to keep from scarring it.

Dennis

Gregg K

Don, I'm thinking of doing this tomorrow as well. Guess I should have ordered seals first.
I'd run the engine for a while first and get it warmed up. That seems to work with other difficult threaded fasteners. Might help. Tapping it with a punch might also aid. It's aluminum on aluminum. And unless the last person working on it used antiseize, it's probabaly pretty well stuck.

Don Carter

Running the engine sounds like a good idea, just one problem....it doesn't currently run. I'll try the channel lock idea. I'd rather not replace the seals if I don't have to.

Gregg K

Quick update. The first injector popped right out. The screw-in caps are steel. I used a T handle for my wrench, and used a standard socket. I guess a deep socket might be smart if it's really stuck. I had to machine a special fitting for the fuel injector gas line, but it wasn't much work.
The good news is that the first injector I tested had a horrible pattern, and only opened at 80 psi. Yippee! Thus my poor starting and prolly low power. I hope.
I just fill my contraption with fuel, and turn up the regulator until it sprays. Pretty easy way to do it.

Well, seven came out. One wasn't screwed in, and was finger tight. One didn't come out. After using the prybar method, I pulled the last injector, and now have to unscrew the stuck cap.
What I noticed is that 12 mm is a little less than 1/2". So I'm going to grab a 1/2" hex bar out of the secret steel supply out in one of the barns, and file it down to 12mm. Fingers are crossed. Hope this last one comes out...

Gregg K

Oops, nope. Won't come out. It's rusted and corroded. Took the old pneumatic approach. That's the best, and usually only, way to remove old stuck stuff.

Don Carter

So you were able to unscrew 7 out of 8 using only a 12mm socket on the injector? I don't think that's going to work on any of mine. Got side tracked on other projects today, but might try again tomorrow.

Don Carter

Gregg,

Just looked at your pictures again. I'm pretty sure my injector holders are larger and aluminum, maybe because it's a euro. I think steel holders would be much easier to remove. I tried grabbing mine with channel locks, but there's not much room to get a good grip on it.

Generally speaking these cars are fun cars to work on, but this injector setup just seems like very poor design. How hard would it have been to make it hex shaped instead of round?

Gregg K

Don, I know there's no room to grab those injector holders. And in order to take an impact wrench to it, I had to pull the injector out. And that's not easy. The injector has carbon deposits on the inside of the manifold. So pulling is made difficult. I was worried about breaking the injector, I had to force it so hard. I think it's important to get the caps off, since they have a rubber seal inside. And they will be hardened. So they will have manifold leaks. I grabbed the injector with visegrips and then used a prybar to pry up on the visegrip. I think an impact with a hex is the only way to unscrew those caps. There's really no alternative. Even if you just want to test the injectors, you've got to get them out somehow. Now here's an idea that I'd only use as a last resort- break the injectors off at the base of the screw caps, and carefully carefully punch the injector down enough to get a hex into the cap, and then use an impact wrench. I doubt the injector would fall into the manifold, as it's a pretty tight fit on the rubber, but just be aware that this method does have that danger. Goooood luck.

jpitman2

If you get brutal, and pull the injector out through the runner seal, check down the inlet port for debris coming off the rubber. Mine were VERY hard, and despite being able to get the alloy carrier thing out complete with injector, I did find some rubber bits down on the valves. Vacuum cleaner nozzle down the port should get most crap out.
jp 83 Euro S, BTDT

Dennis Wilson

On my 78 euro they were steel. The injector should be far enough in that the hex part of the injector meshes with the hex hole of the sleeve. On my euro, 2 of the sleeves rounded when I tried the 12mm socket on the injector. They finally came out with pliers or channel locks (case of CRS here) and a lot of PB Blaster. BTW 928 International had new replacement sleeves.

Dennis

Don Carter

Looks like my injector holders are definately aluminum, and there doesn't seem to be much hope of getting them out. The metal is so soft, grabbing them with plyers or channel locks and turning just chews up the metal.

I'm thinking my best bet may be to remove all the tubes (surprisingly easy) and test/clean the injectors while still installed in the tube. Judging from the one I've removed, there's quite a bit of carbon build up to remove. Might as well polish the tubes while I have them off.

I have a feeling this is going to snowball....

Gregg K

Oops. I forgot about that approach. Just pull the intake runners. Novel concept. Sure makes accessibility easy. I have a feeling new injectors are on your shopping list. That looks like a crudded up mess.
Have fun.

Lizard928

the only thing I can think of to try is one of those rubber band wrenches as follows on the soft part and a wrench on injector

http://www.canadiantire.ca/assortmen...=1066873532081

Don Carter

Finally got around to testing the injector pictured above. When connected to the fuel line, it definately leaked. 3 or 4 tiny streams of gas. I couldn't get any gas to spray when pushing on the throttle plate, but that could be a pressure problem elsewhere.

I blew some carb cleaner through with compressed air, and tried to blow some in the reverse direction to clean the screen inside, but I don't see how that can work since the injector doesn't seem to open from that direction. Also soaked the entire end of the intake tube in a carb dip solution.

The good news is that when I blew carb cleaner through with compressed air I got a perfect fine mist just like a spray can, and an interesting sound(bzzzzz). It took 55psi to get it to open. Is that a good indicator of the gas pressure that would make it open? PSI is PSI right?

Next I'll hook it back up to the car and try to get it to spray that way.