george928

If I purchase a relay from a vendor advertised as being "Made in Germany" I expect it to be Made in Germany and NOT Made in China.

928 Motorsports said they could no longer get the German made relays and would refund my purchase price including return shipping after I sent it back.

This was my first order with them, not happy with such retail fraud. Update your website!

George

MainePorsche

Carl did offer to make the refund.
Busy people do make oversights.

SeanR

Considering everything is now made in China (mostly) I'd not get too upset. Sounds like Carl did the right thing for an upset customer though. I'd hardly call it fraud.

george928

I would, not like there's thousands of these things flying out the door. Simple, update the website and stop advertising it as "Made in Germany"..... easy as that. This market is not THAT big. A vendor knows what' s on their website and knows what they can and can no longer get as advertised. I learned my lesson, call and ask what's in stock and what will specifically be shipped to me.

snoz

Fraud is a bit strong don't you think? I'm no lawyer but I believe it requires intent. I don't personally know Carl, but I seriously doubt he intended to mislead you.

hacker-pschorr

It's a relay and you got a full refund, end of story. Please stop trying to make this into something that it isn't.


I'm still trying to figure this one out....was the box made in Germany???


-

Leon Speed

Retail fraud

You got a refund, all is good.

george928

I agree, fraud was a bit strong a term and I apologize, I was still sold an advertised product but received something inferior. No different then buying a Sennheiser/Nuemann Mic online only to receive a China knockoff. Again the 928 market is not a huge market and vendors know what they have in stock, I'll leave it at that.

Hacker, I simply shared with the community my experience. Your photo is totally out of context, who is making something out of nothing now? I appreciate it when someone posts their experiences both good and bad. My experience this time was not so good.

G

MainePorsche

G,
You're point appreciated.
Carl has been here for for a long time, and I'm sure he had no mal-intent. He will appreciate, and honor, your concern.

george928

Hacker, I simply shared with the community my experience. Your photo is totally out of context. Who's making something out of nothing now?

If you can't figure this out have a look at the first photo, the replay was made in China. I appreciate it when someone posts their experiences both good and bad. My experience this time was not so good.

G

george928

Thanks...

hacker-pschorr

No, that is not the same thing. You simply don't understand how the automotive parts business works.

If the relay Carl sold is the acceptable substitute from the OE/OEM etc.. manufacturer, it's considered the same thing.

A quick check over on Pelican shows...yup... the exact same relay:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/..._pg2.htm#item9

"Made In China" - that tells me this is the acceptable substituent for the OE unit that came with your car when it was new.

If you brought your 928 into the dealership and that relay was the fix for your problem, guess what, they would gladly install the China relay without question if that came up in the parts database.


Which is fine and appreciated. Accusing Carl of fraud is where the line was crossed that got everyone worked up.

We have many threads informing the members of various parts that are now showing up on parts shelves from questionable sources.
However, we don't (usually) accuse the vendors of these pieces as being fraudulent.

It's the exact same scenario, actually worse.
Did you see on the box: "Germany we produce quality".
For the longest time, FEBI parts were shipped in this box which indicated German quality....made in... etc... Now they just slap a "Made In China" sticker on them.
Order 10 of these and some may or may not have that China sticker....where were they made? Who knows.
These are coming from the largest distributor of European parts worldwide, not some rinky dink outfit.

I even have parts with similar markings on the box for German with "Made in France" sticker on the box, only to find a "Made in China" on the actual part.

It's getting really confusing....

MainePorsche

Good to see you won't lurk.

DKWalser

G - I think you're the one who missed Hacker's point. He ordered a part and the box it came in indicates the part was made in both China and Germany. That's simply an indication of how difficult it can be for a retailer to keep track of such things. Your tone indicates that you think this is a huge deal -- that its awfully close to fraud if not the real thing. Hacker's photo indicates that it might have been nothing more than Carl's supplier switching sources without notifying him.

Carl's a stand up guy. He's earned a reputation of honesty and doing right by his customers. He's offered to refund your money. I'm not sure what you expect him to have done differently. All companies make mistakes. All fail to update their websites or make other errors that lead to misunderstandings. What matters is how the companies address such inevitable situations. By that standard, your experience is helpful -- Carl's the kind of guy I'd like to do business with. Thanks for sharing a good outcome.

dr bob

The idea is that name-brand manufacturers write standards and specs when they go out for manufacturing bids. So long as the parts meet the manufacturers' specs, the flag flying over the factory doesn't really affect the suitability of the part.

Problems arise when a low-quality part masquerades as a known high-quality part by using a prominent manufacturer's name on the packaging or advertising. I think some good examples here are some of the knockoff water pumps, fuel pumps, fuses, etc.

Our known sponsors/vendors here have been religious about avoiding the mislabeled knockoffs. But when they buy a Genuine Bosch relay from a known good channel supplier, they (and we) might have a tough time arguing that a spec part made in X country is any better or worse than the same spec'd part made in C country.

My too sense.