rse

Hello,
I've been reading lots of threads and learning everything I know about cars from them, since I never worked on a car before. Thanks for all the info!
I'd like some advice on my car with what I think is a gap between the cylinder head and valve cover. I can't find any information in the manuals about how to remove the air intakes, if that's what I need to do next.
It's on my 86.5 which I only drove for 10-15 minutes before putting it on jacks for a timing belt change. I'll appreciate any help to get the car on the road. Thanks,Ron.

Avar928

Why do you need to remove the valve covers first? If you do, you need to replace the gaskets.

The air intakes are the two long black plastic tubes, one each on the sides of the engine. They pull right off. Dislodge where it connects to the bridge on top of the radiator and pop it off the air box. The air box itself is held by 4 straps. Undo and take the top off.

Replace the air filter with an OEM Mahle filter, if it hasn't been done already. The lower air half is held down by two nuts, Temp I sensor which wiggles free from connection, a hose on the passenger side which feeds to the air pump valve thing that also wiggles free, and also by the Mass Air Flow sensor via a rubber boot which is clamped. Take a long screw driver and a flashlight and look for the clamp screw through the intake organ pipes to loosen it from the MAF...or if you can't find it then you can just firmly pull the whole thing out with the MAF.

Valve cover is held on by...12 bolts? 86.5 has S4-esque bolts which are a lot trickier (requires hex key or bit) and harder to work with than early '86 ones. More prone to rounding out the inside or breaking so be careful.

Buy everything from Roger at 928 RUS, PelicanParts, 928MS or 928Intl.

Can't go wrong with any of them.

dr bob

RSE:

Post a picture of the gap you are concerned about. Any gap between the head and the valve cover will leak oil profusely, so lets make sure you are going after a 'problem' that is actually a problem.

Avar928

He said it's on his 86.5.

Yea, post pictures.

James Bailey

You might want to do some reading about the cam housing covers and how the 85-86 used short bolts which thread into the heads of bolts. They very often break off if you attempt to tighten (to try to stop a leak) or remove to install new gaskets...once broken off in the heads it can be nearly impossible to remove and since it is very hard to get the heads off of the 85-86 (has head studs not bolts like the 87 > ) you end up pulling the engine out of the car......

If as you stated .." since I never worked on a car before." this could become a really big job

syoo8

Hi Ron,

I just did this job so it is fresh in my memory.

1) Can you post pictures? The experts can be much more helpful with pictures. (I am not one of the experts.)

2) When you mean air intakes, do you mean the intake tubes that funnel air into the air filter? Or the intake runners (the magnesium tubes that you see when you open the hood?)

3) What brought you to the conclusion that you need to remove the "air intakes?"

17prospective buyer

You're going to learn a lot about everything... that's all I can say. Plan on doing way more stuff, and buying way more stuff than you first thought. It's old, everything that isn't metal needs replacing.

Avar928

And the stuff that is metal needs extensive cleaning or powder coating so plan on spending money doing that too.

You will be happy when you see all the new tools you purchased. I know I am.

SteveG

Stop. Read the New Visitor thread at the top. Get the WSM on CD.
Bag your nuts and various parts and label them. You may also want to tape and number bolts and draw a diagram of where they came out. Porsche is notorious for using different size bolts on the same part, by that I mean, if there are 4 bolts holding it, 3 might be different lengths. It could be weeks or months before you are putting them back. I don't know about you, but I need all the help I can get when it comes to putting things back together.

You said you have read a lot, maybe you have done all this. Welcome and good luck.

Avar928

Steve has great advice. Diagramming or labeling bolts gets you far especially when you do the timing belt and especially when you do the water pump.

I thought I could just bag them by what part they went to and commit location all to memory. I was wrong. Spent more time looking for threads on which bolt size goes wear than installing them.

Wisconsin Joe

One trick for bolts and their locations is to take a large cardboard box, draw the part with the bolt holes on the box, poke holes where the bolts go and place each bolt in the correct hole. You can put several parts on a decent sized box. Once the entire side of the box is filled, you can then cut off the opposite side and tape it over the top, locking all the bolts in place.

rse

Thanks for all the replies. I'll post some pictures as soon as I can. I did read about the bolts going thru other bolts... so I'm hoping to find any way
around that if possible. I'm just getting to know what's what on an engine - got some basic mechanic's school books, and this website. The "air intake" I'm
thinking about is the magnesium tubes that you see when you open the hood. I don't know why I said "air intakes", I was thinking "intake manifolds", sorry.
From what I can tell, the gap between parts is in between a section right under the tubes and the cylinder head. I can only see it from under the car
looking up. I have the 86 "Katalog" file which really helps me see all the engine parts, and a WSM - also PC files. The WSM assumes I know much more
than I do, so it's not very helpful sometimes.
I'm in the middle of a timing belt change. Lots of ziplock bags and tons of pics. Got everything off - except the water pump - and got some new parts for the tensioner. I don't think I'll
change the water pump until I'll have to. When it does go bad, it's not catastrophic is it?
Also, if it's alright to keep asking questions in the same thread, I got the impression that the timing belt rollers - except for the main tensioning one -
dont need to be changed if they are in half decent shape as they're not in use most of the time. Any thoughts on these and the pump? - I'm trying to
keep my costs down for a while but I REALLY WANT TO DRIVE SOON.....

jcorenman

Pulling the cam covers (valve covers) is not generally needed except for serious leaks. It is also not easy, so don't dive in there unless you need to. Pics will probably answer the "gap" question.

And you are correct that the WSM is written for trained techs, new to the 928. So it skips all the basic stuff. The best reference is probably Dwayne's writeups, here:
http://dwaynesgarage.norcal928.org/

Find the "1987 Timing Belt and Water Pump Procedure" procedure, written for an '87 but most stuff is the same. Very detailed with lots of pic's and good info.

It can be, because the WP pulley also acts as an idler for the timing belt. So if the WP bearings fail then that can take out the TB also. WP's typically fail because of coolant leakage past the seal, which wrecks the bearings. Seals can fail simply from age, so it is not uncommon for WP bearings to fail after the car has sat for a while and then starts getting driven again.

So unless you know the history of the WP it is probably worth changing at this time. The alternative is leave it, and monitor carefully for funny bearing-type noises and be ready to dive back in when needed (and don't stray far from home). Laso pumps are the best option- moderately priced (compared to factory) and good history. Stay away from the cheap pumps on eBay, it would be better to stick with what you have.

Most folks would probably recommend changing the main tension roller with every belt change, but depending on miles I think it is OK to reuse if it rotates smoothly and quietly. It is a larger bearing than the WP, and not subject to seal failure. The idlers are OK to reuse if they are quiet and smooth. The little one under the crank gets dirty but is usually OK when cleaned up.

James Bailey

Ah "...I don't think I'll
change the water pump until I'll have to. When it does go bad, it's not catastrophic is it ? "....

Sadly, YES it can be. If it seizes the belt starts sliding as it uses the smooth backside to drive the water pump....it quickly gets way too hot both engine and the waterpump pulley. So you shut it down and the rubber belt vulcanizes to the pulley. After the engine cools down the normal response is to crank the motor which breaks the belt and scrambles all the valves on the 32 valve engines.

How many miles years on the current pump ??

rse

Yes, working on the cam covers is definitely something I don't want to do. But, let's see what the pics show you.
I appreciate the feedback on the water pump & idler rollers. I'll have to change the pump. I'll go for a Laso pump. Thanks for the rec. ;
I did get a new tensioner roller (and more), and I have been using Dwayne's writeups and a couple of others I found.

About my car: I've had it on jacks shamefully for 3 years. It's my first 928. It's an automatic 86.5 and has 103,000 miles on it. The engine coating is peeling
somewhat on top.The rest is covered with A LOT of oily grime, but the only obvious oil leak is around the top of the engine.
No other leaks elsewhere, except some from the PS rack - not the hoses.
The interior is in very good shape. The ride was pretty solid, no rattles all over the place.
It sounded good when idling and when cruising, and with some acceleration (but I've only driven it 15 mins or so).
The transmission needs some TLC 'cause it had a kick when shifting.
Ron