Need Help Chasing a Battery Drain
10-29-2009, 12:51 AM
#31
Burning Brakes
If the description is correct and the wire from teh starter that goes to the alternator is not connected to anything, except the other start cable, when you have the drain, the problem is in the cable from the starter to the alternator. If however you have the wire tha goes from the starter to the alternator, still connected to the wire that leads to the jumper post you need to determine if the drain goes away when you seperate the two wires at the alternator.
If you have the wires disconnected at the jump post then there is no powe getting to the fuse panel and pulling fuses and relays will not make any difference.
If you have the wires disconnected at the jump post then there is no powe getting to the fuse panel and pulling fuses and relays will not make any difference.
10-29-2009, 11:12 AM
#32
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If the description is correct and the wire from teh starter that goes to the alternator is not connected to anything, except the other start cable, when you have the drain, the problem is in the cable from the starter to the alternator. If however you have the wire tha goes from the starter to the alternator, still connected to the wire that leads to the jumper post you need to determine if the drain goes away when you seperate the two wires at the alternator.
If you have the wires disconnected at the jump post then there is no powe getting to the fuse panel and pulling fuses and relays will not make any difference.
If you have the wires disconnected at the jump post then there is no powe getting to the fuse panel and pulling fuses and relays will not make any difference.
There is a wire that goes from the battery to the starter directly. A
There is another wire that goes from the starter to the alternator. B
There is another wire on the alternator that goes to the jump post. C
If AB is connected, and BC is disconnected, then the problem is in wire B, however if AB and BC are both still connected, than the problem can not be isolated until BC is disconnected, so disconnecting BC is my current goal in isolating it in the wiring between the starter and the alternator.
10-29-2009, 02:28 PM
#33
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OKay so let me try to get all this
There is a wire that goes from the battery to the starter directly. A
There is another wire that goes from the starter to the alternator. B
There is another wire on the alternator that goes to the jump post. C
If AB is connected, and BC is disconnected, then the problem is in wire B, however if AB and BC are both still connected, than the problem can not be isolated until BC is disconnected, so disconnecting BC is my current goal in isolating it in the wiring between the starter and the alternator.
There is a wire that goes from the battery to the starter directly. A
There is another wire that goes from the starter to the alternator. B
There is another wire on the alternator that goes to the jump post. C
If AB is connected, and BC is disconnected, then the problem is in wire B, however if AB and BC are both still connected, than the problem can not be isolated until BC is disconnected, so disconnecting BC is my current goal in isolating it in the wiring between the starter and the alternator.
I am sure there is a math teacher out there some where that wants to use your post as the basis for a question.
If wire A is touching wire B and neither are touching the starter, and wire B is not connected to the alternator, I would believe you have a problem in wire B if the drain is still present.
If A is connected to B and B is connected to the alternator, I would remove B from alternator and see if drain stops again. If it does, you may have a short in the alternator.
Either way I would take the alternator and have it checked.
If you are available, I could come take a look tonight or tomorrow any time after 3PM. Give me a call if you wanted me to.
10-29-2009, 04:48 PM
#34
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Tim,
I would love some help in trying to find this, but I won't be off work until 7pm tonight, and tomorrow after work I have a show to go to. On top of that, it's quite the drive from your place to mine, but I would definitely appreciate some help. I guess that isolation of the problem is just what's frustrating me. I have done all these tests and found out where it isn't, but there's still so many places it could be, and without having a 100% knowledge of where all the wiring goes, I'm not 100% sure how to get from A to B.
I suspect (hope?) that it is in the wiring between the starter and the alternator, but I imagine checking this means removing all of that wiring which will be a pain in the ***, granted if it is further up than this, it would be even more of a pain in the *** so it could be worse. I guess I'll try getting to that tonight and see how it goes.
I would love some help in trying to find this, but I won't be off work until 7pm tonight, and tomorrow after work I have a show to go to. On top of that, it's quite the drive from your place to mine, but I would definitely appreciate some help. I guess that isolation of the problem is just what's frustrating me. I have done all these tests and found out where it isn't, but there's still so many places it could be, and without having a 100% knowledge of where all the wiring goes, I'm not 100% sure how to get from A to B.
I suspect (hope?) that it is in the wiring between the starter and the alternator, but I imagine checking this means removing all of that wiring which will be a pain in the ***, granted if it is further up than this, it would be even more of a pain in the *** so it could be worse. I guess I'll try getting to that tonight and see how it goes.
10-29-2009, 06:08 PM
#35
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Korwen
Realistically - wires just don't leak like this.. (and if they did you'd never figure out where...)
You keep confusing things by not listening and taking action... from what you have said it appears it must be the Alternator and that is the most likely source of a lead of this magnitude - you seem relectant to take it off and check it
THIS IS THE NEXT OBVIOUS STEP
The exact sequence of the connections is not the same on every year - however it is substantially the same:
either:
Batt+ -> Starter --+--> Jump Post -> CE panel Top Terminals
&|--> Alternator
OR
Batt+ ->Starter -> Alternator -> Jump Post -> CE panel top
If your connections at the jump post were disconnected and the starter and alternator were connected - you always suspect the alternator first.... test it!
Alan
Realistically - wires just don't leak like this.. (and if they did you'd never figure out where...)
You keep confusing things by not listening and taking action... from what you have said it appears it must be the Alternator and that is the most likely source of a lead of this magnitude - you seem relectant to take it off and check it
THIS IS THE NEXT OBVIOUS STEP
The exact sequence of the connections is not the same on every year - however it is substantially the same:
either:
Batt+ -> Starter --+--> Jump Post -> CE panel Top Terminals
&|--> Alternator
OR
Batt+ ->Starter -> Alternator -> Jump Post -> CE panel top
If your connections at the jump post were disconnected and the starter and alternator were connected - you always suspect the alternator first.... test it!
Alan
10-29-2009, 07:13 PM
#36
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Korwen, just borrow a good alternator, do the swap and check if the drain goes away or not. It's so easy to change the alternator that really it's not worth trying anything else first.
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1979 Euro
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1979 Euro
10-29-2009, 07:49 PM
#37
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For completions sake I'm going to take off the alternator and have it tested, but this is my concern:
With both wires on the alternator disconnected, I still have the drain. How is this? How can the alternator be the problem when the problem still persists with it completely disconnected? I'm going to have it checked regardless, but I just can't reason how it is still an issue, and as with most places I feel like if I go there asking them to test something I'll get the "Well it really should be replaced anyways" and I don't feel like forking out money I don't have to (yet). But, for the sake of discussion, I'll get this done.
With both wires on the alternator disconnected, I still have the drain. How is this? How can the alternator be the problem when the problem still persists with it completely disconnected? I'm going to have it checked regardless, but I just can't reason how it is still an issue, and as with most places I feel like if I go there asking them to test something I'll get the "Well it really should be replaced anyways" and I don't feel like forking out money I don't have to (yet). But, for the sake of discussion, I'll get this done.
10-30-2009, 01:02 AM
#38
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OK I offficially don't understand anything you have said... Too much confiusion and ambiguity
Start over again - do it carefully with thought and tell us everything you actually measure.
But still to all out there - WIRES DO NOT LEAK LIKE THIS - stop chasing pahntom problems - it just doesn't work that way and speculating that it does just wastes everyones time...
Alan
Start over again - do it carefully with thought and tell us everything you actually measure.
But still to all out there - WIRES DO NOT LEAK LIKE THIS - stop chasing pahntom problems - it just doesn't work that way and speculating that it does just wastes everyones time...
Alan
10-30-2009, 10:13 AM
#39
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Don't worry, it has me plenty confused too.
I can't do work on it tonight because I'm going to see a band after work, but hopefully tomorrow morning I can do a re-cap and take pictures with it through the whole process. Since I've had the car not running for awhile I'm going to plug in everything and just make sure she goes, and then after that I'll start through the whole battery of tests but with photos showing the entire sequence.
I can't do work on it tonight because I'm going to see a band after work, but hopefully tomorrow morning I can do a re-cap and take pictures with it through the whole process. Since I've had the car not running for awhile I'm going to plug in everything and just make sure she goes, and then after that I'll start through the whole battery of tests but with photos showing the entire sequence.
11-04-2009, 03:26 PM
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Revenge of the Drain!
Okay, so in preparation for the Third Coast gathering, I've had to stall all work on the car, and try to put everything back together. After this weekend, and now knowing a lot more about the whole system than I did before, I'm going to make a much more thorough and proper, documented series of tests in an attempt to take care of what I now think may be multiple problems in the car. Whoopie.
That having been said, I put everything back on last night and tested it out and got erratic readings on my multimeter. It looked like the drain was no longer stable. Whereas it used to be a solid 2.2amp drain, it was now anywhere from .4 to 5.x amounts. It could be the multimeter, so when I get home from work tonight (or hell I'm so bothered by this I may go home and do this during lunch)
If I have an erratic, jumpy reading for amperage, does this mean there's a short? If so I think a late night is in my future. I just want her to get to the 3rd coast and back, and then I'll get this sorted properly.
Okay, so in preparation for the Third Coast gathering, I've had to stall all work on the car, and try to put everything back together. After this weekend, and now knowing a lot more about the whole system than I did before, I'm going to make a much more thorough and proper, documented series of tests in an attempt to take care of what I now think may be multiple problems in the car. Whoopie.
That having been said, I put everything back on last night and tested it out and got erratic readings on my multimeter. It looked like the drain was no longer stable. Whereas it used to be a solid 2.2amp drain, it was now anywhere from .4 to 5.x amounts. It could be the multimeter, so when I get home from work tonight (or hell I'm so bothered by this I may go home and do this during lunch)
If I have an erratic, jumpy reading for amperage, does this mean there's a short? If so I think a late night is in my future. I just want her to get to the 3rd coast and back, and then I'll get this sorted properly.
