hacker-pschorr

I thought there was a pump like this on the market for domestic V8's, I've been looking all morning & I cannot find it.

EDIT - found it, for the LS Chevy motors: "Mezieres' LS1 water pump utilizes a free floating idler pulley so you can keep your OE belt routing, making this mod a true bolt-on"

http://www.c5racer.com/catalog/Cooli...duct_info.html



We could always run dual timing belts like Ferrari uses on their cars, one belt for each cam shaft?

Just tossing ideas on the table.....

Lizard928

Hey, your the one that lives near Todd, why not have him make up the dual belt system :P

I would be more than happy to give it a try. Actually while your at it, make up new cams so that we can loose the chain tensioner and be able to adjust both cams.

hacker-pschorr

We've talked about a setup using four cam gears. Todd has so much on his plate right now I'm not sure how soon something could be mocked up.

He's now making custom intake manifolds for 4-banger Mitsu turbo motors. The protodype picked up over 100rwhp over a well known (and expensive) intake manifold:

http://www.beyondredline.com/store/i...11m27v5ptlpas0

Mike Frye

Sorry Roger (I know this thread has gotten off the 'market research' track and into a whole new area, but I'm just continuing down the road we're already on).

I was looking at the routing of the coolant for a hot and cold engine and I think if the existing WP were changed to be just a pulley to retain the belt routing, you'd have to come up with something that would take the place of the water bridge. I'm not sure how the thing would have to look, but I think it would be easier to hack this and modify it than to do anything down on the front of the engine. The critical parts are the inlet hose connections for the radiator and the ports on the bottom for the heads, the central inlet (from where the existing W/P is, as well as the t-stat.

If someone could cut one of these apart and incorporate an electric W/P (or two small ones, one for each side), then the existing W/P location could be converted to a sturdy sealed plate with a high quality bearing/roller setup.

Edit: Well this was a thread killer.

worf928

IMO, engineering a better bolt-on-with-no-other-mods mechanical pump is going to be more-possible from a business perspective (i.e. sunk capital cost) than engineering a replacement plate with pulley, something to accept an electric pump, and the wiring harness for it. In addition, a replacement mechanical pump is less risky from the product management (i.e. RISK management) point of view.

docmirror

Ok, I don't think copying the 3L Ferrari system is a good idea. They double the number of parts that we have. It's a hassle as there are counter gears in the side case as well. not a good design.

As for electric pump, this might be a good idea. We would also need an idler wheel to maintain the belt profile. The routing would get tricky since the belt needs to go where the motor housing is and can't be moved much, unless you change belt length.

90 S-4

I'm interested in the billet water pump housing idea, or anything thats better than the current junk..
Sterling, have you already looked into this ?

Black Sea RD

Yep, all it takes is finding a manufacturer willing to get involved with the project who is a known quantity for making such pieces/parts, access to the t-belt rollers and impellers (plastic or metal), bearing units and money to fund the project until all the little "gotchas" are taken care of along the way. Then finding people willing to buy the new improved and probably more expensive water pumps to offset your investment. And how many water pumps are sold per year?

I would agree that a CNC machined housing with machined surfaces to accept the bearing unit would be a good starting point. However the problems experienced by many seem to mainly be the roller and impellers moving from their assigned positions.

Cheers,
Constantine

heinrich

Impellers moving, rollers moving, shaft extending, bearings not beefy, bla bla bla bla.

I will buy the plate with roller and redesigned housing with electrical pump ..... I cannot live with the TICKING TIME BOMB OF A water pump ANYMORE.

Black Sea RD

Hi Heinrich,

The problems you mention can be all dialed out of the equation using the stock configuration. One of the main problems is finding a manufacturer willing to listen to us "fanatics" and incorporate the changes needed in the basic design, even if they don't think they are needed. I believe that's what Roger of 928sRus is trying to do.

The remote electric water pump idea initially sounds grand, but as with any re-design, there will be gremlins along the way in designing such a system. As with anything, what might initially look easy usually winds up not being so, especially with a complex system like the 928.

Regards,
Constantine

Landseer

I'm with Sterling on billet.

Black Sea RD

But a billet housing is not tackling the rest of the problems experienced.

heinrich

Constantine, not so ... you and I are driving with pretty good certainty that the work our hands did will last. But we cannot predict the reliability of the pump. Sort of "it's worked for 1,000 miles so I predict it will continue to work". What if it fails in the first few miles? Or what if it fails at 2,000 miles as one of mine did? Yes we caught it .. but what if the failure mode goes unnoticed?

No thanks .. the stock setup does not work for me.

Black Sea RD

Hi Heinrich,

I appreciate your vote of confidence with my mechanical abilities! I understand exactly what you mean and offer the following:

Stock set up, ie. the water pump in the stock position, with same operations but with different build up specifications to over come most of the current short comings of the rebuilt and OEM makers versions. This would entail using better than OE spec parts with some modifications to stop known problems.

Kind regards,
Constantine

123

I agree. In my opinion, a billet housing is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. I'd definitely buy a stock type pump that has an upgraded bearing and seal, and a more securely attached impeller. I'd buy one of the currently available rebuilt ones before I bought an electric one though.