delco alternator conversion
08-11-2008, 06:03 PM
#1
delco alternator conversion
my alternator finally gave up on my 85 euro and i have searched the achives for the delco conversion plan. i still have questions. which is the correct unit to buy i have seen a 86 v6 camaro but they only have 100 and lower amps. and when you get to the cs130 d the prices are almost as much as the bosch unit. can someone tell me which delco example (2001 k1500 pickup) and with on wire or 2 or 3 lead .. and which belt i have seen numerous options in this point also help!!!!!
i am confused
i am confused
08-11-2008, 08:04 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
Delco conversion works on the 4.7 and 4.5 liter blocks, 84 and back. For me, the conversion made sense because I couldn't justify another penny above bare minimum for my 84.
Not sure anybody has found a direct conversion for newer cars.
You have OEM via site sponsers as an option, new or rebuilt, plus a heavy duty alternator from Carl Fauset of 928 Motorsports, also a sponsor. You can have your existing unit rebuilt locally as another option.
Not sure anybody has found a direct conversion for newer cars.
You have OEM via site sponsers as an option, new or rebuilt, plus a heavy duty alternator from Carl Fauset of 928 Motorsports, also a sponsor. You can have your existing unit rebuilt locally as another option.
08-12-2008, 04:59 AM
#3
Three Wheelin'
my alternator finally gave up on my 85 euro and i have searched the achives for the delco conversion plan. i still have questions. which is the correct unit to buy i have seen a 86 v6 camaro but they only have 100 and lower amps. and when you get to the cs130 d the prices are almost as much as the bosch unit. can someone tell me which delco example (2001 k1500 pickup) and with on wire or 2 or 3 lead .. and which belt i have seen numerous options in this point also help!!!!!
i am confused
i am confused
Louie
08-12-2008, 03:40 PM
#4
when i bought car the oil cooler line were leaking and soaked the alt. i get between 12.1 to 12.9 then it stops rising right at thirteen. it appears to be running on battery.
08-12-2008, 06:04 PM
#6
when the car sits ( weeks at a time) it will turn over .but if i just run it four 15 minutes the battery will not turn over the starter. at that point the battery is totally dead.
04-13-2010, 02:03 AM
#7
Three Wheelin'
Can someone give more information on the Delco Conversion?
Thanks.
Thanks.
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04-13-2010, 02:14 AM
#9
Three Wheelin'
What year Camaro? What are the benefits?
Thanks Lizard,
Brian
Thanks Lizard,
Brian
04-13-2010, 02:34 AM
#10
Electron Wrangler
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Benefit = Its cheap and easily available
You may need to adapt the pulley...
You will need to adapt the wiring and mounting bracket/ tension adjuster/belt
However - its unlikely the Bosch alternator cannot be rebuilt well - for significantly less than the cost of a new alternator...
Alan
You may need to adapt the pulley...
You will need to adapt the wiring and mounting bracket/ tension adjuster/belt
However - its unlikely the Bosch alternator cannot be rebuilt well - for significantly less than the cost of a new alternator...
Alan
04-13-2010, 02:37 AM
#11
Nordschleife Master
Just reading through this I would BE SURE to take the stock unit in to an alternator shop to be checked out first...if not working properly I would then price out a brush repair (Louie indicates $50 and if you can get it done for that it would be the best deal EVER on a 928 repair...I am sure someplace can and will do it for that too, but don't tell them it came off a Porsche! ;-) and get that done! If that is not feasible then look to the Delco conversion...
04-13-2010, 02:41 AM
#12
Three Wheelin'
Thanks.
04-13-2010, 09:59 AM
#13
Rennlist Member
My 84's had Rhone alternators, not Bosch.
I've converted both to the 88 camaro 105A after a $200 rebuild quote on the original.
They work great. Installation is easy, getting wires right is easy.
You need the alternator, a pigtail plug to fit the alternator, and about 3 washers that total about 5mm as a spacer, and a slightly shorter belt.
The pulley that comes with it is ribbed usually. You have to determine if it needs to be switched with the orignal or not, but it can be if your car has V belt instead of flat ribbed belt. I think yours is ribbed.
The tightening screw arrangment might need to be removed and replaced with a single bolt.
To use the original belt and tightening screw, some people have had to grind the shoulder off the mounting bracket due to interference.
The downsides: not original, not able to use the duct attachment cover, might have to trade-in your original as a core (unless you substitute another core).
The duct has an (expensive) outside air temp sensor in it, up under the drivers fender. The dual purpose duct pulls air across that sensor and cools the alternator keeping road grit from being pulled into the windings. Delco runs uncovered down there, a bit more exposed.
First option would be original, but this does work well.
I've converted both to the 88 camaro 105A after a $200 rebuild quote on the original.
They work great. Installation is easy, getting wires right is easy.
You need the alternator, a pigtail plug to fit the alternator, and about 3 washers that total about 5mm as a spacer, and a slightly shorter belt.
The pulley that comes with it is ribbed usually. You have to determine if it needs to be switched with the orignal or not, but it can be if your car has V belt instead of flat ribbed belt. I think yours is ribbed.
The tightening screw arrangment might need to be removed and replaced with a single bolt.
To use the original belt and tightening screw, some people have had to grind the shoulder off the mounting bracket due to interference.
The downsides: not original, not able to use the duct attachment cover, might have to trade-in your original as a core (unless you substitute another core).
The duct has an (expensive) outside air temp sensor in it, up under the drivers fender. The dual purpose duct pulls air across that sensor and cools the alternator keeping road grit from being pulled into the windings. Delco runs uncovered down there, a bit more exposed.
First option would be original, but this does work well.
04-13-2010, 12:47 PM
#14
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I bought a CS130 Delco unit. They are not rated at 130 though. I bought one off ebay that was reworked and puts out 140amps. Will be putting that in with my cams and TB next week! Can't wait.
Stephen
Stephen
04-13-2010, 01:34 PM
#15
Chronic Tool Dropper
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IF you run the belly pans/engine front shield, the alternator is stuck with a lot of radiator and AC heat in its "cooling" air if you don't have the hoses and the rear shroud in place on the alternator. Alternators get derated drastically when they are hot, so that 130A-rated Delco with no shroud likely has less running capacity than the Bosch 115A-rated unit with the shroud and the cooling hose installed.
Replacing the regulator and brush holder assy in the Bosch alternator is pretty simple, even with the unit mounted in the car I think. On my S4, I was able to pull the hose and the rear cover off with the alternator in place, after loosening the belt and swinging the unit to full-extended position. Four nuts with washers needed an 8mm socket, and the rear cover was off. I was in there to clean connections (chasing a voltage drop problem) and was easily able to take care of that. The regulator and brush holder are an assembly held in with a couple screws. The regulator looks like a little black TO-3 power transistor case sitting on an isolating cover. Just remove the two screws to get the old one out, put the new one in place and replace the screws. Put the cover and the hose back on, install and retension the belt, hook up the battery ground again.
Some watch-outs:
-- Make sure you remove the battery ground connection to the car before you start wrenching on the alternator. That's a big cable directly from the battery and starter, and you will do a little arc-welding with an errant wrench, at least until the battery explodes.
-- The bearings in most alternators are due for replacement at about the same time as the brushes wear out. Replacing just the brushes may buy you some inexpensive extra life from your alternator, but not another 25 years or 100k miles.
-- Replace the belt, and tension it correctly. The required tension on the grooved belts is a lot higher than what a casual installer might think. Firm thumb pressure should deflect the belt half its thickness; that belt isn't very thick so it's piano-wire tight. Recheck and retension the belt after a thousand miles. Clean the alternator pulley when you replace the belt too. Old belts that have been slipping have filled the grooves in the pulley with old burned rubber.
-- The alternator works by rotating an electromagnet around inside a set of windings. The amount of magnetism induced in the rotor windings is controlled by the voltage regulator, which adjusts the flow of electricity to the rotor through those brushes. The brushes ride on copper rings that connect to the windings in the rotor. In a perfect world, the carbon brushes are sacrificial and the rings never wear, but in the real world with dirt and heat, the slip rings or maybe "commutator" rings do wear. If they wear too much, they will not be able to carry the excitation current needed, even with new brushes. There's no good way to inspect the wear on those riungs without disassembling the alternator, and there's no easy way to repair or replace the rings on a DIY basis.
-- Oil and crud contamination will kill even an otherwise excellent alternator. If your power steering or oil cooler lines are leaking into the alternator, every bit of dirt in the cooling air will find a home inside on that oil film. If you decide to do your own partial rebuild, be sure that the alternator isn't oily inside. No matter what route you take, fix the leaks.
-------
Tom Middleton graciously shared an alternator core with me as I was chasing some voltage and charging gremlins. I intended to put new bearings and brushes in that unit and put it in the car to eliminate the alternator as a possible problem. When I pulled it apart, I found that the rings were worn so badly that a set of new brushes wouldn't solve anything. The local rebuilder I had been using had dropped off the map, so I started the hunt for replacement options. In the meanwhile, cleaning connections and a new belt have at least temporarily solved the voltage issues on the car, so the hunt is on the back burner at least for a while.
Resources: 928 International carries the genuine Bosch brush and regulator set for the original alternators. You may be able to shop them for less, but buying from Mark means you know you'll get the right part the first time, vs the crapshoot that is the aftermarket on stuff like this. Ditto the alternator itself as a completely remanufactured assembly. Lower-quality rebuilds can be had, often a brushes/bearings rebuild with a spray can finish. It only needs to last to the end of the warranty period, and on our cars that may not be many miles. Buy a good piece and get another 25 years of service from it. It works out to just a couple dollars a month.
Replacing the regulator and brush holder assy in the Bosch alternator is pretty simple, even with the unit mounted in the car I think. On my S4, I was able to pull the hose and the rear cover off with the alternator in place, after loosening the belt and swinging the unit to full-extended position. Four nuts with washers needed an 8mm socket, and the rear cover was off. I was in there to clean connections (chasing a voltage drop problem) and was easily able to take care of that. The regulator and brush holder are an assembly held in with a couple screws. The regulator looks like a little black TO-3 power transistor case sitting on an isolating cover. Just remove the two screws to get the old one out, put the new one in place and replace the screws. Put the cover and the hose back on, install and retension the belt, hook up the battery ground again.
Some watch-outs:
-- Make sure you remove the battery ground connection to the car before you start wrenching on the alternator. That's a big cable directly from the battery and starter, and you will do a little arc-welding with an errant wrench, at least until the battery explodes.
-- The bearings in most alternators are due for replacement at about the same time as the brushes wear out. Replacing just the brushes may buy you some inexpensive extra life from your alternator, but not another 25 years or 100k miles.
-- Replace the belt, and tension it correctly. The required tension on the grooved belts is a lot higher than what a casual installer might think. Firm thumb pressure should deflect the belt half its thickness; that belt isn't very thick so it's piano-wire tight. Recheck and retension the belt after a thousand miles. Clean the alternator pulley when you replace the belt too. Old belts that have been slipping have filled the grooves in the pulley with old burned rubber.
-- The alternator works by rotating an electromagnet around inside a set of windings. The amount of magnetism induced in the rotor windings is controlled by the voltage regulator, which adjusts the flow of electricity to the rotor through those brushes. The brushes ride on copper rings that connect to the windings in the rotor. In a perfect world, the carbon brushes are sacrificial and the rings never wear, but in the real world with dirt and heat, the slip rings or maybe "commutator" rings do wear. If they wear too much, they will not be able to carry the excitation current needed, even with new brushes. There's no good way to inspect the wear on those riungs without disassembling the alternator, and there's no easy way to repair or replace the rings on a DIY basis.
-- Oil and crud contamination will kill even an otherwise excellent alternator. If your power steering or oil cooler lines are leaking into the alternator, every bit of dirt in the cooling air will find a home inside on that oil film. If you decide to do your own partial rebuild, be sure that the alternator isn't oily inside. No matter what route you take, fix the leaks.
-------
Tom Middleton graciously shared an alternator core with me as I was chasing some voltage and charging gremlins. I intended to put new bearings and brushes in that unit and put it in the car to eliminate the alternator as a possible problem. When I pulled it apart, I found that the rings were worn so badly that a set of new brushes wouldn't solve anything. The local rebuilder I had been using had dropped off the map, so I started the hunt for replacement options. In the meanwhile, cleaning connections and a new belt have at least temporarily solved the voltage issues on the car, so the hunt is on the back burner at least for a while.
Resources: 928 International carries the genuine Bosch brush and regulator set for the original alternators. You may be able to shop them for less, but buying from Mark means you know you'll get the right part the first time, vs the crapshoot that is the aftermarket on stuff like this. Ditto the alternator itself as a completely remanufactured assembly. Lower-quality rebuilds can be had, often a brushes/bearings rebuild with a spray can finish. It only needs to last to the end of the warranty period, and on our cars that may not be many miles. Buy a good piece and get another 25 years of service from it. It works out to just a couple dollars a month.
