Flint

So over the weekend, I apparently managed the combination of not properly putting my car in park and having my emergency brake fail. The result of my car attempting to leave its parking space on it's own are as follows.

Now, other automatics won't even let me take the key out of the ignition if it's not in Park, so I'm not sure if that's something ELSE wrong, but this minor metal bend is what concerns me at the moment.

Thanks for looking!

Flint

Oh yeah, in case anyone cares. That light from the "federalization"? A toyota product.

Mike Frye

Ouch!

That stinks. I guess no one was hurt, so it could be worse. My car moved on me once after I parked it, just didn't pull up the e-brake enough clicks. Fortunately it just changed parking spaces and stayed there!

Hopefully it won't be too bad to fix! What did it hit?

Flint

Yeah, luckily, nobody was hurt. I'm surprised it built up enough speed to do that much! It impacted on some late model impala or something's bumper, barely even scratched them (yes we traded insurance). I have since confirmed that the parking brake is completely non-functional, so I'll have to track down why.

It missed the wheel and the exhaust (it only appears to be hanging lower in the picture because the body is pushed in). So no suspension or exhaust damage.

My father in law suggested (sight unseen though) I might be able to fix it myself. I'm gonna have to pop the rear bumper cover off and see underneath. On the upside, I now have the opportunity to do many other things I've put off.

Does anyone know if it should be even possible to leave the transmission in drive?

toofast928

I did the same thing. No it can't be poped out has to go to body shop.
An ATM left in DRIVE, engine off is the same as leaving it in NETRUAL.
If PARK was selected and the vehicle rolled, then something is wrong with the parking paw inside the trans.

Flint

No, the rolling was due to my own negligence! I just know that some newer automatics won't let you do anymore than turn the engine off, they won't let you remove the key without it being in park, I wondered if that was supposed to be the case here (I suspect not).

Frankly I have no illusions this could be "popped out." My in-laws are capable of a certain amount of actual bodywork, have the right tools and such. It remains to be seen whether this might be beyond their scope. The terms "body" and "filler" used in conjunction scare me.

marlinspike

Older cars didn't have those nanny-state devices that make you put your foot on the clutch to start a manual or put an automatic in P to take the key out.

Also, the way German cars set their parking brake factory specs, you're supposed to yank on it, so see if that does anything.

Nicole

Ouch! Not fun to look at... I hope you can get it fixed at reasonable cost!

This is the time to get rid of it - as well as any potential rust under the rear quarter window seal.

John Struthers

Fixable?
Yes but.....
1. Up on jack stands, higher the better.
2. Wheel off.
3. Drop exhaust.
4. Fender liner off.
5. Remove tail light lenses/light assy's, don't forget those trim piece screws -lift the hatch-, bumper cover.

6. Exhaust heat shield off.
7. Marker light off.
8. Antenna/mount/motor ... what ever.

All in vain though, as you have 5,6, or, 7 dents with one gouge at a seam/fender, bumper cover
flange and at least 2 scratches.
At least one-half of the dents are deep and all of them are connected.
Formed aluminum 'work hardens' -cracks- easily and 'beer cans' even faster.
Bondo/filler MAY hold for awhile but keep in mind you have a heat source - exhaust/bathtub muffler
and the heat shield shedding heat in that aluminum 'heat exchanger' corner. Then there is the
antenna motor and mount transmitting bumps and vibration in that corner. add to that the shock of
the hatch slammin' shut and rocks etc... dinging the fender lip -lined or not- on a rather constant basis.
Due to being aluminum sheet (thin), and it's shape that area is not a candidate for TIG/MIG welding.
Best bet....new fender.............. they are still out there.
Bummer.
Good Luck.

JHowell37

Replace the quarter panel. Easily said by someone who has likely never done it. The quarter panel is not aluminum, it's stamped steel. I know for a fact that you can MIG weld on a 928 quarter panel which means that you can also TIG weld on one. Even if it were thin a aluminum sheet, you can TIG weld it as long as your machine has a high-frequency start.

Stamped steel will work harden and possibly beer/oil can, but the first issue won't occur if you use the proper tools and the second one can be dealt with by several other techniques.

Modern, catalyzed filler is extremely durable, heat tolerant, and sticks to bare metal better then just about anything else.

That damage is perfectly manageable without replacing a quarter.

largecar379

Uh.......that's galvanized steel....


--Russ

Flint

Well, I tend to always yank on it*, which may have led to the problem in the beginning.

Yeah, that definitely on the agenda now! I think maybe rub strips and the extra federalized lights in front as well.

Thanks all, hopefully by the weekend after I let more experienced people see it I will know more!



*yes, I deliberately paved the way for jokes--keeping my sense of humor!

John Struthers

JHowell,
1. Correct on metal. Brain cramp. Probably becauce I once pulled a massive 'neighbor dent' away from the rr Weissach tire it was rubbing, by hand, with the tire on. Or maybe because I've been wandering about the garage with my son's right front fender in hand looking for a dent solution... God knows it visibly rusts' -lower 1/4 window seal area-, magnet sticks to it, ad nauseam ... .
In any case you are correct ...it is not aluminum. I stand corrected.
2. Wrong on replacement, lived at the shop to insure alignment and fill/finish after Pattycakes the Wunder Weissach - 82 MY- was wounded several years ago. Only to miss the horrors of the drywall screw tail light assy install.
3. Shy of shaping a hardwood backer form, then rosebud heating of panel -can't put the whole sHARk in an oven for annealing- to stress relieve the panel I don't know of another method of heating and dolly work to remove multiple/connecting dents and deep scratches/gouges on a compound curved
panel area roughly 15 inches by say 20 inches. Don't get me wrong, back in the 70's a Slovakian American shop owner named Julius Sota -Munhall aka Hunky Hill in Pittsburgh- used to employ escapee' tradesmen from behind the Iron Curtain. They were, to a man, metal magician's, brazer's, paint/detailers and could do the work that you suggest. And worked for 10 buck's an hour back then.
However, that skill level and the manhours/cost involved would get you another shark.
And yes, there are shop's that would be all to willing to do that work. As long as you had the cash.
No insurance company would authorize work above the 'total' line and that's exactly where the repairs you suggest would take you. Pro bono work by master metalsmith's is found near piles of hen's teeth.
Yep, you can Mig/Tig on these steel panels. And the line -assuming you "simply" cut a perfect replacement from another sHARk fender- WILL GO WAVY on you irregardless of spot /tack/continuous weld methods.
You could do a decent replacement patch from an existing sHARk panel with a dimpled overlay to get a reasonably smooth faying and patch/panel joint if you used counter sunk rivets which would also reduce the quantity/thickness/manhours of catalysed fillers. Personally, I'd rather paddle lead.
For all that ...
If this is simply a I want my 928 to look good (at least for awhile) and get off without a repair loan, great! Sand the dented parts of that panel -and a bit more for blend-in, down to the metal, preferably both sides, drill some holes for filler anchors to the backside. Use those modern (?) properly mixed, 2 part fillers in a low humidity environment, apply, cure till it is still fairly easy to shape. Repeat till you get a near blend in after sanding. Apply good filler primer sand till near perfect then paint.
If Flint is going to do the repair you are right again ... he CAN DO IT, and it will be cheaper than replacing the 1/4 panel. That's his option, but if he ever try's to sell it on the Renn ...... big discount.
He could just have the Emergency brake repaired by a shop and use the work order/reciept to explain the whole mess to his insurance company I believe the whole job including color match was under $2400.
Finally, if and when you get a chance, get a beat-up sHARk fender or hood cut a flat piece out then try to tig/mig it back together, should be a lot easier than welding an a compound curved aluminum piece.
I spent a whole career in the military, most of it repairing pranged/shot-up, and otherwise bent fixed wing and rotary wing aircraft. Aircraft Structures.
I ran the shop for the 1st BN 160th S.O.A.R.- Blackhawk Down fame- at AVUM, AVIM, and Limited Depot level. I worked Titanium, Magnesium, Aluminum, Stainless, Steel, Aluminum honeycomb sandwich,Aluminum/'paper'honeycomb, fiberglass, ballistic kevlar, mild steel and forgings NASA would be proud of. I had access too and used, nearly on a daily basis some of the following, aerobic and anareobic, 2 part sealants, fillers, acrylics and paints few people have heard of and fewer have access to. I designed, fabricated, heat treated and rockwell tested a dolly/pick set consisting of dozens of specialized metal working tools. Boeing, Sikorsky and Beech reps approved every quick-fix and one time flight battle damage repair I came up with. Got a wall full of factory awards for innovations/modification to a fleet of one of a kind aircraft. So with the exception of my brain cramp on fender matierial (thanks for promting me on that...well deserved) I'll stick to my guns on welding aluminum -sheet/plate ok- big, curved , compound shapes ... forget about it! Correct freq./amperage will help significantly but a close/precise matching metallurgy of the wire is more important.
The damage to Flints' STEEL panel WILL work harden if worked on the car. Period!
Without annealing that work hardening WILL induce beer canning -probably already exists- and or stress cracking. And, sadly, while two part fillers are 'durable' fairly inexpensive, and worker friendly repair products they are not a 'permanent' repair irregardless of ahesive qualities -ask NASA-.
That said, if HE is doing the work... a little knocking of the tin, sand to bare metal both sides, drill a few holes for a filler anchor to the back side -smooth in- a good job of sanding, prep/primer/paint and a backer/cover plate attached by a non-acidic caulk for cushion and seal followed by a little spray undercoat would probably fit your term manageable.
He will need a hand tapping out those dents. You might be able to that work alone, but I'm not sure if he can.
I was a little flippant with my reply, -sorry about that- but then, consider the topic title in relation to the damage photo's.

Flint

Hehe, no problem! I'm a fan of "that'll buff right out" jokes.

Well, I've never really planned to sell the car anyway. I guess my goal for the moment is to get it to a point where it won't be embarrassing to drive around anymore. If I ever do get rid of it, it would be on a parts car/parting out basis.

Unless anyone has a spare chassis lying around for an engine swap? (5-speed preferrably)

JHowell37

The one detail that you forgot to factor in is the fact that this car is 24 years old and "embarrassing to drive."

While I respect your "street cred" I'm not sure how NASA is an authority on automotive body fillers. Unless of course we're talking about 2 different organizations known as NASA.

Drilling holes in the body is an obsolete and unacceptable practice these days and I don't know of anyone who has sanded the backside of an old panel to do a repair. Perhaps on aircraft that are held together with rivets you can do this, but when you're talking about an old car and in most cases an insurance company who picks up the tab, things work a bit differently. Is it a perfect solution? Not at all. While replacing the quarter panel may be ideal, firsthand experience tells me it's a **** job, and not one I'd be too eager to repeat without exhausting all other possibilities first.