And there are those who hate the Cayanne
08-25-2002, 03:42 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
And there are those who hate the Cayanne
So...
There I was working another saturday when across the road two car carriers pull into a Whataburger lot.
HhMmmmm... a Boxter on each of them... let's go look.
There were VW's, Audi's, Porsches, and Merc's.
One had the following:
Boxter
Audi TT
CLK 320
ML 320 -SUV-.
E 320 - Wagon-.
S55 AMG
Two SL 600's - I didn't know they had V-12's.
AND,
FINALLY,
One G 500, Rover/International Scout looking - only on a much larger scale - V-8.
I don't know the year on this puppy but it looked NEW. If you never saw one, track one down, the dual pipe setup is a sight to behold.
There I was working another saturday when across the road two car carriers pull into a Whataburger lot.
HhMmmmm... a Boxter on each of them... let's go look.
There were VW's, Audi's, Porsches, and Merc's.
One had the following:
Boxter
Audi TT
CLK 320
ML 320 -SUV-.
E 320 - Wagon-.
S55 AMG
Two SL 600's - I didn't know they had V-12's.
AND,
FINALLY,
One G 500, Rover/International Scout looking - only on a much larger scale - V-8.
I don't know the year on this puppy but it looked NEW. If you never saw one, track one down, the dual pipe setup is a sight to behold.
08-25-2002, 05:35 AM
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G500?
Gaelendevagen by MB? I've encountered a few of these on the roads here in Florida. Always perfectly clean and waxed...
Personally, I prefer my rustoleum-painted '66 F100.
As to the Cayenne, I've been thinking about this vehicle quite a bit lately. It is Porsche's idea to stay independent by producing a volume car. They are the most profitable car maker in the world [13% margin~ GOOD lord!] and want to stay that way. So they contracted with VW to co-develop a TRUCK and arrange production of bodies in Slovakia.
[I wonder what the bore spacing of the Cayenne V8 is...It is emminently suspicious to me that both Audi and Porsche are selling 4-liter class turbocharged V8 engines with the exact same HP rating....]
Really, I think that Porsche has the right idea. They need to stay independant of Volkswagen in order to maintain not only their name but also their design independance. VW produces great cars, but they don't have quite the soul that a Porsche has, and the suits in Stuttgart know it. And I doubt it that 13% margin could be achieved via a line of cars that has the onus of the boys/girls in Wolfsburg behind it.
But really... a truck?
-My previous car was a VW Corrado VR6. This thing did everything right- it was faster than a V8 powered Mustang, got 30 mpg, and one day...me and this girl fit a full-sized futon in the back. The hatch almost closed! The handling was incredible...you couldn't tell it was FWD, and I remember the car magazines back then hailed it and said that this was the car Porsche needed to sell. Hell, it even sounded good!
If Porsche needs to sell volume in order to stay independant, then I think they should do the ironic and sell something basically made by Wolfsburg. They need to sell a hot-rodded GTI or Jetta, and call it their own. Keep the base price around $25k, give it good handling, early shark/ Boxter performance, and the ability to swallow a small refrigerator. Leave the building of trucks to Ford.
Yeah, I know...they tried this before [914] and it didn't work. That was then, this is now. VW quality is so good these days that the car would sell well and enjoy a good reputation. As long as it was fast, there could be no complaints.
I hope Porsche gets it right. I personally have some reservations about the looks of the Cayenne- the Tuareg is far better looking...but based upon what I see in affluent Orlando, there is no shortage of people with fat wallets and no taste here, so I guess I'll see plenty of peppery SUV's around...
Normy!
'85 S2 5 Speed
Gaelendevagen by MB? I've encountered a few of these on the roads here in Florida. Always perfectly clean and waxed...
Personally, I prefer my rustoleum-painted '66 F100.
As to the Cayenne, I've been thinking about this vehicle quite a bit lately. It is Porsche's idea to stay independent by producing a volume car. They are the most profitable car maker in the world [13% margin~ GOOD lord!] and want to stay that way. So they contracted with VW to co-develop a TRUCK and arrange production of bodies in Slovakia.
[I wonder what the bore spacing of the Cayenne V8 is...It is emminently suspicious to me that both Audi and Porsche are selling 4-liter class turbocharged V8 engines with the exact same HP rating....]
Really, I think that Porsche has the right idea. They need to stay independant of Volkswagen in order to maintain not only their name but also their design independance. VW produces great cars, but they don't have quite the soul that a Porsche has, and the suits in Stuttgart know it. And I doubt it that 13% margin could be achieved via a line of cars that has the onus of the boys/girls in Wolfsburg behind it.
But really... a truck?
-My previous car was a VW Corrado VR6. This thing did everything right- it was faster than a V8 powered Mustang, got 30 mpg, and one day...me and this girl fit a full-sized futon in the back. The hatch almost closed! The handling was incredible...you couldn't tell it was FWD, and I remember the car magazines back then hailed it and said that this was the car Porsche needed to sell. Hell, it even sounded good!
If Porsche needs to sell volume in order to stay independant, then I think they should do the ironic and sell something basically made by Wolfsburg. They need to sell a hot-rodded GTI or Jetta, and call it their own. Keep the base price around $25k, give it good handling, early shark/ Boxter performance, and the ability to swallow a small refrigerator. Leave the building of trucks to Ford.
Yeah, I know...they tried this before [914] and it didn't work. That was then, this is now. VW quality is so good these days that the car would sell well and enjoy a good reputation. As long as it was fast, there could be no complaints.
I hope Porsche gets it right. I personally have some reservations about the looks of the Cayenne- the Tuareg is far better looking...but based upon what I see in affluent Orlando, there is no shortage of people with fat wallets and no taste here, so I guess I'll see plenty of peppery SUV's around...
Normy!
'85 S2 5 Speed
08-25-2002, 10:17 AM
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Normy, et al,
I've recently heard a story, it almost makes sense, but I still want confirmation from other sources; the story goes like this; VW actually built the 914, but it wasn't called a 914, and sales were terrible, more cars were being shipped, there wasn't any more holding space, so they got together with Porsche, figured out a numeric designation, and THEN they sold like hotcakes! The story teller even mentions a spot on the early cars, that has an area shaped for a VW emblem, or that is covered over by a 914 emblem. This story comes from an independant VW mechanic, who claims to have been in the biz for 35+ years, he certainly is old enough!
Is this truth, an old wives tail, an urban legend, or a total fabrication???? I'd be interested to know whats what.
Maybe I ought to post this to the 914 board, and see what kinda responce I'd get??!?!???
<img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/oops.gif" border="0" alt="[oops]" /> <img src="graemlins/icon107.gif" border="0" alt="[icon107]" />
I've recently heard a story, it almost makes sense, but I still want confirmation from other sources; the story goes like this; VW actually built the 914, but it wasn't called a 914, and sales were terrible, more cars were being shipped, there wasn't any more holding space, so they got together with Porsche, figured out a numeric designation, and THEN they sold like hotcakes! The story teller even mentions a spot on the early cars, that has an area shaped for a VW emblem, or that is covered over by a 914 emblem. This story comes from an independant VW mechanic, who claims to have been in the biz for 35+ years, he certainly is old enough!
Is this truth, an old wives tail, an urban legend, or a total fabrication???? I'd be interested to know whats what.
Maybe I ought to post this to the 914 board, and see what kinda responce I'd get??!?!???
<img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/oops.gif" border="0" alt="[oops]" /> <img src="graemlins/icon107.gif" border="0" alt="[icon107]" />
08-25-2002, 03:19 PM
#4
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Thread Starter
Brett,
I hope you have some ceramic body armor handy...
It's like asking a D.C. cop if that was his daughter you met on 18th Street last night.
P.S. I liked the 914's, then again, I liked rag top Beetles, Karmens, and bullet - nosed Studebakers, too.
John
Hope the story fleshes out, would make for some good reading. <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
I hope you have some ceramic body armor handy...
It's like asking a D.C. cop if that was his daughter you met on 18th Street last night.
P.S. I liked the 914's, then again, I liked rag top Beetles, Karmens, and bullet - nosed Studebakers, too.
John
Hope the story fleshes out, would make for some good reading. <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
08-25-2002, 08:30 PM
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I'm not really an expert on 914's, but here is what I know:
The people in charge at Porsche during the late 60's were convinced that the mid-engine layout was the way of the future [incidently...the first prototype VW Golfs were designed by Porsche, and had a mid engine; this design was scrapped and VW built their own Golf...]. While this was going on, Heinz Nordhoff, the head of VW, was interested in adding a sporty model to replace the Karmann Ghia and add some pizzaz to the showroom floors. Nordhoff was good friends with Ferry Porsche, and talks between them produced an agreement to create the 914 as two separate cars with one basic unibody. They picked the type 4 engine for the base model, the 911's engine for the upmarket model, and contracted Karmann to supply finished cars to VW and bare body shells to Porsche.
Then Heinz Nordhoff died. The new CEO of VW, Kurt Lotz, didn't like the idea and a new group, called "VW+Porsche" was conceived to market the car. This was a huge blunder- the cars were perceived as VW's in Europe, despite being designed by Porsche, and sales were slow. That and the car's styling is kind of a love it or hate it kind of thing-
[personally, I hate their looks!]
Really, they were great cars, but had a tendency to rust. This is Porsche's lightest and best chassis, and they make wonderful race cars!
An interesting sidelight: A few years later when it was obvious that the 914 wasn't a commercial success, VW decided again that they needed a sporty model, and again they asked Stuttgart to design one. The new car would have a front mounted engine, rear drive, and use as many off the shelf VW parts as possible. The front suspension was straight from the Golf, the steering, rear mounted transmission, and engine were straight from Audi, and the rear suspension was straight from the 914. This project received priority at Porsche and caused the 928 project to be delayed.
And then another change in management occurred at VW...and again they decided to shelve the sporty rear drive car in favor of one based on the Golf- the Scirocco.
Porsche decided that what they had designed had merit, so they bought back their own design, made a few changes....and called it the 924.
Well, here we go again with Cayenne/Tuareg!
Normy!
'85 S2 5 Speed
The people in charge at Porsche during the late 60's were convinced that the mid-engine layout was the way of the future [incidently...the first prototype VW Golfs were designed by Porsche, and had a mid engine; this design was scrapped and VW built their own Golf...]. While this was going on, Heinz Nordhoff, the head of VW, was interested in adding a sporty model to replace the Karmann Ghia and add some pizzaz to the showroom floors. Nordhoff was good friends with Ferry Porsche, and talks between them produced an agreement to create the 914 as two separate cars with one basic unibody. They picked the type 4 engine for the base model, the 911's engine for the upmarket model, and contracted Karmann to supply finished cars to VW and bare body shells to Porsche.
Then Heinz Nordhoff died. The new CEO of VW, Kurt Lotz, didn't like the idea and a new group, called "VW+Porsche" was conceived to market the car. This was a huge blunder- the cars were perceived as VW's in Europe, despite being designed by Porsche, and sales were slow. That and the car's styling is kind of a love it or hate it kind of thing-
[personally, I hate their looks!]
Really, they were great cars, but had a tendency to rust. This is Porsche's lightest and best chassis, and they make wonderful race cars!
An interesting sidelight: A few years later when it was obvious that the 914 wasn't a commercial success, VW decided again that they needed a sporty model, and again they asked Stuttgart to design one. The new car would have a front mounted engine, rear drive, and use as many off the shelf VW parts as possible. The front suspension was straight from the Golf, the steering, rear mounted transmission, and engine were straight from Audi, and the rear suspension was straight from the 914. This project received priority at Porsche and caused the 928 project to be delayed.
And then another change in management occurred at VW...and again they decided to shelve the sporty rear drive car in favor of one based on the Golf- the Scirocco.
Porsche decided that what they had designed had merit, so they bought back their own design, made a few changes....and called it the 924.
Well, here we go again with Cayenne/Tuareg!
Normy!
'85 S2 5 Speed