TAREK

couldn't find what I'm looking for in the archives, so here it goes:

I bought a used 2-post lift a little over a year ago and have not gotten around to installing it yet, but the goal is to get it done this summer.

Does anyone have general installation tips/instructions? I know the concrete floor should be 4" to 6" thick, but is it necessary to have steel reinforcement in the concrete floor? and if my garage floor does'nt have steel reinforcement, should I dig out the post perimeter and pour new concrete with steel reinforcement?

I can't remember if it was the symetrical or asymetrical type when I bought it (you'd think I'd remember, since I actually saw it in operation prior to dismantling, but trying to figure that out as it lies in pieces before me), but would that make a difference in the floor mounting requirement (thinking front-back weight balancing)

The manufacturer (Canadian?)seems to have gone out of business or changed names, so not much luck getting info from the source yet.

If it helps to know, the posts are one piece steel columns, that bolt on top of the ends of a large floor cross piece under which cables run. The floor piece does have Tee-ends and seems to be ok for providing a base for the free standing lift, without too much help for front-back balancing. But wanted to solicit input just to make sure. The thing weighs more than it looks, and probably more than it's capacity (9000 lbs)

Hope this made sense

would greatly appreciate it if anyone has info/knowledge in the subject
thanks
Tarek

WallyP

Tarek,

I would be concerned that the garage floor might not be strong enough to securely mount the lift. Concrete is very strong in compression, but not too good in tension. If you put good anchor bolts into the floor, and the floor is too thin, the lift could pull chunks of the floor up and fall over on top of your car. Ouch!

While this may not be too likely, as it would require that the floor be weak, and that the car be lifted in such a way as to cause unbalanced loads on the lift, the cost of failure could be high.

You might could put steel plates under the lift that extend a couple of feet in each direction, and bolt those to the floor. This would spread the load on the concrete, and reduce the overturning leverage.

Or you could cut the floor out where the lift is to be installed, and put in concrete beams 12" thick, 24" wide, 72" long, with steel rebar and/or mesh, and embed the mounting bolts deeply in the concrete.

If you know a local engineer or architect, a brief consultation might be worthwhile.

It would not be nice to have a major accident and then discover that your insurance company refused coverage because the lift wasn't professional installed.

Gregg K

Tarek,
I'm ending a day of successful 928 fun and repairs. The brain is barely functional. Having said that, I'd do a Google on the company. Then I'd search for similar hoists and maybe one has installation instructions on the net. Or available. A photo would help to understand what the lift looks like. I've seen them before but haven't paid attention to whether they simply sit on the concrete, or are fastened. My guess is they take the unbalanced moment forces, and the floor simply supports the weight. If that's the case, then it's a nobrainer, and the thing can practically sit on bare dirt. (Wow, just saw an owl fly by.) Once you have that lift in service, you'll have a lot of jealous forum members. Good luck.

tresamore

Try calling some other lift manufacturers and see what they say.

Jack Riffle

Tarek.
If your garage floor is 4" thick, there is no need for re-inforcing.The main consideration when installing one of these lifts is that the uprights are at the same height, and plumb, square and level. Use a nice, long, straight 2x4 and a level, and make sure that the areas where the 2 uprights will be installed is at the same height. If they are not, it is permissible to shim under a post as long as it is not more than 1-1/2".After the uprights are in an upright possition, it is absolutely CRITICAL that they be plumb and level. Wally is correct about concrete.The typical compressive strength of a concrete garage floor is 4,000 PSI. Because the lift is very level and plumb, the weight of the car it is supporting is mostly focused downward, with little force exerted in any other direction. Your uprights are probably either 6" or 8" square.If they are 6" square, they will safely support 144,000 pounds of downforce. If you need further help, send me an e-mail along with the brand of lift and I can probably find a manual in my office or get one from one of my suppliers and e-mail it to you.

TAREK

Thank you all for the valuable input!

Wally,
The floor piece (top view) is a stretched "H", 11'6" horizontally, and 5' tall at the ends. The base of the upright columns occupy 12"x12" at the center of the 5' tall ends. Seems that your idea of steel extensions is already built-in the design!

Jack,
The column cover says "HYDRALIFT 28" in large letters, from top to bottom. The base area of the uprights is 12"x12" or slightly more. The more I look at it and measure it, the more I realize this is a heavy duty lift, that is probably capable of more than 12,000 lbs. I would greatly appreciate it if you can dig up documentation on it !!!

Gregg,
The lift definitely fastens to concrete. I'll be trying to get a pic or hand sketch. The base of the lift has holes for fastening to the ground.

Tresamore,
None of the manufacturers I found carried the same design. They could only help me with installation of their design, which is generally a much smaller base than the one I have (and without the Tee-ends) and generally require 4" of steel reinforced concrete floor.

Tarek

Jack Riffle

Tarek,
The toll free number for Hydralift is 1-800-387-5718. I have the installation manual en-route to me. Should have it within the hour. Would you like me to scan it in and e-mail it to you?

TAREK

Jack,

Will have to buy you a drink sometime. Whichever method that is easiest for you. Sounds like an emailed scaned copy will work for you...and I would greatly appreciate that

thanks again
tchbeir@aol.com

Tarek

Jack Riffle

Tarek,
The faxed copy I received wasn't good enough to re-scan and e-mail, so I got it direct from Hydralift by e-mail and forwarded it to you. Check your e-mail. It should be there. If it isn't, e-mail me and let me know and I will re-send. BTW-I drink Foster's.

dr bob

I'm in the process of having the garage floor replaced, part of the third-bay and shop expansion project. Part of that reasoning is all the cracks and damage that the 50-year old garage floor can put up with in the shaky soCal area. And of course I want to have the option of putting in a lift if I feel the need and have the budget at the same time. So I did some research, and found that the locally-made lifts are looking for enough concrete to hold a 4"-deep cinch anchor, or have anchor bolts set into the concrete. For the cinch anchor you need at least 5" concrete. FWIW, a standard home garage floor here is formed with 2x4's, so it's 3.5" thick at the edges, may be more or less in the middle but you can't tell easily from the top. You can drill some test holes for the anchors and see if you crash into dirt before you drill five inches.

Spec for my floor is 6" of 3500psi concrete (compare with the 2500psi that is standard here...), with #4 (half-inch) rebar on 12" centers plus a single mat near the top. It's overkill on the steel but it's cheap insurance against future cracks. Concrete guys will tell you that concrete always cracks, it's just a question of when. Use enough steel and hopefully that 'when' will be long after I'm gone.

The outfit that I talked to is in Santa Paula, an hour or two from where I live near L.A. They offer free delivery if I can unload it, should be interesting... I am adding a triple-thick header over the new garage bay, strong enough to hold a 1000lb capacity trolley beam and hopefully strong enough to lift the two posts into place once the anchors are set. At least I'll have the trolley and a chainfall hoist no matter what.

Hopefully by now you have the install manual from Hydra-lift. Please post what their concrete requirements are. I'm interested.

TAREK

Dr Bob,

I have the Hydralift manual as a .dat file that I'm unable to open. Looking for alternate formats or a software package to help me open it. awaiting Jack's response on the alternate format.

Sounds like your new floor would be adequate for any type lift you decide on, and I'm pretty sure you're within the requirements of hydralift as well. I expect less stringent cement floor requirements for my model, as it has side extensions that spread the load and aid in weight balancing. But will have to confirm from the manual.

The trolley is a great idea, but does it slide far enough to exactly over the location of the upright columns? I would imagine if the trolley beam was held on rolling A-frames like the stuff sold by Harbor Freight, you can get more leverage and more precision for positioning the upright columns. I would also caution against using human power for pushing, holding or lifting any of the components. They're far too heavy for that, not to mention the dangers of snapping chains and straps. (2 HD chains snapped during the unloading of my lift) I plan on renting a bobcat-type (but bigger) mounted crane or hoist of some sort for installation. I don't need to reach high for mounting a crossbar, as my crossbar is the drive-over floor-mount type.

My lift was delivered on a trailer and I had to deal with unloading on my own...onto another Heavy Duty boat trailer (mine). Best way was to use the boom on a wrecker to lift the pieces one a time, without moving the wrecker, move the trailer out of the way and replace with my own trailer then pull out my trailer and bring the delivery trailer back in. The whole idea was for not moving the wrecker at all, as I had limited vertical maneuvering space (low clearance power and phone cables), while needing to use the neighbors lawn for the wrecker and did not want to ruin his grass. Had to do this at least 3 times as there are 3 major (heavy) pieces to the system, and it looked idiotic, but it minimized (rather eliminated) the swinging of VERY HEAVY loads, and made for safer operation of chains and straps. Of course larger heavy duty cranes, hoists and earth moving equipment can do a better job if you have access to them. My next challenge is to unload the pieces off the trailer for installation in the garage following floor prepping, of course.

will post updates

Tarek

Jack Riffle

Tarek,
You can view and work with the lift documentation by opening the file with Adobe Acrobat. If you don't have this program on your computer, do a search for Adobe Acrobat. Downloadable from many sites for free. Worst case scenario, call the toll-free number ( 800-387-5718 ) ask for Christine Hammond, and have her fax the 9 page manual to a fax number of your choosing. My third time fax wasn't good enough to re-send, but no problem with the DAT file by using Adobe Acrobat. For those interested, minimum concrete thickness according to the manual is 3-1/2". Rebar WILL NOT KEEP CONCRETE FROM CRACKING. All it does, is keep the concrete from seperating, and the peices from migrating away from each other, when it does crack. Hope this helps help.
Regards

TAREK

Jack,

DUH!!! double clicking did not bring out Acrobat Reader so I assumed it's not readable by it. I used the File menu ...Open xxxxx.dat and opened with no problem ! and I'm supposed to put together a lift that can handle 1000's of pounds !!!

ok...so I now owe you more Foster's

thanks again and I will post updates on the installation

Tarek

Jack Riffle

Tarek.
If you really get desperate, I can be bought, but I'M NOT CHEAP! It would cost you expenses and MANY Fosters, but I might be willing to travel if you need help to install the lift. God knows, i've done plenty of them and underground lifts too. Yell if you need me.

Ron_H

Jack's right about the rebar not preventing cracks. If you want to minimize the risk of cracking, take pains to cure your concrete properly and SLOWLY. Keep it wet longer and put a membrane over it while it is curing. <img border="0" alt="[bigbye]" title="" src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" />