Oil change
03-15-2002, 03:38 PM
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Oil change
I have a quick group of questions. I want to change the oil in my 928 this week end. I ordered an owners manual from Dave at 928 Specialists. But it will not be here until Monday. I want to change the oil now. How much goes in? What weight oil? What size/brand filter? And what brand Oil? On my air intake cover the Shell logo is stuck on there and something about only using Shell products. Did Porsche do that? What do you guys run in yours? <img src="confused.gif" border="0">
03-15-2002, 03:54 PM
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Chucker-
Funny thing; I'm going to do mine tomorrow. I purchase my filters from one of the big three, though there is a Fram available-good luck finding one...
As to oil, there are as many opinions as there are grains of sand at the beach. Personnaly, I use Castrol GTX 20/50 year-round here in Florida.
Many people will tell you to use synthetic.
Synthetic motor oil is three times as expensive and I'm not convinced that there is any advantage when used in a relatively unstressed engine such as the M28 series along with oil changes at 3000 miles/3 month intervals.
What's more, a former student of mine who was a chemical/petroleum engineer told me that unless you are running a racing engine or a fairly high boost turbo that the synthetic oil's resistance to thermal breakdown is never really an issue. Furthermore, I think they say that it can increase horsepower a tiny bit through lower internal friction. I suppose, but with 310 hp already, I doubt I would feel any difference if a few more were added.
My recommendation: pick a decent name-brand oil, change it every 3 months/3000 miles, check it regularly. I buy my filters whenever I buy a part or a goody from one of the 928 suppliers [saves shipping costs], and fill the new one with oil just before I put it on. Have your old oil recycled, please. Be careful jacking your car up to get at the oil drain plug and filter! You'll need 8 quarts, and I always change the drain washer.
Hope it helps! <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />
Normy~
Funny thing; I'm going to do mine tomorrow. I purchase my filters from one of the big three, though there is a Fram available-good luck finding one...
As to oil, there are as many opinions as there are grains of sand at the beach. Personnaly, I use Castrol GTX 20/50 year-round here in Florida.
Many people will tell you to use synthetic.
Synthetic motor oil is three times as expensive and I'm not convinced that there is any advantage when used in a relatively unstressed engine such as the M28 series along with oil changes at 3000 miles/3 month intervals.
What's more, a former student of mine who was a chemical/petroleum engineer told me that unless you are running a racing engine or a fairly high boost turbo that the synthetic oil's resistance to thermal breakdown is never really an issue. Furthermore, I think they say that it can increase horsepower a tiny bit through lower internal friction. I suppose, but with 310 hp already, I doubt I would feel any difference if a few more were added.
My recommendation: pick a decent name-brand oil, change it every 3 months/3000 miles, check it regularly. I buy my filters whenever I buy a part or a goody from one of the 928 suppliers [saves shipping costs], and fill the new one with oil just before I put it on. Have your old oil recycled, please. Be careful jacking your car up to get at the oil drain plug and filter! You'll need 8 quarts, and I always change the drain washer.
Hope it helps! <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />
Normy~
03-15-2002, 04:10 PM
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but you'll need 9 quarts and a big catch basin when you drain the old stuff out. The last time I used 8 quarts, I ended up low on the dipstick.
The difference between the High and Low marks on the dipstick is 1.6 quarts.
The owner's manual suggests that oil can be changed as infrequently as every 15,000 miles or 12 months, whichever is less. However, I think we all agree that it is prudent to change more frequently considering the ages of our sharks.
In my experience, avoid synthetic oils....they tend to allow leaks where normal oils do not because the synthetics have the ability to pass through holes in the seal too small for normal oil. YMMV.
Good luck! <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />
The difference between the High and Low marks on the dipstick is 1.6 quarts.
The owner's manual suggests that oil can be changed as infrequently as every 15,000 miles or 12 months, whichever is less. However, I think we all agree that it is prudent to change more frequently considering the ages of our sharks.
In my experience, avoid synthetic oils....they tend to allow leaks where normal oils do not because the synthetics have the ability to pass through holes in the seal too small for normal oil. YMMV.
Good luck! <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />
03-15-2002, 04:21 PM
#4
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Hey Chucker,
You will find that people use all sorts of dino and synthetic oil. Synthetic may leak through seals on Hi-Mi cars, but has it's advantages. I use red-line. Many use Mobil 1. I like synthetic and use it in 3 of my 5 cars and trucks. I have always beleived that synthetic travels to the top-end faster when an engine is started in extremely cold weather. (That will probably get a response!)Do a search through these lists and you will see many a discussion on oil.
Please note that there is a crush ring on the pan drain bolt which should (read-"must") be replaced each time the bolt is taken out. I had a drip at the bolt because the PO had removed the crush ring altogether. A new crush ring at oil change stopped the leak.
-I would advise that you call D.R. and get a genuine porsche oil filter and a crush ring. Be careful not to over-tighten the drain plug.
Have a BIG catch-pan (or two regular pans)ready to catch the oil. There's more oil in the car (or should be) than the typical 5-6 quart pans made for oil changes can hold.
I am learning as a new owner myself, that it is worth the wait to get the proper parts to do the job right. Genuine parts and a wealth of advise on this and other sites (as well as Dave, Jeannie and Wally) should go along way in keeping your car in good repair.
Greg
You will find that people use all sorts of dino and synthetic oil. Synthetic may leak through seals on Hi-Mi cars, but has it's advantages. I use red-line. Many use Mobil 1. I like synthetic and use it in 3 of my 5 cars and trucks. I have always beleived that synthetic travels to the top-end faster when an engine is started in extremely cold weather. (That will probably get a response!)Do a search through these lists and you will see many a discussion on oil.
Please note that there is a crush ring on the pan drain bolt which should (read-"must") be replaced each time the bolt is taken out. I had a drip at the bolt because the PO had removed the crush ring altogether. A new crush ring at oil change stopped the leak.
-I would advise that you call D.R. and get a genuine porsche oil filter and a crush ring. Be careful not to over-tighten the drain plug.
Have a BIG catch-pan (or two regular pans)ready to catch the oil. There's more oil in the car (or should be) than the typical 5-6 quart pans made for oil changes can hold.
I am learning as a new owner myself, that it is worth the wait to get the proper parts to do the job right. Genuine parts and a wealth of advise on this and other sites (as well as Dave, Jeannie and Wally) should go along way in keeping your car in good repair.
Greg
03-15-2002, 04:27 PM
#5
Three Wheelin'
Big Dave,
Mine was close to 10 quarts. I pulled the drain plug and filter, lowered the jack so the the car was back to level, let the oil drip out and returned in about an hour. (I think I got it all.)
Greg
Mine was close to 10 quarts. I pulled the drain plug and filter, lowered the jack so the the car was back to level, let the oil drip out and returned in about an hour. (I think I got it all.)
Greg
03-15-2002, 05:51 PM
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Normy, what is the drain washer? And thanks to every one for all of the good tips. Like the one about the crush ring (Greg). <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />
03-15-2002, 07:10 PM
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I take my car to an Instant Oil Change - hand them a new Porsche oil filter and drain plug crush washer (get 'em to knock a few bucks off for supplying my own), tell them to fill it up with 8.5 quarts of Castrol 20/50 dino, and I'm out of there in 20 minutes - all for around 45 samolians.
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03-15-2002, 07:27 PM
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I have found one oil change place that I trust. I have a friend that used to manage a chain down in Fla. He refered to the chain as IFFY LUBE, because he knew what type of people they hired. I'm going to try to take care of this car myself to the best of my ability. I just ordered two filters from Dave Roberts and two crush rings. Hey Big Dave, come to Michigan to change your oil. The most that I have ever paid is 28 bucks for the whole job. What is the Drain Washer? <img src="graemlins/yltype.gif" border="0" alt="[typing]" />
03-15-2002, 07:33 PM
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Oops, I miss typed. I was inviting Randy V. to Michigan for the oil change. Some how I got confused. Sorry. But, Big Dave can come too. <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />
03-15-2002, 08:23 PM
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One more thing comes to mind-
During my aviation training, I had a class on reciprocating engines. They taught us that an engine which has been run on synthetic needs to continue to see synthetic, and vice versa. The reason for this, the professor explained, was to prevent "kudos" [his word; he was kinda weird...] from coming loose from various nooks and crannies within the engine and plugging up the filter or tight passages. "Kudos" in his useage meant deposits that develop within all engines, regardless of oil type. It seems that changing oil type can cause this.
At least in big recip aircraft engines...
I've not heard anything regarding deleterious effects of changing oil type in M28 engines, but you might consider contacting the PO and asking what he has been using.
Normy
'85 S2
During my aviation training, I had a class on reciprocating engines. They taught us that an engine which has been run on synthetic needs to continue to see synthetic, and vice versa. The reason for this, the professor explained, was to prevent "kudos" [his word; he was kinda weird...] from coming loose from various nooks and crannies within the engine and plugging up the filter or tight passages. "Kudos" in his useage meant deposits that develop within all engines, regardless of oil type. It seems that changing oil type can cause this.
At least in big recip aircraft engines...
I've not heard anything regarding deleterious effects of changing oil type in M28 engines, but you might consider contacting the PO and asking what he has been using.
Normy
'85 S2
03-15-2002, 08:37 PM
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I had heard the same about oils, need to stick to the same as before. And some purists that I have spoken to have said the same about sticking with one brand for the life of an engine. Now here is the difficult part. The PO is now deceased. My understanding is that he was killed in a 911 accident. He bought this car wrecked and sent it off to the body shop. And then was never able to continue with the project. So I am assuming that it is (real oil). Normy, maybe in aviation those nooks and kranys get filled while the enginge is upside down? I think/hope that my 928 has never been in that situation. <img src="graemlins/jumper.gif" border="0" alt="[jumper]" />
03-16-2002, 02:37 PM
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One last note, Because of the location of the drain plug it's important that you change your oil on an incline. If you're on a flat surface, raise the front end, and drain the oil some oil will not completely get out of the oil-pan. It will pool toward the back of the engine. Park your shark on a driveway or on the street if you have a slight incline with the nose of the car facing downward. Then Put it in gear, lock up the parking brake, block the rear wheels, and raise the front end. At least this way when the front end is raised the car will be closer to level and all of the old oil will drain from the car before refilling.
Lastly, after you've changed the oil bring the car down from your jacks and let the car idle for a few minutes. After that shut down, raise the car back up and inspect for any leaks before you replace the belly pan and the front spoiler skirt. The first time I changed my oil I didn't tighten the filter enough and had to remove the belly pan to get to the filter again later.
As for my opinion on oil, I get my filters from 928 Intl. They're a German or Yugoslavian brand, not sure the make. But, if those guys sell them they must be good. Always replace the crush ring, even the drain plug after 10K or so, for oil I use Mobil 1, 10/40 in Sunny Socal.
Lastly, after you've changed the oil bring the car down from your jacks and let the car idle for a few minutes. After that shut down, raise the car back up and inspect for any leaks before you replace the belly pan and the front spoiler skirt. The first time I changed my oil I didn't tighten the filter enough and had to remove the belly pan to get to the filter again later.
As for my opinion on oil, I get my filters from 928 Intl. They're a German or Yugoslavian brand, not sure the make. But, if those guys sell them they must be good. Always replace the crush ring, even the drain plug after 10K or so, for oil I use Mobil 1, 10/40 in Sunny Socal.
