Formula94lt1

Just wondering if you walk up to buy a car claimed to be euro, what are some easy ways to tell if it is. Also how do you tell its a euro engine?

Shark Attack

some basics are:

these are hints but not a sure thing:

the body moldings.. euros 99% of the time didnt have them
Most euros are 5 speed
Euros have mid ship marker-turn signal lights behind the front wheel, but in front of the door
same euros do not have front and rear corner marker lights
VIN is not a US vin
Engine number also is an easy check and is a check worth making to make sure its a euro engine. If the car is late enough model where it was 300 HP vs the US 210.... Early Euro cars are not 300HP by the way.
interior on some were Pasha.. (spelling may be wrong)
headlights were smaller diameter
gauge cluter warning lights will be in german
4-way flasher switch is in a differnt location that US ( euro located down by clock)
thats all i can think of off the top of my head

Kyle

RicerSchnitzzle

Vin number will begin with ZZZ instead of WP0. First digit of serial number (after the 8)will be a 4 if it's an "S" 300hp/310hp motor. S engine codes ar M28/11,12,21,22 Here's how to find the engine code (From 928gt.com)

Engine code

Other possible clues.
1.Side markers in front of the doors.
2.Corner markers bolted on car when federalized.
3.Rear bumberrettes missing from lisence plate area.
4.Dash warning lights in German
5.Head light adjustment **** next to driver seat.
6.Pair of lederhosen in hatch area with an accordian and tuba.
7.Rear red foglight.



Edit: Dammit SharkAttack beat me to it.

jyoon

tranny is different, twin distributor engine on 84, larger throttle body, duel tube exhaust

obersturm

Hi Terra,

"Pair of lederhosen in hatch area with an accordian and tuba"



Thats a dead giveaway lol

I would stick to the WPO ZZZ Vin to be sure.
Manuals are as rare if not rarer in Europe as in the States. Roumor has it, that only 25% of all 62000 cars ever produced where manuals.

Best regards from Down Under

Martin

jon928se

As Martin says

Chassis number - will be WPOZZZ92S........ for cars later than 1980? or 1981? - US has something instead of ZZZ

If a 928 S then more importantly is the engine number as that is the main reason for wanting a Euro 928 - either the early 4.7 with 300hp or the later S2 with 310hp.

Everything else is largely irrelevant and could have been changed to federalise a Euro into US or even faked to make a US delievered car seem to be a Euro.

Formula94lt1

Awesome info guys...

Vilhuer

There are so many mistakes in some of the previous messages its hard to decide from what to begin.

> the body moldings.. euros 99% of the time didnt have them

After side moldings were intorduced in '81 MY most euros got them also.

> Most euros are 5 speed

Not true in most MY. Only '78 and perhaps '79 MY are mostly manuals. After that its close tie on '80-81 and more automatics after that. Especially '84 and later automatic is much more common than manual. Its true that in most years manual percentage is little more hiher than in US, this up to '91 MY. On GTS manual % is much higher in US than in ROW cars but US production was so small (1/6 of ROW GTS made) that absolute number of manual GTS is higher in ROW markets.

> Euros have mid ship marker-turn signal lights behind the front wheel, but in front of the door
> same euros do not have front and rear corner marker lights

Some early MY euros do not have turn signals between front wheel and door.

> VIN is not a US vin

This it true. Real deciding factor is 13th digit in '81-95 17 digit long VIN. There is also single one digit in earlier chassis number which will tell if car is ROW or US. VDS code in US VIN positions 4th trough 6 th is only present on plate in window and door sticker. US '81-95 body is also stamped with ZZZ VIN on front fender area.

> If the car is late enough model where it was 300 HP vs the US 210.... Early Euro cars are not
> 300HP by the way.

ROW '78-79 is 240 hp, '80-82 can be either 240 or 300 depending if it is 4,5L or 4,7L.

> interior on some were Pasha.. (spelling may be wrong)

So were many early US cars.

> headlights were smaller diameter

ROW lights are 1" larger than US crome ringed lights.

> gauge cluter warning lights will be in german

Not always. Several other languages were available. It depends on to what market car was originally meant for.

> 4-way flasher switch is in a differnt location that US ( euro located down by clock)

This is due to euros having more light switches at pod.

Euros got some changes earlier than US model. For example 4.5L ROW cars have S brakes starting from middle of '80 MY while Us 4.5L got them from '82 MY. All ROW S have obviously S brakes.

IcemanG17

all ROW (rest of world) cars has ZZZ in the middle of the vin...& so do american market cars on the metal tag stamped on the front fender.... There are other little things like rear fog lights, bumperettes, side markers and sometime mud flaps that all come from different markets..... But you would have to give us a specific model year to know for sure!

The "euro" engine was only really different from 1980-1986 in the 4.7L 16V form...from 1987 on all the engines were the same with only slight differences in the exhausts, some had cats and others didn't....

Mark

Engine type number ("M28/xx"), per this chart - thanks to 928 Specialists for the chart....

928 Engine Types & Performance Data


928 Model
Engine Size/Type HP (SAE) Torque ft/lbs (SAE) Comp. Ratio Fuel Injection System Top Speed MPH 0-62 mph (sec)
1/4 mile (sec) Weight (lbs)
77-79 - 3-auto (US) 4.5L-16v M28/04 219 245 8.5:1 K-Jetronic 140 8.5
16 3373
77-79 - 5-man (US) 4.5L-16v M28/03 219 245 8.5:1 K-Jetronic 143 7.5 15.5 3285
77-79 - 3-auto (Euro) 4.5L-16v M28/02 229 250 8.5:1 K-Jetronic 140 8 16 3197
77-79 - 5-man (Euro) 4.5L-16v M28/01 229 250 8.5:1 K-Jetronic 143 6.8 15.5 3197
80 - 3-auto (US) 4.5L-16v M28/14 220 265 9.0:1 L-Jetronic 140 8.5 16 3385

80 - 5-man (US) 4.5L-16v M28/13 220 265 9.0:1 L-Jetronic
143 7.5 15.5 3351

81-82 - 3-auto (US) 4.5L-16v M28/16 220 265 9.0:1 L-Jetronic 140 8.5 16 3385

81-82 - 5-man (US) 4.5L-16v M28/15 220 265 9.0:1 L-Jetronic
143 7.5 15.5 3351

80-82 - 3-auto (Euro) 4.5L-16v M28/10 229 271 10.0:1 K-Jetronic 140 7.7 16 3197
80-82 - 5-man (Euro) 4.5L-16v M28/09 229 271 10.0:1 K-Jetronic 143 7.2 15.5 3197
80-83 S - 3-auto (Euro) 4.7L-16v M28/12
300 263 10.0:1 K-Jetronic 152 7.2 15.5 3197
80-83 S - 5-man (Euro) 4.7L-16v M28/11
300 263 10.0:1 K-Jetronic 155 6.6 15.2 3197
83-84 S - 4-auto (US) 4.7L-16v M28/20
234 263 9.3:1 L-Jetronic 143 7.2 15.5
3385
83-84 S - 5-man (US) 4.7L-16v M28/19 234 263 9.3:1 L-Jetronic 146 6.8 15.2
3351

84-86 S - 4-auto (Euro) 4.7L-16v M28/22 310 295 10.4:1 LH-Jetronic 150 6.7 15.5 3308
84-86 S - 5-man (Euro) 4.7L-16v M28/21 310 295 10.4:1 LH-Jetronic 155 6.2 15.2 3308
85-86 S - 4-auto (US) 5.0L-32v M28/44 288 302 10.10:1 LH-Jetronic 152 6.8
14.9 3439
85-86 S - 5-man (US) 5.0L-32v M28/43 288 302 10.10:1 LH-Jetronic 155 6.3
14.2 3351
87-88 S4 - 4-auto (US) 5.0L-32v M28/42
316 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 162 6.6 14.7 3550
87-88 S4 - 5-man (US) 5.0L-32v M28/41 316 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 165 6.0 14.5 3505
87-88 S4 - 4-auto(Euro) 5.0L-32v M28/42 316 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 165 6.3 14.5 3484
87-88 S4 - 5-man(Euro) 5.0L-32v M28/41 316 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 168 5.9 14.2 3484
89 S4 5-man 5.0L-32v M28/41 316 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 168 5.9 14.2 3505
89-91 S4 - 4-auto 5.0L-32v M28/42 316 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 165 6.3 14.5 3550
89-91 GT 5-man 5.0L-32v M28/47 326 317 10.0:1 LH-Jetronic 171 5.8 14.1 3505
92-95 GTS - 5-man 5.4L-32v M28/49 345 369 10.4:1 LH-Jetronic 171 5.7 13.7 3593
92-95 GTS - 4-auto 5.4L-32v M28/50 345 369 10.4:1 LH-Jetronic 171 5.9 14.1 3593

RicerSchnitzzle

[QUOTE=Vilhuer;4471656]There are so many mistakes in some of the previous messages its hard to decide from what to begin.
> VIN is not a US vin

This it true. Real deciding factor is 13th digit in '81-95 17 digit long VIN. There is also single one digit in earlier chassis number which will tell if car is ROW or US. VDS code in US VIN positions 4th trough 6 th is only present on plate in window and door sticker. US '81-95 body is also stamped with ZZZ VIN on front fender area.

> 4-way flasher switch is in a differnt location that US ( euro located down by clock)

This is due to euros having more light switches at pod.

1. What will the 13th digit be for a Euro? 13th digit is the body/engine code. A 4 indicates Euro S 300/310hp, but is 0 for non S Euros with a 2 for US 78-82 and a 6 for 83+ US models? Seems to be the trend. Not sure on GT and GTS.
Body for US may have ZZZ stamped on it in the passenger side wheel well, but plate by hood latch and A pillar VIN's will not.

2.My Euro has 4 way flasher on the pod right below the rear defroster. Even shows it that way in the Euro's owner manual. What MY did they start putting it down by the clock?

As said before the engine is the reason most want a Euro S. Check the block M28/11,12 or 21,22, heads (104.348) and even TB (110.99) and intake runners. (110.295-298). If it matches top to bottom go for it.

Vilhuer

It depends on model. 0 is 4.5L ROW and also GTS, ROW S4 and GT is 4.

Its much easier to change hood latch and A pillar plates than fender stamping. Its strange that US authorities use parts which are easier to change to identify body. Then again Porsche could have put VDS code VIN into fender too. They didn't because they didn't necessarily know what safety options car would eventually get on production line and VDS code needs to reflect what style seatbelts and airbags are installed.

It was down on center console in '78-79 MY. Can't remember if it was there in some later years also but IIRR it was moved up on '80 MY.

This is true. Many '80-82 MY buyers have been fooled in Europe too to think they are geting S version simply because car has S spoilers. Best way is to check VIN, engine and gearbox numbers to be sure what parts are included.

Brian B

The 4 way flasher on my 79 Euro is down by the clock.

My fenders had no marker lights. When it came here, the PO put on Toyota lights in the fenders to pass inspection (I think)

I also have an automatic, german gauges and rub strips...

SMTCapeCod

I still want to know whattheheck the "Austria Equipment Package" that Porsche put on my COA is...Emissions? Guage language? what?

VinnyC

OK, So please help me decipher this.
Is this 1980 928 VIN# 92A0820967 a Real Euro car or not?? 300HP or Not??
Recently seen on e-bay - I'm interested in buying this car if indeed it is a real 300HP euro. Notice the marker light on rear bumper...

Please help.


Thanks!!