928 Tires: None are Quiet
08-07-2007, 01:44 PM
#16
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by dr bob
I'm in with Garth and Gary on the Michelins. I had the MXX3 pilots on the 17" rims when bought them, and they were so much quieter (and stickier) than the OEM-spec BFG's that I thought I'd hit the jackpot. The MXX3 Pilots were original on many Porsche cars earlier in this decade, including the C4 from which mine were removed. Except they didn't last very long, mostly due to a poor alignment and then my aversion to using the brake pedal in the local mountains.
Fast-forward to the PS-2 replacements, which are another order of magnitude quieter than the MXX3 versions. These are not the all-season version, but the summer performance version appropriate for the SoCal coastal desert climate. I love the quiet, love the grip, looks are fine, cost is higher than the Kumho's and Yoko's but worth it IMHO.
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Dooing a casual search on Tire Rack for 16" tires, there was a BFG model that got great reviews including positive comparisons to the Michelin Pilot MXX3. Both quiet and sticky they said. I take a lot of these reviews with a grain of salt, mostly because the comparisons are biased towards the new tire over the memory of the old, bruised, worn-out carcasses that they replace. My reviews are probably biased similarly. In most cases, even a new inexpensive tire will "sound" and "feel" better than the worn-outs that just came off, right? So if you write a review after only a few hundred miles of new tire driving, of course they will be better than what was on there. Plus not many folks will ever write that they made a most horrible mistake buying the Pizzuzi's when all the reviews said they were great. I'm on my second set of front PS2's now, and did the rears for the first time with these new fronts so all are new. The new ones aren't significantly quieter than the ones that I took off, but at least there's a little more gap between the tops of the wear bars and the pavement.
I've ridden in a few other 928's in the ten years now since I bought mine. All of them had RMB's and tire noise was not noticeable. In the meanwhile, I really like quiet so the Michelins will probably get the nod from me until there's some experience that's head-and-shoulders above them. Ryan Perrella came by the house here for a look at his car a year or two ago, and we took my car for a quick ride to the polaps for brake fluid or something. He instantly commented on how quiet the car is, especially compared to his GT with RMB. I did a mini-PPI for SteveG's GTS over in Burbank, an RMB car with lots of extra tire and better shocks. Test drive was short, mostly because there was no good way to listen for car noises over the exhaust. H, maybe you can just get an RMB to mask the tire noise, then wear earplugs to mask the RMB din! Until then, get a ride in a car with the PS-2's and see if they will do the job for you.
Fast-forward to the PS-2 replacements, which are another order of magnitude quieter than the MXX3 versions. These are not the all-season version, but the summer performance version appropriate for the SoCal coastal desert climate. I love the quiet, love the grip, looks are fine, cost is higher than the Kumho's and Yoko's but worth it IMHO.
-----
Dooing a casual search on Tire Rack for 16" tires, there was a BFG model that got great reviews including positive comparisons to the Michelin Pilot MXX3. Both quiet and sticky they said. I take a lot of these reviews with a grain of salt, mostly because the comparisons are biased towards the new tire over the memory of the old, bruised, worn-out carcasses that they replace. My reviews are probably biased similarly. In most cases, even a new inexpensive tire will "sound" and "feel" better than the worn-outs that just came off, right? So if you write a review after only a few hundred miles of new tire driving, of course they will be better than what was on there. Plus not many folks will ever write that they made a most horrible mistake buying the Pizzuzi's when all the reviews said they were great. I'm on my second set of front PS2's now, and did the rears for the first time with these new fronts so all are new. The new ones aren't significantly quieter than the ones that I took off, but at least there's a little more gap between the tops of the wear bars and the pavement.
I've ridden in a few other 928's in the ten years now since I bought mine. All of them had RMB's and tire noise was not noticeable. In the meanwhile, I really like quiet so the Michelins will probably get the nod from me until there's some experience that's head-and-shoulders above them. Ryan Perrella came by the house here for a look at his car a year or two ago, and we took my car for a quick ride to the polaps for brake fluid or something. He instantly commented on how quiet the car is, especially compared to his GT with RMB. I did a mini-PPI for SteveG's GTS over in Burbank, an RMB car with lots of extra tire and better shocks. Test drive was short, mostly because there was no good way to listen for car noises over the exhaust. H, maybe you can just get an RMB to mask the tire noise, then wear earplugs to mask the RMB din! Until then, get a ride in a car with the PS-2's and see if they will do the job for you.
I agree I run the PS2's on all my cars I have 5 sets and they are by far quieter than all the others. They do have a soft side wall but have great traction under all conditions and are the quietest tire I have owned. They still make noise but nothing compared to the MXX3's or S02's
08-07-2007, 02:02 PM
#17
Rennlist Member
I run Conti Sport Contact 2 Z- and Y-rated on my GTS. They are fairly quiet, I like them. All tires get noisier when they wear down. Still the noise level is acceptable for a 15 year old sports car.
I think people forget that the the suspension design is from the mid 70's. If I compare it to a noise level of a modern every day car, there is no comparison. Especially the BMW's, Audi's and Mercedes are exceptionally quiet. Regardless of speed. Modern sound reduction materials in new cars are lightyears ahead of the materials used in the 928.
I think people forget that the the suspension design is from the mid 70's. If I compare it to a noise level of a modern every day car, there is no comparison. Especially the BMW's, Audi's and Mercedes are exceptionally quiet. Regardless of speed. Modern sound reduction materials in new cars are lightyears ahead of the materials used in the 928.
08-07-2007, 03:14 PM
#18
Drifting
Tire Rack reviews on tires are okay, but I've found that when it comes to tires, one man's trash is another's treasure. You'll see ten stellar reviews for a tire and then someone trashes it. It's just that everyone has expectations that are vastly different. And regardless of what you build or sell, you're not going to please everyone. When reading their reviews, I prefer to look for trends. If 80% of the people give a tire a good rating, chances are, it's probably decent.
I've been driving now for 15 years. Due to spending so much time in rural environments, I've probably driven at least a half million miles, and likely more, which is actually quite a lot in 15 years. What I know from my own experience is that tires have come a LONG way from what was around not too long ago. I remember back in '95 my father hired a doctor who had one of the Caprice based Impalas. Everyone was nuts over those things. They had huge 17 inch tires with a fairly high profile. Everyone told this guy how cool they thought his car was. He told them he was going to sell it as soon as he could. At that time, only BFGoodrich made a tire that fit. Every single time he had an issue that required replacement of the tire, it cost him about $300. That was just 10-12 years ago. Now, just about every single family sedan out there comes with 16s or 17s, with 18 inch tires being an option or even standard at the higher end.
As much as people's fragile egos can't handle this, every 928 out there is an old car. Its design goes back well over 30 years at this point. 90% of the tires that were in use when these were made, aren't in use any longer and have been replaced with tires that are much newer and better. Since the newest 928s are now 12, and the majority of those in regular use are from the S4 period, I would look for other issues that could cause road noise. Issues like funky, deteriorated sound insulation.
I've been driving now for 15 years. Due to spending so much time in rural environments, I've probably driven at least a half million miles, and likely more, which is actually quite a lot in 15 years. What I know from my own experience is that tires have come a LONG way from what was around not too long ago. I remember back in '95 my father hired a doctor who had one of the Caprice based Impalas. Everyone was nuts over those things. They had huge 17 inch tires with a fairly high profile. Everyone told this guy how cool they thought his car was. He told them he was going to sell it as soon as he could. At that time, only BFGoodrich made a tire that fit. Every single time he had an issue that required replacement of the tire, it cost him about $300. That was just 10-12 years ago. Now, just about every single family sedan out there comes with 16s or 17s, with 18 inch tires being an option or even standard at the higher end.
As much as people's fragile egos can't handle this, every 928 out there is an old car. Its design goes back well over 30 years at this point. 90% of the tires that were in use when these were made, aren't in use any longer and have been replaced with tires that are much newer and better. Since the newest 928s are now 12, and the majority of those in regular use are from the S4 period, I would look for other issues that could cause road noise. Issues like funky, deteriorated sound insulation.
08-07-2007, 04:58 PM
#19
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by JHowell37
Since the newest 928s are now 12, and the majority of those in regular use are from the S4 period, I would look for other issues that could cause road noise. Issues like funky, deteriorated sound insulation.
I feel like I'm being ignored.
In other than the GTS, there is very little sound deadening for the rear wheel wells, and lots of empty space for sound to bounce around in and be amplified. Fill up those spaces, and you eliminate virtually all of the noise. I have just about zero road noise from the rear. Even the quietest tire is going to be loud in a 928 if you don't do something about the acoustics back there.
08-07-2007, 05:06 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by fabric
I feel like I'm being ignored. In other than the GTS, there is very little sound deadening for the rear wheel wells, and lots of empty space for sound to bounce around in and be amplified. Fill up those spaces, and you eliminate virtually all of the noise. I have just about zero road noise from the rear. Even the quietest tire is going to be loud in a 928 if you don't do something about the acoustics back there.
In other than the GTS, there is very little sound deadening for the rear wheel wells, and lots of empty space for sound to bounce around in and be amplified. Fill up those spaces, and you eliminate virtually all of the noise. I have just about zero road noise from the rear. Even the quietest tire is going to be loud in a 928 if you don't do something about the acoustics back there.I might be wrong but I don't think the gTS has much if an any additional sound deadening material back there. I can here all sorts of tire and drivetrain noise in my GTS and I don't recall my 80 being any louder. Although you might be right a little dynamat might help out.
08-07-2007, 05:39 PM
#21
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by cobalt
I might be wrong but I don't think the gTS has much if an any additional sound deadening material back there. I can here all sorts of tire and drivetrain noise in my GTS and I don't recall my 80 being any louder. Although you might be right a little dynamat might help out.
08-07-2007, 05:49 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
I bought some Falken 452's a few months ago and thought they were pieces of **** due to the noise. Turns out one of my front wheel bearing races was not in very good condition.
I never really realized the problem before because I always drove with the windows open. But with the windows closed my tires got really loud.
Falken's are still not as good as my GY F1s. But not bad wet/dry traction, cheap, and are quiet.
A long way of saying maybe it's not your tires.
I never really realized the problem before because I always drove with the windows open. But with the windows closed my tires got really loud.
Falken's are still not as good as my GY F1s. But not bad wet/dry traction, cheap, and are quiet.
A long way of saying maybe it's not your tires.
08-07-2007, 06:29 PM
#24
Chronic Tool Dropper
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IIRC, starting sometime in 1991MY there's a wheelwell liner in the right rear, similar to what's installed in previous years' left rear. Those right-side liners are NLA last I heard, so no good opportunuity for any retrofits. ;(
08-07-2007, 07:10 PM
#25
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by heinrich
Chris where are the cavities, OUTside the car. or are you saying in the speaker holes?
There's the cavity underneath the rear 6 inch speakers. I filled that with the great stuff (the less expanding stuff is better). Then if you remove the front liners for the rear wheel wells, there's a big cavity behind that. I just got some closed cell foam and jammed it up in there. The closed cell foam made a small but noticeable difference. The great stuff in the cavity behind the speaker well made a much more noticeable difference. I'm tempted to take the foam out of the rear to see how it is with just the great stuff. The area in front of the rear wheel has the cosmoline in it, which probably reduces echoes a bit, while the cavity behind the speaker is bare metal.
08-07-2007, 08:51 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
Tire noise is a factor of many variables, including tire pressure, tread design, pavement type and surface roughness to name a few. Changing tires can make some diffrence, but changing the pavement type and surface roughness make the biggest difference.
Highway engineers change the surface rougness to help drain water; therefore, they will use textures that increase noise to help handing. Especially in snowy or high rain areas. If you live in a snowy or rainy climate and you have tire noise, likely it is due to the pavement type and surface roughness. Changing tires will have little effect on decreasing noise.
Cheers,
Highway engineers change the surface rougness to help drain water; therefore, they will use textures that increase noise to help handing. Especially in snowy or high rain areas. If you live in a snowy or rainy climate and you have tire noise, likely it is due to the pavement type and surface roughness. Changing tires will have little effect on decreasing noise.
Cheers,
08-08-2007, 12:58 AM
#28
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Originally Posted by JHowell37
Actually if you believe the Amzoil hype their tires will out grip F1 tires. They'll be more quiet then anything else. They'll last 100,000 miles or 10+race seasons. In addition, they'll feed the starving children in Africa, end the middle east conflict, and most importantly, they'll cure erectile dysfunction (perhaps even make the equipment bigger.)
YOU ARE JUST GRILLING!
08-09-2007, 11:20 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by JHowell37
Actually if you believe the Amzoil hype their tires will ....cure erectile dysfunction (perhaps even make the equipment bigger.)
H2
08-09-2007, 11:23 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by fabric
Closed cell foam in the space in front of the front rear wheel well liner.....
H2