Turbo
09-07-2005, 07:23 PM
#47
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If it ever spools up at all. It might not spool until 5G which would be a downer. You could always hit the engine with some nitrous to get that giant moving faster. Its just going to take a lot of exaust gas to get that thing moving.
I bought a cart car turbo a while back (dummy me sold it) but it was a custom from England, very exotic materials, very special and I dont think it was as big as that.
I aksed a pro builder about truck turbos a long time ago and he told me that they were really designed for lugging along all day and not really for fast spool up. He might be able to send it to a custom builder who could lighten it and tweek it and get it to spool faster. A set of ceramic ball bearings would help too.
I bought a cart car turbo a while back (dummy me sold it) but it was a custom from England, very exotic materials, very special and I dont think it was as big as that.
I aksed a pro builder about truck turbos a long time ago and he told me that they were really designed for lugging along all day and not really for fast spool up. He might be able to send it to a custom builder who could lighten it and tweek it and get it to spool faster. A set of ceramic ball bearings would help too.
09-08-2005, 12:40 AM
#48
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TEC III is costly...
A TEC III is costly once all the sensors are installed... One came on one of my 928s with single turbo. Still needs more sensors and some of those are not cheap... I haven't a clue how to set it up, but it was already installed.
Just added a high pressure, high output Holley fuel pump and variable rate regulator... you do NOT want to go lean with a turbo - fry up your motor very quickly.
While a TEC III can control almost anything you put on the car (if you figure it all out and buy all the sensors and controls), you will want to make the ratio richer (higher fuel to oxygen) ratio as a safeguard. Probably a less costly used TEC II or other lesser engine management system would work fine for this. Obviously the guy has limited funds (like nearly all us poor 928ers), and a TEC III probably is outside his budget.
Anyway, to my fellow Texan in Austin, hang in there! These 928 s can be a real pain to keep going (have 5 of em up in North Texas), but they are really cool cars. Even if your turbo does not add huge amounts of power, you are going to love how it sounds at higher rpms.
NOS would help spool up the turbo - but definitely only use a WET system or none at all. Finally, the real bummer is once you reach the 500 hp mark, you start to reach many other drive train component limitations - from con-rods to transmission, torque tube etc... However, a 500 hp 928 is so amazingly fast for street usage in REAL world terms, there would be little point to more.
And with your turbo on, with the hood up you will get endless "holy s...t!" from viewers.
Hope you get that front end back on it!
Mark
Just added a high pressure, high output Holley fuel pump and variable rate regulator... you do NOT want to go lean with a turbo - fry up your motor very quickly.
While a TEC III can control almost anything you put on the car (if you figure it all out and buy all the sensors and controls), you will want to make the ratio richer (higher fuel to oxygen) ratio as a safeguard. Probably a less costly used TEC II or other lesser engine management system would work fine for this. Obviously the guy has limited funds (like nearly all us poor 928ers), and a TEC III probably is outside his budget.
Anyway, to my fellow Texan in Austin, hang in there! These 928 s can be a real pain to keep going (have 5 of em up in North Texas), but they are really cool cars. Even if your turbo does not add huge amounts of power, you are going to love how it sounds at higher rpms.
NOS would help spool up the turbo - but definitely only use a WET system or none at all. Finally, the real bummer is once you reach the 500 hp mark, you start to reach many other drive train component limitations - from con-rods to transmission, torque tube etc... However, a 500 hp 928 is so amazingly fast for street usage in REAL world terms, there would be little point to more.
And with your turbo on, with the hood up you will get endless "holy s...t!" from viewers.
Hope you get that front end back on it!
Mark
09-08-2005, 12:59 AM
#49
Agreed on all counts Tammons.
IMO that turbo is clearly too big for a 5.0 liter application that will only rev to 6500rpms.
A turbine section that large on a 5.0 liter really needs a motor that can turn about 8000rpms.
A Turbonetics TA-44 sized unit is about 30% smaller than the Volvo turbo pictured above, and still will put out 700hp on well tuned Buick GNs at about 18psi.
If you mated that Volvo unit to a 5.0L engine with an 8000rpm redline and ran about 10 psi(keep in mind 10psi from a unit that big is a truly massive amount of air flow) i have NO DOUBT it would easily exceed 1000+ HP under full boost, which would probably come on no sooner than 3500+ RPMs and be at full tilt by about 4500-5000rpms.
Building a 928 V-8 5.0L with a 8000rpm rev potential is going to get you 400+HP in N/A trim to begin with, so it's not like you'd be putting along in a typical 4cyl turbo slug until the boost came on, there would still be some excellent low end acceleration just on motor alone.
But to make that setup work as it should, you're talking 60lb injectors, a fully customized engine management system, some really serious fuel pumps, along with a complete race porting and polishing job and a custom large diameter 100mm or larger MAF along with a well designed and very large front mount intercooler(much bigger than the one pictured above, that one's clearly too small for that big a turbo on a 5.0L motor turning 8k rpms). GT cams would probably be too small, so you'd need to go custom there too.
IMO that turbo is clearly too big for a 5.0 liter application that will only rev to 6500rpms.
A turbine section that large on a 5.0 liter really needs a motor that can turn about 8000rpms.
A Turbonetics TA-44 sized unit is about 30% smaller than the Volvo turbo pictured above, and still will put out 700hp on well tuned Buick GNs at about 18psi.
If you mated that Volvo unit to a 5.0L engine with an 8000rpm redline and ran about 10 psi(keep in mind 10psi from a unit that big is a truly massive amount of air flow) i have NO DOUBT it would easily exceed 1000+ HP under full boost, which would probably come on no sooner than 3500+ RPMs and be at full tilt by about 4500-5000rpms.
Building a 928 V-8 5.0L with a 8000rpm rev potential is going to get you 400+HP in N/A trim to begin with, so it's not like you'd be putting along in a typical 4cyl turbo slug until the boost came on, there would still be some excellent low end acceleration just on motor alone.
But to make that setup work as it should, you're talking 60lb injectors, a fully customized engine management system, some really serious fuel pumps, along with a complete race porting and polishing job and a custom large diameter 100mm or larger MAF along with a well designed and very large front mount intercooler(much bigger than the one pictured above, that one's clearly too small for that big a turbo on a 5.0L motor turning 8k rpms). GT cams would probably be too small, so you'd need to go custom there too.
07-30-2006, 07:34 AM
#50
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Thread Starter
Progress Gulpilen
I have continued with the project. Its far from ready but in a year it will be up on the track/street. But the building itself has been a joy. I have just moved 650 km in Sweden, Sthlm to Malmö, the building has countinued anyway in small "carryeble" projects.
You can check my progress out in my new website:
LINK: www.928turbo.se
Its in swedish but the pictures an tech info is in universal - enjoy.
The kid is my brothers 1 year old porsche fan (will soon be anyway - I will learn him all about it in ferrytales).
/Jonas
You can check my progress out in my new website:
LINK: www.928turbo.se
Its in swedish but the pictures an tech info is in universal - enjoy.
The kid is my brothers 1 year old porsche fan (will soon be anyway - I will learn him all about it in ferrytales).
/Jonas
07-30-2006, 02:01 PM
#51
Inventor
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Hella kul projects!
Where did you get the electric power steering pump from?
The Wilwood handbrake looks good through the wheel.
Where did you get the electric power steering pump from?
The Wilwood handbrake looks good through the wheel.
07-30-2006, 04:44 PM
#52
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Thread Starter
Sorry dont know
Yes I think so too! I got one question to build one more because he would like S4 front calipers and rotor in the backend due to bigger stuff in the front. Now that is something I didnt think of when I built it.
I would like to tell you where I got the electical steering from but I dont know. I got it from the seller of the car wich I dont have any contact with.
/Jonas
I would like to tell you where I got the electical steering from but I dont know. I got it from the seller of the car wich I dont have any contact with.
/Jonas
01-07-2007, 09:53 PM
#53
Rennlist Member
Jonas, how is this car coming along; any updates??
01-07-2007, 10:44 PM
#54
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I'd use a -10 for the drain.
This turbo vs supercharger argument is silly. Turbos and SCs aren't even on the same level. If you want some good reading check out "Battle of boost" by Hot Rod magazine(Aug 03). It's a centrifugal, roots, turbo competition complete with dyno charts. There's also a NA base line chart.
This turbo vs supercharger argument is silly. Turbos and SCs aren't even on the same level. If you want some good reading check out "Battle of boost" by Hot Rod magazine(Aug 03). It's a centrifugal, roots, turbo competition complete with dyno charts. There's also a NA base line chart.
01-08-2007, 12:27 AM
#55
Captain Obvious
Super User
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Originally Posted by Wade T
I'd use a -10 for the drain.
This turbo vs supercharger argument is silly. Turbos and SCs aren't even on the same level. If you want some good reading check out "Battle of boost" by Hot Rod magazine(Aug 03). It's a centrifugal, roots, turbo competition complete with dyno charts. There's also a NA base line chart.
This turbo vs supercharger argument is silly. Turbos and SCs aren't even on the same level. If you want some good reading check out "Battle of boost" by Hot Rod magazine(Aug 03). It's a centrifugal, roots, turbo competition complete with dyno charts. There's also a NA base line chart.
Uhhhh Here we go again!!!
01-08-2007, 12:40 AM
#56
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*shrugs*
What'd I do?
Oh well, can't leave stuff like this unchecked:
And:
and that guy is obviously high!
Strange that one of the smarter voices on the thread seems to be banned - m21sniper.
What'd I do?
Oh well, can't leave stuff like this unchecked:
IMHO, id leave any turbo in the mirror
while a turbo's boost increases with rpms (meaning either overboosting and using wastegate and blow-off valve) for lower rpm power - which is inefficient and generates more heat. There also is substantially less "lag" with a supercharger and virtually no over-boosting at shifts.
Strange that one of the smarter voices on the thread seems to be banned - m21sniper.
01-08-2007, 12:45 AM
#57
Administrator - "Tyson"
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Originally Posted by Wade T
*shrugs*
What'd I do?
What'd I do?
03-02-2007, 04:48 PM
#59
Advanced
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by SwayBar
Jonas, how is this car coming along; any updates??
I have just ordered sharktuner with ezk!
I am building on the car almost every day. It will probably run in two months or so. The holes in the hood will not get any bigger but they will be different when ready. Take a peak at my website www.928turbo.se
/Jonas