hacker-pschorr

FIXED IT!!

Well, I think so at least.

I filled up my power bleeder - hooked it upto the reservoir & pumped it up to 15psi.

Guess what happened?

BUBBLES STARTED GOING UP THE HOSE TO THE POWER BLEEDER!! LOTS AND LOTS OF BUBBLES!!

As I pumped the clutch, the bubbles got worse. Eventually the bubbles stopped completly - even if I pump the clutch. Something tells me I had a ton of air in my system between the brakes and the clutch.

Time for a test drive.

hacker-pschorr

Nope - still the same.

I had a feeling it wasn't 100% right when I decided to flow some new fluid through the system. So, with a hose connected to the slave, I cracked open the valve, had a friend push the clutch pedal to the floor, close the valve, pull pedal back etc.....

Once I was done with this, more air bubble came up, kept comming and comming. Once they stopped I decided to do my brakes while everything was connected. For some reason I started with the front right. Holy hell, lots of bubbles came out!! My brakes have never had issues on this car, the calipers were rebuild in 04 when installed (upgraded to S brakes).

I realized there was not going to be enough fluid to finish all 4 calipers so I closed the valve on the caliper I was on, bubbles kept coming up the feed line from the power bleeder.

I started pumping the clutch again - more and more bubbles came up!!!??

I'm wondering if my did damage my slave & now it's pumping air into the system when using it. Does this sound possible?

FlyingDog

If air is getting in and the fluid level isn't rising, the fluid must be getting out somewhere. Where is the fluid going? The slave would leak into the bellhousing, just sitck your finger in the inspection port and feel around. The clutch master would leak into the cabin or possibly down the firewall onto the floor if the top fitting was leaking. The blue hose would make a mess down the fender or firewall. If you can't find fluid anywhere else, check inside the vacuum booster.

hacker-pschorr

The fluid level in the resivior does not change.

FlyingDog

That means if air is getting in, fluid is getting out.

hacker-pschorr

I've checked everything, bone dry. The fluid that was on the brake booster the other day was from the "blow off" spring on the resivior.

Either way I need to find the source of the leak.

heinrich

preferably with engine off

AO

The bubbles you are describing seem normal. All you are seeing is the fluid moving from the power bleeder to the resevoir. As the fuild moves down the system, fluid from inside the power bleeder moves through the line and replenishes the resevoir. SO this is normal and this is not where you should be looking for bubbles. If there is air in the system it should come out the bleeder nipple.

I think you needed the keep the bleeder screw open with a tube- one end on the bleeder niple and the other into a jar or other similar container - and while the power bleeder is pushing fluid, pump the pedal. I would not bleed it like brakes where you close the bleeder before the pedal comes up. Instead, just pump up and down (I wouldn't go crazy, but moderate pumping).

If that doesn't work, then I'd re-do step 3 in the WSM and if that doesn't work, then I'd look to the master seals.

FlyingDog

Hook the powerbleeder up, pump it to 15 or 20psi and leave it over night. See if there's a puddle in the morning. If not, my guess is the blue hose or chassis to engine hose.

hacker-pschorr

It was hooked up at 15psi for at least 1 1/2 hours (fellow sharkster called - see avatar), pumped a few times, wandered around the garage etc....never fell 1psi, no fluid anywhere.

hacker-pschorr

Riddle me this:
You have the bleeder open on the slave, pushing down on the clutch pedal will force out roughly 1/2 the fluid in the system between the master / slave. At this point, the "fill hole" in the master to the blue hose is sealed off. Now if I pull back the clutch (since it's now stuck on the floor), it will suck in fresh fluid from the blue hose. If the bleeder is still open on the slave, what will keep it from sucking in air? How is this going to help?

I ran out of time last night to try "step 3" in the WSM - hopefully tonight I'll get there. Another trick I have yet to try is force feeding the system fluid from the slave. Two shark owners up here only bleed their clutches that way, they never have issues.

AO

The power bleeder shoudl prevent that since it's pressurized. But to be sure, the key is to put the other end of the hose into a cup, so as the fluid (and hopefully air) are pushed through the lines, the cup fills up with the expelled fluid. Now, keep the end of the hose below the level of the fluid in the cup, so when it wants to suck up fluid, that's all it sucks up... just fluid.

At this point, I like this solution the best. It can't hurt. Just watch that resevoir to make sure it doesn't over flow!

tammons

A few things. Hydraulic flex line linings can collapse. IE no air in the system, but when you press on the clutch it just expands the lining.

Another thing that happened to me repeadedly was the TO bearing capture ring would recess into the TO bearing and cause a major dragging clutch.

Once you are sure the air is 100% out you probably need to go through the entire clutch system.

Tom. M

look inside under your drivers side floor mat...many times fluid has escaped the master and ended up pooling and collecting in the carpet padding ...

good luck..seems trapped air is your issue..now to get it all out....

Later,
Tom
89GT

BTW>...once you push the clutch pedal down..even just a bit..the upper part of the circuit (blue hose and reservoir) are out of the loop....so if you leave the slave bleed nipple open..you will suck air back into the system..until the clutch is all the way out..and then the pressure bleeder will again pressurize the system. If the clutch master and slave are both relatively new..I still am betting on trapped air in the master. If you didn't do a full flush on the system..and there was gunk in there...that might be part of the problem. Shane had a similar issue on his newly acquired 86.5 at sharktoberfest...I pulled the master cylinder all the way out..and no fluid came out at all......had to add fluid up top to build up pressure..and finally some heavy black gunk came out...took a while till it flowed nice and blue (super blue fluid)..and then the cylinder got shoved back in...worked much better after that...

I know you don't have brake issues, but believe there is a bleed screw at the end of the brake booster too.....many overlook this when bleeding the system...you'd be amazed at the gunk that comes out of there too..

hacker-pschorr

Andrew,
Tonight should be another fun evening in the garage.

Tammons,
Master, Slave, blue hose, flex line, floater disk, pressure plate, & release bearing were all replaced between 03 & 04. I'm not assuming all of these parts are good, but they really should be.

After tonights fight with fluids, I'm pulling the clutch pack to inspect everything. First time for me doing this, should be interesting.

Tom,
Inside is dry, I pulled back everything. I really wish I would find a puddle somwhere