Rebuild Clutch Master Cylinder in the car
I noticed some hydraulic fluid weeping around the pushrod of the clutch master cylinder (CMC) while doing some general clutch inspection. Based on the advice of a few well qualified individuals, any amout of visible hydraulic fluid means the seals on the CMC are failing and they should be replaced. https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...0981cd600e.jpg The CMC is supper difficult to reach and there are several terrible ways to replace the CMC. One abhorrent method involves cutting a hole in the wheel arch (don't do it!). There is a less intrusive method that involves using the string method to chase the CMC out and back into the holes. Or you can remove the brake MC and booster for easier access. Additionally, a couple people suggested that the failure is usually just the seals and it can be rebuilt in the car with less effort than removing the CMC. I decided to do a write-up on rebuilding the CMC, even through its a fairly easy job. Here is an overview from the WSM (Manual 2, Section 30-1) https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...4f780d497a.jpg Needed Supplies and Tools
You are going to need to get under the car the bleed the Clutch Slave Cylinder (Slave) and it's a good idea to flush the brakes at the same time so get the car up in the air with the wheels off. Also, you will need to crawl under the dash, so get the seat moved all the way back and remove the parcel shelf. Bonus points if you remove the driver's seat and steering wheel. Both will aid in giving to better access. Disconnect the battery as per usual. Drain the clutch hydraulic system Open the cap on the top of the hydraulic reservoir, then open the bleeder valve on the slave with a catch can connected. With the system draining, pump the clutch pedal a few times and leave it depressed. This will move the fluid out of the reservoir and the out of the CMC. Let the system drain while disassembling CMC. https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...0c747f986.jpeg Disassemble the CMC Inside the car, remove the clip holding the pushrod clevis to the clutch pedal, slide the clevis off the pin. and pull the pushrod out with the boot. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...0862e33108.jpg https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...2630676f9a.jpg You will now see the cir-clip/snap-ring. Pull the carpet back and put rags around the CMC to catch any excess fluid as you remove the snap-ring. https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...8def9379e.jpeg Using he snap-ring pliers, remove the snap-ring. This is probably the most difficult part of the job given the tight quarters. This is where I wished I had an angled snap-ring pliers. As you remove the snap-ring the CMC plunger will pop out about a CM clear of the CMC housing, So be ready with eye protection and rags as there will be some splatter. Remove the washer and piston, and, using a hooked pick, remove the piston return spring. Inspect the cylinder walls for corrosion. If clear, replace with rebuild kit, or scavenged parts from replacement new CMC. Make sure to use a little master cylinder grease to lube up the sprung and the piston before insertion. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...c687d271d9.jpg https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...536a9a127c.jpg https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...bbb283342c.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...d010a385b0.jpg Re-assembly of CMC Install the spring with the wide base at the bottom of the CMC. Install the piston. As you push it in you will notice the piston will not stay seated in the CMC housing because of the spring tension so installing the washer and snap-ring will be difficult. I found it easier to install the push-rod, with the washer and snap-ring, and boot dangling on the pushrod. Then I installed the pushrod onto the clutch pedal. This effectively held the piston down for me while I was able to use my free hands to load up the snap-ring and move it into position. Truth be told I fussed with the snap-ring pliers for a while and found it easier to use my fingers to start one end of the snap-ring and then us a screwdriver to work the rest into place. Once you have the snap-ring in-place return the clutch pedal to the up position and make sure there is no pre-loading on the push-rod from the adjustment. https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...29533345b.jpeg Bleed the Clutch System Bleeding the clutch can be difficult and people have their tips and tricks, but here is what the WSM says:
Now would be good time to flush and bleed the brakes since you have the extra fluid and you can't really store it. Adjust Clutch Pedal Travel https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...4f780d497a.jpg Now that you are sure the system is leak free, adjust the push-rod per the WSM: Checking clutch free travel: Due to the fact that the clutch is fitted with an automatic hydraulic adjuster, the clutch free travel cannot be checked at the clutch pedal. To ensure proper operation of the clutch. however, the pushrod must be adjusted correctly. Adjusting the pushrod: Adjust for zero clearance with the pushrod (1) disengaged to allow the pushrod to be pushed over the pin (2) without any load being present. Then preload the pushrod by rotating by one turn and lock with nut (3). Adjusting the clutch spring: To boost foot pressure, a boost spring is fitted to reduce the pedal force required. To achieve this effect, the boost spring must be preloaded sufficiently. When measuring from the inside of the spring cup to the center of the mounting pin, dimension A must be 43 mm for vehicles up to MY ‘91 and 21 mm for vehicles as of MY ‘92 with the clutch engaged (clutch pedal at end stop). If required, correct setting by rotating the wing nut or the hexagon nut, respectively. That is you are done! |
Great writeup Michael - Thank you for the documentation. I am planning to replace my vacuum booster after the holidays and will likely rebuild the clutch master with it out of the way.
-scott |
Many thanks for this write-up! Very timely. Something i was planning on doing this winter with my 84 euro. I was noticing that if the car sits for a while the clutch gets "soft" and starts to fall toward the floor. If I manually push the clutch in and out a few times and pull up with my foot it seems gain pressure again and it seems fine. I'm guessing my seals in the CMC are starting to fail with these symptoms...
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BOOSTER?
Scott, if you are removing the booster, replacing the MC would be a piece of cake. There is no easier way to do so.
Originally Posted by drscottsmith
(Post 15454858)
Great writeup Michael - Thank you for the documentation. I am planning to replace my vacuum booster after the holidays and will likely rebuild the clutch master with it out of the way.
-scott |
FWIW great write up and pictures.
The MC that you have needs to be modified by trimming about 4.5 MM off the tip , then cut a slot in the tip like the original tip has. Also remove 1 coil from the new spring so the spring wont go into coil bind. Here is the saga. https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...aster+cylinder |
Thankyou Michael. I have saved this thread because I am sure I will need it in the future. :bigbye:
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Originally Posted by Mrmerlin
(Post 15455889)
FWIW great write up and pictures.
The MC that you have needs to be modified by trimming about 4.5 MM off the tip, then cut a slot in the tip like the original tip has. Also remove 1 coil from the new spring so the spring wont go into coil bind. Here is the saga. https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...aster+cylinder https://rennlist.com/forums/928-foru...1&d=1223396517 https://webfiles.uci.edu/redwards/pu...%205-14-10.jpg However the internals of my CMC did not look like the "Old" 9" one in above photo above. In fact the internals on my original CMC were dimensionally identical to the replacement CMC internals (see picture below) So I concluded I already have the 10" booster to not modify the components. Was there something more I missed? I'll make sure I add a note above about the 9" vs 10" booster. https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...ab150e039.jpeg Old parts on top, New replacement parts are on the bottom, the picture does not show it, but both springs are the same length. |
Neither piston has been properly modded
same goes for the springs, your probably replacing a unit that was fitted 9 years ago. This was about the time when these new parts were improperly made Read Robs post about how long the piston should be after modding , I think he is suggesting 5mm, I found that 4.5 MM is the safe amount to trim so to prevent the rear seal from pressing in too far. That said after this mod and the stroke is still not enough then remove the piston and trim off more |
Dont know
Originally Posted by Mrmerlin
(Post 15456458)
Neither piston has been properly modded
same goes for the springs, your probably replacing a unit that was fitted 9 years ago. This was about the time when these new parts were improperly made Read Robs post about how long the piston should be after modding , I think he is suggesting 5mm, I found that 4.5 MM is the safe amount to trim so to prevent the rear seal from pressing in too far. That said after this mod and the stroke is still not enough then remove the piston and trim off more I dont know about that. I just received the identical setup from Tom that perfectly matched what was in the car.. I have had the car since 1997 and know that the MC was not replaced until I just did it a month or so ago. |
Hello All. I hope folks will chime in if I revive this thread...
I have been noticing a couple of creeeeky spaces in my clutch when I depress. nothing i can hear but every once in a while I get this funky feeling in the pedal. Does anyone have any information about where I can get a kit for a 1986 928? Slave and CMC. If so I would be eternally grateful... I could just call Roger. Did for the first time a few days back. What a great call. But Im sure he must get tired. Amazing amazing amazing write up btw. loving this site right now. Just amazing |
Originally Posted by JayPoorJay
(Post 15814863)
Hello All. I hope folks will chime in if I revive this thread...
I have been noticing a couple of creeeeky spaces in my clutch when I depress. nothing i can hear but every once in a while I get this funky feeling in the pedal. Does anyone have any information about where I can get a kit for a 1986 928? Slave and CMC. If so I would be eternally grateful... I could just call Roger. Did for the first time a few days back. What a great call. But Im sure he must get tired. Amazing amazing amazing write up btw. loving this site right now. Just amazing https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/rennlis...cb0da55e18.jpg Or it could be caused by binding on the CMC due to bad seals. I would get down in there and do a thorough inspection of everything. Inspect the bushing. Take the boot off the pushrod and look for fluid evidence or missing paint. The kit is cheap enough to buy and install while you are inspecting. Roger would be a good source for this sort of part. |
I read through the discussion on trimming down the piston but I am still not clear on what model years are affected. Should this be modified on all '80-'95 cars which use the 10" booster?
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Interesting concept. I have replaced o rings in other cars' brake cylinders with varied success. Housing has to be free of corrosion. Never thought about doing one in place.
I replaced mine in the 79 a few years back. It is indeed a challenge but if you are patient it's possible without mutilating your car. I was a USAF jet engine mechanic and experienced a lot more difficult jobs. My replacement cylinder was from Pelican-they had a right one and a wrong one to choose from. I choose the first. Workshop manual pedal adjustments are not correct. I did it my way and works flawlessly since then. |
Originally Posted by Majestic Moose
(Post 15816923)
I read through the discussion on trimming down the piston but I am still not clear on what model years are affected. Should this be modified on all '80-'95 cars which use the 10" booster?
-scott |
Originally Posted by drscottsmith
(Post 15817068)
Moose I have an 83 US model and purchased a new cylinder back in the fall and I had to trim mine. I put in a new vac booster at the same time. All works great now.
-scott |
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