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I drive up and down parleys canyon from Park City to Salt Lake City everyday. This pic is from the seller before I bought the car in september last year. Since i got it, I have rebuilt the turbo, redone the vacuum lines, all heater hoses, heater valve, water pump, front end reseal, AOS seals, etc... paragon arhk, new konis, new wheel bearing, ball joints, apexi avcr boost controller, tial wg, AEM uego WB, vitesse maf+. Car is running like a champ. I run about 14psi, and if I hit the scramble button, I get 1 min of 16psi. Or I can switch programs and run 16psi all the time, or I can turn it off and run wg spring pressure of .7 bar.
I've got pics to post when I get home, but the Rings included with the kit are a smaller diameter than the original ring. Also, because my kit did not come with the right zero fitting, I used a bolt to plug the hole. When I tighten the bolt, and the bottom piece begins to turn, the spiral ring will start to pull out of the groove. Happened on both sides, ring was fully seated. Not my first rodeo when it comes to snap rings of either variety. I am satisfied overall with the product.
There's the problem. Install the plug/bolt before installing the parts. The spinning plate will wind up the coil-ring and make it smaller in diameter, which slips out of the groove.
My repair history states that on around around 3/27/10 @ 188,794 miles, a friend of mine and myself rebuilt my 944's ball joints using the track rated Rennbay rebuilt kit. Seemed to work out well, all set. On to DE season.
On or around 5/4/2013 @ 197,985 miles my regular shop noted that these ball joints were lose again, and needed to be rebuilt. My understanding is that they procured and professionally installed the track rated Rennbay ball joint rebuilt kit.
The first mandatory safety inspection of this season, the technician noted slightly lose ball joints again, but not bad enough to keep from tracking the car, but something to keep an eye on.
I cast no aspersions on the kit itself, which I've found well made, nor the instructions, which I've found to understand and follow, however, I'm looking to cure what appears to be this recurring problem once and for all without going broke.
Yes, I do track the car on DE days with the local Porsche club, and am starting to more consistently pull 1 lateral Gs at apex (targeting to do more of this). But I think that perhaps it's the lousy state of the roads here in Michigan (as I do drive it on the streets) that have more to do with the ball joints getting lose with such frequency.
Does anyone have any recommendations? Am I looking at Weltmeister or Racer's Edge replacement A arms? Replacement Porsche A arms?
They shouldn't get loose. There is really no room for them to get loose with the solid bushings in there. If you can take the time to remove the arms and dissemble the joints I will be happy to send you any replacement parts that are worn or broken. Just give me a ring or shoot me over an email with some pics of what you find.
A lot of times a loose strut or bad upper strut mount can masquerade as a bad ball joint. The best way to tell is to remove the arm.
And no need to worry about going broke on ball joints. If you do find some way to brake them that fast I will send you replacements until I can redesign some better ones.
They shouldn't get loose. There is really no room for them to get loose with the solid bushings in there. If you can take the time to remove the arms and dissemble the joints I will be happy to send you any replacement parts that are worn or broken. Just give me a ring or shoot me over an email with some pics of what you find.
A lot of times a loose strut or bad upper strut mount can masquerade as a bad ball joint. The best way to tell is to remove the arm.
And no need to worry about going broke on ball joints. If you do find some way to brake them that fast I will send you replacements until I can redesign some better ones.
Well thanks very much Travis. I really appreciate that.
Let me review and discuss this situation with the shop and see which direction we move forward. A decision may not be made until after the end of this season.
The top strut mounts are camber plates, so no give there. I think the testing methodology for the ball joints is squeezing the ball joint top to bottom with a large channel lock pliers to test for looseness, but I'll double check that and follow up post here.
More likely scenario is that slight wheel bearing play when unloaded is being mistakenly seen as ball joint play
I've never heard of "squeazing a ball joint" in my lifetime of being a mechanic lol. You unload the suspension by jacking up under the control arm, grab the wheel/tire @ the 12:00 and 6:00 position and give it a wiggle up and down.
You really need to check them for play the correct way before going further but from what you just said and if they are indeed loose, I think I know what the problem is. The lower bushings are cracked.
In a normal ball joint or tie rod end, the up / down play indicates wear in the bushing surface. That is because these units have a set upper and lower race the ball rides in. As the race wears the ball joint becomes loose in all directions. Thus, squeezing it with a large set of pliers and having movement means the joint is bad.
The 944 ball joints are unique in that they are a stacked component set. The top bushing stays set with the arm but the bottom bushing rides on an active spring surrounded by grease. The thinking behind this is that as the ball / bushing / spring combination is allowed to compress just a bit and as it does this it will force grease up around the ball section, self lubricating. And it actually does work this way.
If you take a set of channel locks to a freshly rebuilt joint it will compress slightly against the spring pressure. If you continue to squeeze at the bottom of that movement with the spring fully collapsed then you are going to split the lower bushing. It just doesn't have anywhere else to go.
The proper way to check a 944 ball joint is to remove the pinch bolt and drop the pin free from the spindle. Then check the joint by hand for play. You should be able to rotate it in the arm and move it from side to side without any slop. You can usually compress the joint down against the spring with just your hand. This is normal. As a side note - Rebuilds prior to use will be stiff to move from side to side and impossible to rotate by hand before being allowed to seat in on the car.
Just check them the right way, it doesn't take long and will not effect your alignment. If they are loose then you probably have cracked lower bushings. Don't continue to drive on them. Just let me send you the components you need and fix them. It's easy to do since they have been rebuilt before.
You really need to check them for play the correct way before going further but from what you just said and if they are indeed loose, I think I know what the problem is. The lower bushings are cracked.
In a normal ball joint or tie rod end, the up / down play indicates wear in the bushing surface. That is because these units have a set upper and lower race the ball rides in. As the race wears the ball joint becomes loose in all directions. Thus, squeezing it with a large set of pliers and having movement means the joint is bad.
The 944 ball joints are unique in that they are a stacked component set. The top bushing stays set with the arm but the bottom bushing rides on an active spring surrounded by grease. The thinking behind this is that as the ball / bushing / spring combination is allowed to compress just a bit and as it does this it will force grease up around the ball section, self lubricating. And it actually does work this way.
If you take a set of channel locks to a freshly rebuilt joint it will compress slightly against the spring pressure. If you continue to squeeze at the bottom of that movement with the spring fully collapsed then you are going to split the lower bushing. It just doesn't have anywhere else to go.
The proper way to check a 944 ball joint is to remove the pinch bolt and drop the pin free from the spindle. Then check the joint by hand for play. You should be able to rotate it in the arm and move it from side to side without any slop. You can usually compress the joint down against the spring with just your hand. This is normal. As a side note - Rebuilds prior to use will be stiff to move from side to side and impossible to rotate by hand before being allowed to seat in on the car.
Just check them the right way, it doesn't take long and will not effect your alignment. If they are loose then you probably have cracked lower bushings. Don't continue to drive on them. Just let me send you the components you need and fix them. It's easy to do since they have been rebuilt before.
I have to admit that I wasn't present when the ball joints were checked in the inspection.
I'll have a look at them this weekend, per your procedure Travis, and again, you have my thanks.
04-30-2015 | 12:55 PM
