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No it won't, morghen is right. Forget about your coilover adjustment for a start. You have gone from stock 10in springs to 300 lb 10in springs. Your car will sit high. You need to use a shorter spring when you up the spring rate and you will still operate at the mid point of your struts.
Then you can start messing with your coilover adjustment to get it lower.
I completely agree with him and the fact that a 8" at the exact same thread setting of my perch would lower the car by 2". While 2" will be too much, and I could simply raise them to a more suitable ride height, this doesn't change the fact that my strut is further collapsed. Collapsed to the point of needing to completely remove the bump stops in order have a maximum of 1" of strut travel.
The number 1 reason for considering this hybrid setup, is to allow the strut to have more travel when lowering the car more. To simply swap the 10" spring out for an 8" spring will only allow me to lower the car more, further reducing the strut's travel. It will have a much higher risk of bottoming out.
Your reasoning is right but technically it won't work as well as you think.
Forget about your spring perch adjustment at this time for adjusting ride height.
On a stock system you should go with a shorter spring when upgrading to a higher spring rate. Reason is the higher rate will compress less with the car on the ground, thereby maintaining the same ride height. That is important because dampers are designed to work best at their mid point, which is normally where they are set from the factory.
Now when you up the spring rate you should also fit better dampers, ones that can handle the higher spring rate which normally means dampers with more aggressive valving. You see your higher rate springs will now operate in a much smaller range on the damper, so that damper better be able to do that.
Now you want to lower the car substantially and fit higher rate springs. That will do two things, it will make you operate at one extreme end of the damper and will increase the demand of that damper. Both bad if you are sticking to the stock dampers.
You should definitely go to a more aggressively valved damper, that will resolve one issue. But you also want to exceed the operating length of the damper by going even lower. And to resolve this you want to fit shorter dampers that bring the operating range back to around mid way on the damper.
First, that's all good but those dampers still need to have more aggressive valving than stock to work with the higher spring rates. The dampers you are considering do not.
Second, you will need to consider leveling out those control arms as they will not be running parallel anymore and that's not good. That involves aftermarket fitment of longer ball joint pins.
Third, when you fit those control arm pins the angle of your steering arms will cause you to bump steer, so you need a bump steer kit to resolve that.
So it is all achievable going to extremely low ride heights but it's not all plain sailing. And you have to ask yourself why when there are many of these cars that handle brilliantly without going that low. Is this just a look that you like?
I guess I should of read this post before posting my own- i'm going through a similar issue.
I Just put the coil over kit today, 12" 250lb springs up front with Lindsey Racing camber plates and it sits way to high. I plan on getting some 8" 300lb springs to get me down low. Do they make a 7" spring for the front?
I guess I should of read this post before posting my own- i'm going through a similar issue.
I Just put the coil over kit today, 12" 250lb springs up front with Lindsey Racing camber plates and it sits way to high. I plan on getting some 8" 300lb springs to get me down low. Do they make a 7" spring for the front?
I just replied to your post. I think you should be fine as you have upgraded the dampers and are not planning on going as low as op forty-six is planning on here.
If the linked Koni sport shocks are not suitable, do you have any other suggestions? According to Koni's site, the Sport strut It is the only offering for the early 944 suspension as well.
As for the balljoint extender. These are made for a Mk1 VW Rabbit, which use the same 17mm balljoint.
It was designed with simple bumpsteer correction in mind. You simply have to bolt the tie rod in from the underside of it's mounting location on the spindle.
It may still make sense to use an 8" spring though.
Those are to level the control arms, they bolt on to the existing pin. The bump steer kit is different and bolts to the steering arms, you need both to do the job correctly. I've seen a few versions of both, SCCH, Elephant Racing, etc, see below:
I understand that they are for extending the balljoint. I meant that the amount of extension was determined by considering bumpsteer correction by only flipping the tie rod to the underside of the it's mount, rather than having to add any sort of drop link.
How low do you actually want to go?
You have to think about what happens dynamically.
This is not an economy car that rolls around town, its a sports car and you will probably use it as a sports car so think about nominal height of the lowest point of the car to the ground. Think about how much the springs and dampers will allow the car to drop under load, think about the tires you use and how much they compress and drop the car then think about the road you are using the car on and leave a 30% safety margin.
I am thinking 22" from the ground to center of the wheel opening. That is the minimum target I have in mind. I will eventually end up with a set of 17s and most likely a 40 series tire whichever width I choose. The rolling radius will be less than my current tire, so I will end up with more wheel gap. I do completely understand the overall ride height will also be lower.
I do like the handling characteristics of the car while working in the optimal range of all parts of the suspension. That is the reason I am taking extra steps for strut correction, as well as control arm/bump correction. By addressing these issues, the only downside is the ground clearance itself. I am no stranger to having a lack of ground clearance.
I have a Audi TT that is using an airbag suspension. Yes airbags allow for height adjustments at the touch of a button, but that doesn't mean I actually make the adjustments. It only has 2.5" of clearance at my ride height setting. I am able to make my daily drive without issues. Yes it can be stressful at times, but not impossible to get around. I manage every drive without any damaging incidents. Yes the car could handle much better with a proper set of quality coilovers and geometry corrections, but that has not been my build intentions with the car.
The 944 is a different story. I want to retain and improve the handling characteristics, and also want a low stance. To meet this goal, I will need to be creative and willing to take extra steps to keep the suspension within a the operational and geometry parameters that meet the characteristics I'm looking for.
I believe I am on the right track for making that happen. I have addressed strut travel, will address geometry issues, and will most likely deal with oil pan protection.
I'm not posting this for any sort of boastful reason, nor think of this as very practical. This is the ground clearance of my Audi's driving height. I'm not looking to reduce the height of the 944 to this. Simply referencing a height that I am able to manage on my daily drives to and from work.
Damn thats lo
Both my red gts and my 931 are low cars but this is something else
I run 225/45/17 on 9" wheels all around as you can see in the picture i posted. I think 40 will give you too much fender gap and is a wrong choice, but prove me wrong
I will take measurements before deciding on a tire size. I would use a 255/40 or wider in the rear. The front are only rolling wheels, so a low profile won't have any affect on anything other that wheel gap.
I'm just trying to stay away from 18's. There is more of a selection of period correct wheels in 17's. I am going to be putting a good amount of effort into this details of this build. I am extremely picky about wheels and fitment. This won't be much of a track car, but does need to have the ability to perform.
Believe or not, I am not just ignoring the concerns and suggestions in this discussion. I appreciate the conversation. It's nice to see a forum with a good technical knowledge base.
I am going out of town for business for a few weeks, leaving tomorrow. I will setup the modified struts when I get back. I will be using oem replacement struts for the initial build. Once I am certain it functions as expected, I will order a set of Koni's. I have my eye on a set Ridetech single adjustable coilovers for the rear. Once the suspension is all sorted out, I will hopefully be able to find a set of wheels that are worth my dollar.
09-25-2014, 05:16 PM
