Tom Pultz

I'm getting tired of my shuddering rubber-centered clutch disc. What have others found that works well? I'm definitely going with a spring-centered design even though it may be a bit noisier.

So far I've got a few options:

1) Stock PP with Sachs spring-centered disc.
2) Stock PP with Porsche Motorsports disc... I have no idea what this looks like, or if it's even streetable... it was just recommended to me by a So Cal tuner.
3) Centerforce PP and "dual friction" disc.

Item number 3) can be purchased at a great price from <a href="http://www.performanceintl.com" target="_blank">Performance Intl.</a>, however I'm concerned that the Centerforce product may be a bit on the heavy side.

Any recommendations? Thanks.

rfuerst

I replaced the clutch disc on my 944S with a Sachs spring centered clutch,I am very happy with the performance but it will take a little while to get used to the extra noise it transmits,not annoying but just different than the rubber centered clutch.I also notice a shudder on some downshifts if I do not match the revs,but I enjoy blipping the throttle when down shifting so again no problem. <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Forrest

Tom, I can personally recommend Huntley Racing's Sachs Escort Cup clutch kit ($750). I also had
him lighten my OEM flywheel a bit, spools up quicker. Very pleased with it. I
recorded the Sachs P/N if you want them. Disk is spring centered.
Pedal force seems about the same, and Huntley claims clamp up is rated good
at least to his stage I (possibly stage II) supercharger. Yes, there is a
method to my madness! Operation is smoother for me than rubber centered OEM disk
I had previously. If you track at all, avoid the rubber centered disk.

Alas, but cannot upgrade the S2 to Turbo Cup spring centered disk because diameter is larger. I searched far and wide for one compatible w/S2, then settled on Huntley's. There are a lot
of places in Excellence and Panorama which sell Sachs spring centered disks for the S2,
however, but none of the Turbo Cup ones fit the S2.

Beware aluminum l/w flywheels as rotational inertia will be significantly
reduced (compared to a lightened OEM flywheel); it was suggested to me
by a local Porsche racing garage DME might/would require additional programming
to compensate for reduced inertia, especially at idle and under load (e.g., from A/C cycling). I never had this corroborated but the l/w flywheels
do seem more geared towards racing than daily drivers w/some DE events.

Get the complete clutch kit while you are in there, too (pilot and throw-out bearing, guide tube, rear main seal, and replace all bolts.)

Regards,
Forrest A. Olmstead
'89 S2 LSD (ready to install parts for MO30 upgrade)

Danno

Did Bill just replace his stock 951 clutch with a Centerforce and said it was lighter than stock? I seem to remember that from somewhere..

Tom Pultz

[quote]Originally posted by Forrest:
Tom, I can personally recommend Huntley Racing's Sachs Escort Cup clutch kit ($750).<hr></blockquote>I was not aware he had them for the S2, only for the turbo. [quote]I also had him lighten my OEM flywheel a bit, spools up quicker. Very pleased with it.<hr></blockquote>And it was worth the extra $375... and you don't have any problems with low idle speed or stalling when you put in the clutch?
[quote]Huntley claims clamp up is rated good
at least to his stage I (possibly stage II) supercharger.<hr></blockquote>I asked Derrek about an S2 clutch and he recommended the Porsche Motorsports disc and stock PP. Is that what you got?
[quote]Alas, but cannot upgrade the S2 to Turbo Cup spring centered disk because diameter is larger.<hr></blockquote>It's not just the diameter, it's the fact that the S2 uses a different number of teeth to trigger the DME so you can't swap in a turbo flywheel.
[quote]Get the complete clutch kit while you are in there, too (pilot and throw-out bearing, guide tube, rear main seal, and replace all bolts.)<hr></blockquote>I thought those were all included in the package price.

Thanks for the info.

Forrest

I was pleased with the lightening of my OEM flywheel. After talking it over with Derrek he seemed to know what he was doing, and had experience doing it before. Experience was the key.

How the part is machined, how much (and where) you can take off material, maintaining perpendicular and/or parallel surfaces, surface finish, balancing, et al; the manufacturing process can be quite involved. Furthermore, any given machine shop might not be able to perform all of the operations, then you have to ship the part from one place to another, etc., assuming you know where to go. I felt the $375 cost was reasonable ($200 core charge).

No problems whatsoever at low idle speed and no stalling (had it six months now). Stock flywheel is approx. 18 lbs. Had about 8 lbs. removed.

I believe the Sachs Escort Cup clutch disk Huntley advertises is the Porsche Motorsports disk. (Derrek told me that also.)
P/N off of Sachs PP box: 944.116.023.07 and 3082.087.136.
P/N off of Sachs disk (spring centered) box: 1878.023.541.

I am not sure if his advertised kit included the shaft seal (he may have included at my request, I cannot remember, but I do know he did not charge me extra for it.) It is only $14 but should be replaced with rest of clutch.

Part Werks of Chicago and Ian's Euro Parts also sells Sachs Sports disk, but I do not know if it is the same as Huntley's. Their complete kits approached $625-$675, but neither would lighten stock disks. Part Werks had a l/w flywheel for $595 if you are interested in going that route.

As far as Centerforce is concerned, I was reluctant to go with them since I believe they modify, i.e., reengineer, a Sachs OEM pressure plate to their own specifications; didn't want to deviate from OEM or Motorsports. That is why the Turbo Cup disk sounded so great, but just isn't compatible with the S2.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Forrest
'89 S2

Jason @ Paragon Products

P/N off of Sachs PP box: 944.116.023.07 and 3082.087.136.
-------------------------------------------
This is the standard pressure plate for a 944 S or S2. The 8V cars will use 944.116.023.01.
-------------------------------------------
P/N off of Sachs disk (spring centered) box: 1878.023.541.
-------------------------------------------
This is what is commonly referred to as the spring center disc for the 944 8v, 944S and S2. The Porsche part # which is commonly used is 944.116.012.90