I was pondering this, for my racecar, as I have been running Koni yellows, but they're blown up, and I was never blown away by them. I have, FWIW, the Bilstein sports on my street car, a stock 82 931.

I chose to go with Bilsteins, after consulting about my many (but limited, with IT rules, no threaded-body, no remote reservoir, which eliminates a lot of really nice shocks) choices with a number of more experienced road racers. The response was "if you can get/afford the monotubes, there's no question! If they're cheaper, why are you asking???" The struts may not be cheaper, but the rears certainly were - a 36mm steel smooth body with 1/2" rod ends, off the shelf item. These are a generic circle-track, user-serviceable (with the right equipment) shocks. They can be got with threads for spring perches. A little drill action will widen the holes for the 1/2" bolts. The shocks regularly go for about $110 retail, plus $55 each for revalving at Bilstein Motorsport for my spring/t-bar rates and corner weights.

Did I mention that Bilstein Motorsport has years of experience racing and supporting our cars? Call them up, give them your corner weights and spring rates, and they can recommend a starting valving setting based on their notes.

I'm really looking forward to getting these things on the track, will be 5/10-11 at Beaverun. I'm not concerned about losing adjustability. That's about the last thing I'd be messing with at the track, and only to compensate for either not having the base chassis set up properly, or having the wrong valving in there to begin with.

As for the street car, love the shocks, very happy with them, very high quality stuff. Really improved the ride over the blown KYB's that were in there, not that it's much of a comparison. Haven't had a chance to run the Koni yellows on the street.

You might wish to mention what your criteria and desires are for this purchase.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by 924RACR:
<strong>
Did I mention that Bilstein Motorsport has years of experience racing and supporting our cars? Call them up, give them your corner weights and spring rates, and they can recommend a starting valving setting based on their notes.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Sounds like a great idea. Do you have any contact information?

Thanks,
Barry

 

Yeah. Somewhere. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Bill Hindorf is the guy you want to talk to... phone #'s are on their website, though you might have to get transferred one or twice to get to Motorsport:
West 800/537-1085 East 800/745-4636

 

Well a stack of week-old donuts on a stick will be better than any KYB shock I've ever used.

I've had them on my 924S and I currently have them on my 1G Eclipse. Maybe they were/are blown or something, but it seems they just plain "blow" - either "blown" or not.

 

I can also revalve/service/dyno any bilstein......Ohh and make them adjustable in rebound only or both bump/rebound at the same time....... using bilstein parts done by someome who knows the 944 series.........

 

I'm a bit confused as to how a dyno graph of an relatively inexpensive off the shelf Koni application for a ACR Neon can be fairly compaired to custom built race shocks...this certainly is not apples to apples. We've posted dyno graphs of actual 944 Koni applications here before and we can do so again if anyone would like. These graphs would be at piston speeds your Porsche will likely see on a track. If you would like to see overlays of the same part # shock to show consistency between pieces, we can do that too. There are more than one Koni applications for 944's...from single adjustable to double adjustable and now even the new 2812 and 2817 race dampers.

 

OK, so is there any consensus on what the yellow Bilstein is?

Is it a sport or is it a HD?

I just picked up a pair at Hershey for $300 that are coilovers and yellow...non-adjustable.

Looks like a 2.25" lower spring perch. Whats the diameter of the bottom of a turbo cup spring?

 

I was just trying to show the adjustment range of a koni dbl. adj. yellow..........Reguardless of the application the range is still the same.......... Also 90% of the posters are street-limited track use drivers so slow
dyno # from a scotch yoke dyno "less than 12 in a sec" are no good to these drivers.........
There cars see shocks speed of 30" a sec or more driving on the street.............Not smooth race tracks..........

I will admit I have never tested a new koni 2812,
and im sure that the consistancy is much better but i was just tryin to teach some people a few things and compare a bilstein street shock and a koni street shock.........

The consistancy of bilstein steet parts are very good (they use the same guts and the race units)

 

The non adjustable yellow Bilstein strut insert is the HD model. Not sure what to say about the strut housings, except that the Turbo Cup ones were threaded and green.

Regards,

 

By the way, I think its VERY cool that this thread has gotten Vaughn Scott, Barry Lenoble and Jason Burkett to respond. For those of you who don't know them, they are long time 'listers on the email boards that have a wealth of knowledge I could only dream of having, and we are lucky to have them contributing here.

Regards,

 

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> Stop, I'm blushing!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" />

AFAIC, the big comparison area between the Koni yellows and the Bilsteins is price - they're both in the same ballpark. I can't speak to the technical details to the same degree that Evan or Jason can, as I've not had the opportunity to take a look inside these things, only drive with very limited exposure; Koni yellows only on track, with spring rates well above their capabilities (3 out of 4 are now blown), Bilsteins HD only on street. Comparing a full-race Bilstein with proper valving for my setup to an out-of-the-box Koni yellow really is unfair, but the crazy thing is that they really do compete in price (the race Bilsteins, not talking about the Bilstein HD street shocks here).

That said, I still think (and the thread shows it) that this is a bit of a religous argument.

 

Not evan but larry.......

That koni was a tuned acr strut and the bilsteins use the same parts (pistons and rods)
as many of the street shocks I just wanna let people know that....... Also that steet part to street part the bilsteins tolerances are much better.......

 

I recently talked to Scott McDonald at Bilstein about my "cup"struts and shocks. Mine are off of a champion Canadien cup car ...and had been custom valved by Bilstein. Mine are Yellow ... and according to Scott this is not a determining factor ("it doesnt matter what collor they are") to whether they are cup or Firehawk. Mine are cup and they are yellow as confirmed by Bilstein.

944turbo

 

Great info in here! I'm very confused by the different types of Bilsteins, can someone point me to a vendor or pic link for each type?

Sam

 

The Lindsey Racing website has both the Escort "cup" and the Firehawk series shocks and struts listed on their site. The difference is in the valving and spring rates ... not the body of the shock and strut. The firehawk front struts are valved at 380/150 and the rears are 400/200 ... while the Escort "cups" are valved at 600/190 front and 565/218 in the rear. The outsides of the shocks and struts are silver for both types.

944turbo