Mike S.

You serious DE'ers and racers have the answer to this one. What have you found works best on the 944's...heel on the gas, toe on the brake...or visa versa? How about the winged accelerator pedal or a wider accelerator pedal. I assume the pedal setups on all 944's are the same, if not, let's talk 951.

I watched a Skip Barber instructional race tape and the pedals were so close that the guy braked using the left side ball of his (right) foot and bliped the throttle with the right side ball of his (right) foot. Very neat. As an aside, combined with double clutching his non-synchronized gearbox, his feet looked like he was doing a tap dance. Very impressive.

TIA,

Mike

adrial

I've been getting pretty good at it on the street...but I haven't tried it at a DE/autox yet.

I use my heel/center/sometimes front part of my foot on the brake (the least of my foot I have on the brake is from the heel back...the most is from the front of my foot all the way back to my heel)...and my toe on the gas. I rotate my foot clockwise to accomplish this. This works well on the street...but I dont know how well it would work on the track...especially for those without ABS and need to modulate the brakes as opposed to stomping on them.

I'm a size 10 or so...so if I can do it, most guys can. Girls with tiny feet...I think can manage it also.

Geo

[quote]Originally posted by Mike S.:
<strong>You serious DE'ers and racers have the answer to this one. What have you found works best on the 944's...heel on the gas, toe on the brake...or visa versa? How about the winged accelerator pedal or a wider accelerator pedal. I assume the pedal setups on all 944's are the same, if not, let's talk 951.

I watched a Skip Barber instructional race tape and the pedals were so close that the guy braked using the left side ball of his (right) foot and bliped the throttle with the right side ball of his (right) foot. Very neat. As an aside, combined with double clutching his non-synchronized gearbox, his feet looked like he was doing a tap dance. Very impressive. </strong><hr></blockquote>

Ball of the foot goes firmly, and completely on the brake. Your priorities in performing heel/toe are:

1) Braking
2) Braking
3) Braking

Somewhere after that comes rev matching.

If you don't get the revs matched, 99.5 times out of 100 you'll still get through the corner. If you don't get your braking done you could be dead.

Here is something I wrote a few years back for SE-R.net.

<a href="http://www.se-r.net/general/heel_toe.html" target="_blank">http://www.se-r.net/general/heel_toe.html</a>

BTW, forget double clutching. It's totally unnecessary. I'm surprised it's even in the video. I don't think any schools are teaching that anymore. The pros certainly don't use it.

Mike S.

Adrial...thanks. After a couple of pretty awful novice attempts doing it each way, that seems easier for me as well. Pigeon toeing my right foot and heeling the accelerator pedal which hinges at the floor certainly doesn't feel to great. It understand it's desirable that the toe (ball of foot) go on the brake to provide better brake pedal control. I do have ABS so I could get away with more of a stomp but I don't want to develop any bad (braking) habit that wouldn't work in a non-ABS car. I'd like to keep my braking smooth.

Mike

Mike S.

George,

I just read your link. My mind is in sync with the goal you outline in your posting (to be smooth) Thanks. It was quite helpful. And thanks for underscoring my priorities (braking). Do you find heel toe in the 944 more difficult than average or is it just something that requires lots of practice to be more comfortable to execute? And then lots more practice to execute properly?

Mike

Steve Lavigne

I say don't worry about the criticism from the guys who actually use their heel on the gas. Just remember, they probably have small feet... and everyone knows what that means!

The only time double clutching is useful in my 951 is downshifting to first gear. If I don't double clutch it takes ages for my worn synchros to spin up the input shaft enough to get it into gear. Of course, downshifting to 1st in our cars is only really necessary in an autocross or on the street, not on a racetrack.

Dave in Chicago

The real rule is that whatever works for you is okay. Personally, I use the ball of my foot to brake (don't skimp or you'll slide off and find the gravel/wall/ER) and roll the outer side of your foot onto the gas pedal.

You should practice this in normal driving as much as possible. The challenge is that you usually are not threshold braking in day to day driving, hence the pedal is not nearly as deep.

To get around this (and because I am only at the track say 15 days each year) I found an industrial park nearby that is totally vacant at night. Now, you don't need to do lightspeed runs here. Just get up to 50, brake hard (real hard), and do your blip to get into second. Your braking zone will be short, but that pedal will be deep.

You can do this about 10-12 times back to back before your brake pads will produce interesting clouds of smoke from the front wheel wells. That's the time to call it quits for the day. Drive the car for at least another 20 minutes to let the rotors cool.

Usually disclaimer - I do not encourage violating posted speed limits, rules of the road, etc.

Hope this helps, keep the shiny side up,

Ken

The term 'heel-toe' is an outdated one. In older cars, the gas pedal was located below both the clutch and brake. Thus you used your toe on the break and blipped with your heel. Due to the new arrangement of pedals, this is not easy thing to do. So one half(the ball) of your foot is on the brake, and your right half has to blip the throttle. It can be made easier by raising the height of the gas pedal so it is even with the brake(or at least higher than it is stock) so that you don't have to reach as far to blip.

Another thing i recently came up with was a good use for the throttle cam upgrade. It would make the blip easier to perform as the pedal does not have to travel as far.

There a great write up about this in "Going Faster! The Skip Barber Racing School". In fact, i just read this section today.

Renn 951

I agree with Dave: try it both ways and see what feels best (most natural) for you. With my size 12 right foot and the gas pedal hinged to the floor, I find it very easy on my 951 to use my toes on the brake and rotate the heel to hit the gas. The toes (and ball of the foot to a lesser extent) will give you a much better feel for modulating the brake pedal.

On my Audi S4, however, the pedal is suspended (not hinged to the floor), so I have to heel the brake and toe the gas on that car. I've never felt comfortable on either car just "rolling" the foot over to the right to blip the gas. When I practice this driving on the street, sometimes the foot rolls right off the brake pedal -- NOT what I want to have happen at the track!

Geo

[quote]Originally posted by Mike S.:
<strong>George,

I just read your link. My mind is in sync with the goal you outline in your posting (to be smooth) Thanks. It was quite helpful. And thanks for underscoring my priorities (braking). Do you find heel toe in the 944 more difficult than average or is it just something that requires lots of practice to be more comfortable to execute? And then lots more practice to execute properly?

Mike</strong><hr></blockquote>

To be honest, I've never even driven my 944. It's a long story, but I bought mine out of a very small salvage yard that picked it up at an auction a couple of years before. It sat there straight and complete and waiting for me. It didn't have a battery and I haven't even tried to start it yet. I brought it home and immediately started stripping the interior.

I'll replace all the belts and seals before trying to start it. If it runs OK, I'll run it for a season or two w/o building the engine. If it doesn't I'll just build a proper IT spec engine.

That said, heel/toe is not a natural motion by any means. It takes a fair amount of practice just to get comfortable with it. Don't despair. Practice it correctly and you will get the hang of it.

PSH944

I have size 15 feet and find the heel/toe technique with heel on the "gas", toe on the brake to be the best.

It's not as easy as the other way for the occasional corner, but I found the toe on the brake give the best brake control, which as quoted before, is the most important part. I found it hard to use my heel on the brake for consistant braking. After a couple of months practise, this way is like second nature.

Always remember, if you miss the "gas" one time, you do no real harm, if you miss the brakes one time, you can kill yourself and others.

Mike S.

Fellas...thanks. Time to hit the hay and practice in my dreams.

Mike

Peter K.

The throttle pedal is adjustable. There is a small bolt behind it which can be turned to move the pedal fwd or bkwd to help with thte drivers heel toe. I use the ball and sides of mty feet, not heel and toe at all. I also have wide feet and when i race weear wider shoes so they will make ti to both pedals no problem.

txhedg

One reason to try and learn to do the heel-toe with the ball of the foot on the brake and side of the foot on the throttle, is that once you come addicted to the whole racing thing (and you will), you will decide to go to a racing school (Skippy, Derek Daley, Russell, Panoz, etc). At these schools, with the race pedal setup, the ball/side heel toe is about the only way you can do it. So, try to make it work that way in your own car and you will be that much faster when you get to race school!!

A good drill to try for learning h-t is one we did at the Russell school. Basically it was getting up to speed in 4th gear, and then doing 3 consecutive h-t downshifts untill you were rolling slowly in 1st gear. Its hard to find a spot to do this on the street (abandoned parking lot someone else mentioned), but its excellent practice. Set a target for the point where you want to have come to a rolling stop, and it will help you gauge and time how much braking effort you use, as you don't want to be threshold braking the whole time (makes it too tuff to learn proper h-t). At the local track here (TWS), there is a piece of pavement they occasionally use for a slalom course, and I used that when not otherwise in use to practice this drill.

I've got to stop posting this stuff.....every time I do it makes me pissed off I don't have my car anymore. <img src="graemlins/crying.gif" border="0" alt="[crying]" />

iloveporsches

Because I have such big feet (size 14), it's not really a problem for me to brake with the ball of my foot and apply gas with the side, even with stock pedal setup.