931GT

Its certainly the easiest way to turn $25,000 into $5000. If you want an LSx buy a Vette, then let someone who actually appreciates 944s buy your car.

Mark944na86

I think that's really the problem with these conversions -- what you end up with isn't a 'vette, but it isn't a Porsche either. It is whatever it is, but for many converters, the value is in the challenge of doing the conversion, rather than the car you end up with, I suspect.

And that's fine, too -- projects are good! Few (if any) automotive "projects" return a positive return on the $/time invested. But if you enjoy spending your $/time doing these sorts of projects, it's all good.

docwyte

Man, I had no idea that it cost that much money to convert a 944/51 with an LS1. I figured you could get a good motor cheaply from a wrecked camaro/firechicken, then the Renegade stuff wasn't all that expensive...

roman944

the LSx swap was developed for us early 944 guys where you can't "turbo your N/A"

LOL

but really, that $20-21k ... how much of that is just engine alone? and shop doing the swap?

I think while both engines when built will run up there price wise, I think that people that do LSx swaps do it because they want more perfomance and less maintenance; how much will it cost you to have that 3.0L block rebuilt when the timing belt breaks (again)?

arthropraxis

The cost depends on how much you can do for yourself. I am doing a complete conversion now. Including the price of the car (951 with a big hole in the block) it will cost about 10K to get it running including a complete suspension rebuild. That is with a low mileage LS1 and me doing all of the work. I could do it much cheaper if I wanted to do all of the fabrication, but why reinvent the wheel? If I had bought a running car I would have just upgraded the Porsche motor to get 300 or so HP but then that is what the PO did and the motor blew. Not looking for an argument just giving my experience.

gt1scca

Here’s my take on the debate, although it may be worth less than the .02 listed elsewhere…

I have invested a lot of time and work in making the 944 / V8 Conversion information available to the people interested, posted freely, without obligation. The parts site came about as a result of the technical drawings in the Manual, and the grim reality that no one seemed to be able to have parts produced at a reasonable rate. Convert your 944 / 951, use the parts site, read the Manual – or not. It’s your choice.

I did this for the people interested in another alternative, or even the select few willing to machine their own parts and save money on labor. It has snow-balled into SPEC Conversion-specific clutches, Street & Performance 944 V8 Conversion headers, and non-conversion specific 944 parts development.
Not to force my opinions on anyone, merely a “here it is if you want it” deal. I won’t argue the point with a debate over the V8 conversion. It’s not going to change the opinions some have favoring the 944 engine. The 944 / 951 engines have their advantages, as do the LS series engines. It’s a matter of preference, simple as that.

The site, Kit, and Manual are there for those interested.
Debate-free.

Thanks,
Greg

Quikzilver

High HP C6 Corvette owner here. I also looked at an LS swap into my 86 Monte Carlos SS. One option for 944 owners would be going with a LS motor out of a truck (I think it is designated as an L99). These can be found on eBay for under $1000 with the harness. The motor is a 5.3L with around 300hp. They can then be built up some for additional HP, if wanted. One big reason I bought my 944 was for fuel economy. My 08 Corvette with a LS3 stroker (418cid) drinks gas (avg mpg = 16.8). The 944 is twice that. Be prepared for a huge drop in fuel economy by going to the high HP LSx. Factory LSx motors do get better fuel economy (24mpg before the stroker was dropped in. Average is for same mileage driven and same speeds. City driving is the major reason for the severe drop, as at under 45mph, the motor really chugs along with the extra stroke and large cam.) For me, if I was going to drop $20k into my 944, I would use the money to pick up a late 80's 911. I have already dropped too much into my Monte Carlo SS that I won't gain much back on (over $30k invested, might get $10k for it). For $20k, you have a late C5 Corvette, if you want an LS powered vehicle. As for handling, the C5 and C6 handle like they are on rails too. Parts for Corvettes are about the same as for a Porsche, but less maintenance is necessary. I love Corvettes (on my 4th, been driving them for over 12 years). The 944 is a completely difference drive. It is a fun little sporty car that gets great gas mileage. And, of course, it is a Porsche. But in the end, it is the owners choice. I think the experience of driving an LS 944 would be awesome and applaud those that have taken the leap to do this conversion. If money was unlimited, heck, I would do it in a second.

LS1951

Just found this thread and thought I would chime in. I have been down both roads with the 951.

Back in the late 90's I owned my first 951. At that time there was really only 2 players, Powerhaus and Huntley Racing. I got a turbo and chips from Powerhaus and then added the HR MAF, hard pipes, blow off valve etc. I think I had at least $10k in bolt ons and I put down about 325whp. I wasn't really happy with the car though. I could never really get it dialed in, it seemed to run differently every day. Also there was no way in hell it would come close to passing smog in CA. I ended up selling it in 2001 for around $6500.

In 2005 RH introduced the LS1 944 kit. I was never really interested in the old cast iron SBC swaps but when I saw the LS1 kit I was sold. Here was an engine that makes 320 plus hp stock and can be CA street legal if installed correctly- SOLD! I found a 951 with a blown head gasket for $3k and ordered the LS1 kit from RH. I got the car running and smog legal sometime in 2008. It was a fun car, ran great and was fairly quick. I ran a 13.1 at 110mph with an open diff and crap tires. The engine was fairly stock, it put down 333hp to the wheels. But for me I just really missed the feel of the turbo engine. It just didn't feel like a Porsche anymore. I had fun with it for about a year and sold it in 2009 for $11k. I had invested about $14k into the car and conversion so I did a little better on this one than my first 951.

Now that there are companies like Vitesse, SFR and Lyndsey Racing, I feel that I can build a really reliable 350whp turbo motor and still pass smog with a quick intake and chip swap. I will be picking up my 3rd 951 this Thursday. Let the games begin!

vt951

My LS1 swap will cost in the neighborhood of $9k. Subtract the stuff that I sold (running engine, etc.) and it will be under $7k. My point is, the comments about $20k for an LS1 swap sound pretty high.

LS1951

$20k sounds a little far fetched. Unless you are buying a new crate motor and paying a shop to do the work.

My swap cost me about $11k. I had to buy/modify a bunch of smog crap though. If you are not in a state like CA $7-9k is doable. A stage 3 kit from Vitesse plus the supporting mods is even less though

Honestly a properly converted car is fast and really does make sense. My issues with the swap are really just personal preference. I like turbo cars. Now if you own an N/A 944 than I think a conversion makes aven more sense.

Hotshoe

Hey, if it's about value and resale we'd all drive used Corollas!

Some guys just like to "hot rod" things whether it be a lawn mower or an old Porsche. If you do the work yourself it only becomes expensive when you add a lot of high end components. Besides, rationalizing sports cars is futile.

It's true there are a lot of other cars out there but personally they don't do it for me. Why not take what I like and improve upon it? Hell, some guys put Apache engines on motorcycles!

Also, I have a wife and two kids and I spend an incredible amount of time with them. The fun of these projects is the process. Putting family first lengthens the process which makes it even sweeter to me. Some people see shrinks, some guys play golf. I like to tinker on cars. It's all about priorities but you CAN have your cake and eat it too.

CPR

I bought a roller (everything except motor) last year to do a LS swap and still keep my red 951. I am very satisfied with the performance of my red car and wouldn't change a thing. There is about $5k in performance parts in it and it is very reliable/smooth.

For some reason I was under the impression that the LS swaps were cheap/reliable HP. The estimates I have so far range anywhere from $13k to $20k for the swap. I spoke to Greg for a bit about doing the swap to get a better idea (great, great guy) of what is involved from timeline to costs to problems. It has its advantages I suppose, but in thinking this through more thoroughly unless you are a mechanic/very mechanically inclined it is just not a feasible project. At least not from an investment point of view. There are some great exceptions to this (see DVC), but most of these projects are either done half-assed due to running out of money or patience or both. And as mentioned earlier, the resale value just doesn't justify the investment.

In my opinion, $20k is better spent on a 320hp 996 or a mid 2000's Z06. Kind of like buying a house for $300k because you liked the windows or masonry, but spending $400k gutting the interior because you thought you could do it better for less.

I don't know....I thought I was all ready to go through with this project. But with the red one running so good with 1/4 of the investment, just seems like there are better alternatives out there. But to each their own, and no slight at all on those doing the conversions. Takes a lot of talent and time and all are to be commended for doing them right

Just my lousy .02 cents