Dan in Pasadena

I now have my Guards Red '87 in pretty damn nice shape. It is detailed to the max, motor mounts, clutch, et al and everything works. I just keep thinking if I'd spent this money, effort and concern on a 951 I would like it better. Don't get me wrong. I really genuinely like my car. But I debate whether I am keeping it long term. I had always wanted a Porsche to keep forever. I thought it would be a 60's 911. Now I'm not sure. I want more power and that front end. Of course I've thought of a SFR supercharger, a V8, and a "poser" front end. But I don't think so. The car has been in the famly since new- I'm only the second owner. I hate to sell it. Maybe I won't.

What is the real honest no B.S. cost to buy a Guards Red (yes, I want it THAT color) 951 with less than 100K on it. I know you'll all tell me the mileage doesn't matter as much as the service history. I agree. I've been here as long as you guys! But I still prefer lower mileage. And would, of course consider the "right" car despite mileage. What's the price? How long did it take - I've got time, Will I spend the same $3-5K after purchase I did on my NA even with a good pedigree?

Andre

i dont know about CA, but here in MA the mechanic i work for said you can EASILY buy a turbo in great condition for 5 or 6. Which made me cry since i bought my na in OK condition for 5

Der Cupmeister

I looked at an '86 today with 107k, very nice interior (by my standards anyway , I'm not a CW.)
Car appeared to be original, especially under the hood. Has transaxle with external cooler. No dripping going on, engine bay was average, body had a couple of door dings, nosepanel over intercooler was lighter in color? Gaurds Red, phone dials, fresh off brand tires,etc,... battery was dead and not secured, no top on cassette box, no maintenance records.

Asking $8000 in central Cal

<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

My944Turbo

Can't say I really know, but seeing as I have been looking to prove to my insurance company that I can't find a car like mine for cheap.
89 951 red/blk 12,995
86 951 86k miles 10,995
88 951 63k blk 10,500
87 951 99k blue 9,000
88 951 98k red 9,000
87 951 100k red 9,000
87 951 red/blk 8,000
87 951 res 106k 7,900
86 951 red 87k 7,750
This is just a quick list I got off the internet, there are more cars for far less and far more, but i'm not concerned with the cheap ones right now... But I would think since you want under 100k you might have to pay a little more. Now my honest opinion since I love the airbag style wheel, and the ABS, I can only go with an 87 or newer and under 100k that was cared for I would think would be somewhere over 8,000, I would think 10,000 would get you an excellent car with 80k miles. Oh and there is an 87 951 in my area with 22k miles i believe...asking price 19,000. And he has an 86 for sale for like 5,950. Good luck with your search though.
As for me it took about a year and a half of looking to find my 87 in the color I wanted with 96k miles, and it was over 8,000. The key with not having to spend 3-5k after buying it is buying the right car, for perhaps a premium and getting a good PPI. That's my opinion and i'm sticking to it...good luck <img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />

Dan in Pasadena

What site did this list come from?

Dan Gallagher

i paid 6500 for my na and then found out i had to replace alot of things...... see i told my mom i should have gotten that turbo but she said no turbo too fast...... anyone wanna make an even trade?

My944Turbo

That list came from cars.com. I have another list from traderonline.com. And then of course all the other usual print places, like PCA, Excellence, and a few others. I think at one point when I was looking for my car I had about five websites I checked daily. If I can remember the rest i'll post them, but they shouldn't be to hard to find. Oh, and I found my car in North Carolina, flew out, bought it and drove it back, all in two days. It was about 25 hours of non stop driving, but it was a nice way to get acquanted with my new love, i mean car.

Travis - sflraver

I got my 86na 6 months ago. It has the full turbo front clip, not the after market look alike,the white "powder coated" fuch wheels, cone air filter, chip, under drive pullys, the 944 light bar in the back,amber side markers, and new white paint. Besides it running great and looking great from the outside the interior was trashed. Seats are electric but torn, dash cracked, no radio or speakers, one of the headder pieces missing, carpet had water damage, back glass leaked, sunroof leaked, arm rest broken, no back seatbelts, and the lether on the shifter half torn off. I picked this car up for 2500 and I have put almost 1000 into the interior. Its almost complete all I need to do now is get the head liner piece thats still missing and a new A/C controll. Looking back and seeing some of the prices listed above,I got a good deal even if I put another 500 or so in it.

Renn 951

Dan:

Are you aware that there is a Rennlist classified section?

icat

Dan,
It took me about 8 months to find mine - and I did not want Guards Red! Of course everything I looked at was junk, except for this one very nice Guards Red 951...

Needless to say, after waiting for eight months I've learned to like Guards Red! Funny thing is, I search the entire Houston area (all 600 square miles) and then found my car about two miles from the house!

Ski

I found mine on AutoTrader online. I was at first convinced that the cars with "pictures" were the only ones worth a look,,,the owner took more pride or whatever.

Well I couldn't find what I was looking for in about a year; black/lt gray, less than 75k, original owner w/records. Then I started looking at the small adds - no pics and there it was. He sent pics, had a PPI done at a dealership, sent him a deposit. Flew to Vegas and drove it home. He sold me the car for Kelly Blue book at the time, 68k on the clock for $8500. So don't discard the small adds.

BRB_85.5_NA

Hey Dan--

I'm with you (if you've followed the "Constant search for N/A Power" post, you already know). I was thinking about the 968, but it seems the real value is in the 951 (and I'm a teacher, so value matters). I'm glad I only paid $2900 for my 944 in January, and have had to put less than $1k into it ($500 of which was a new set of Michelins) even though I've put 15k miles on it. I was going to do a big suspension overhaul, but I've decided even to minimize that cost so I don't throw any 951 money away. Anyhow, I've been keeping my eyes out, just getting acquainted with the prices, the years, occasionally doing a search on eBay, autotrader, cars.com etc. If you check out the <a href="http://www.connact.com/~kgross/FAQ/944faq02.html" target="_blank">944 FAQ</a> you can see what goes into the different years. It seems to me that here in Cali you can expect a price point of sub-$7k for a sound '86 or '87 951, stock or just slightly modded (e.g. chipped, maybe heavier springs), with records and maintenance current, with about 100k miles (the magic number when value seems to fall precipitously even though it's only 1 mile more than 99,999). Of course, there are a ton of people out there that think they've got something more valuable, but they just might have a hard time selling a 951 like this for $7k+. As you know, test drive a hundred of these (that's where some of the fun is! ), take your time, when the right one seems to be in front of you, have a PPI done. One more thing: try to find one with the original stereo (mine had it). It probably means that it was never owned by a young punk like me (31 yrs.) who always has something to prove or always needs an adrenaline rush, so his stereo has to be as loud as his car is fast and therefore it will have experienced a lot more wear and tear (of course, in my case it was audiophilia that drove me to replace the original stereo).

Fortunately we won't be in competition: I want Black on Tan .

Good Luck! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

BRB

oi-punx

Dan,

I was in the same boat as you, owned a nice '84 N/A, polished 16" fuchs, minor mods and beautiful paint. Several years before I bought this car I made the mistake of test driving a 951. It is an experience that stuck with me throughout the years, and ate away at me like a cankerous sore.

Around October of last year I started looking in the classifieds. 951's are pretty tough to come by up here in the bay area. I've seen some real beaters for $6k and up. Finally one day in March of '02 I found a "1987 Porsche 944 - $4,000" on an online classifieds site. I clicked the link and it said it was a turbo. The bad news is that it also said it needed a clutch. Needless to say I was on the phone with the guy immediately. This was well under what I was seeing on the market. The ad was only 12 hours old. He was the original owner and the car only had 75k on it, Black on Black, completely stock with leather interior, some maintenance records. A couple of people had looked at the car that morning and were coming back to give it another once over. I called him back later that day and asked if he would consider a long distance sale. He seemed reluctant because he was receiving a lot of calls on the car, but finally agreed to let it go for $4,800 pending good compression and leakdown numbers. Since the car was barely driveable he was to take it to get the clutch replaced and I would pay for it. The following week or so I was on a plane down south to pick the car up. I put a lot of work into the car the first week, the paint needed a polish and wax, it needed a full tune-up, brake pads, other misc. parts and about $200 in paintless dent removal. The window switches and power seat switches needed to be pulled apart and cleaned. I also had to have the hood re-sprayed because the idiots who replaced the clutch mounted the power steering reservoir too high when they were fiddling with the ignition coil, that set me back $500 for a beautiful job.

Since i've owned the car i've also had the rear tires, fan switch, motor mounts, and DME Relay replaced. Within the next 4k I will need to do the belts, water pump, and front engine seals (mostly preventative maintenance). On the plus side, the leather seats look practically brand new, the dash has no cracks, the front of the car has very few rock chips and the car came with the owner's manual, sunroof bag, air compressor, tool-kit (in unused condition), the "care tag" for the leather. and even the plastic gloves for when you fill up with gas!

Despite the negatives I feel I got a pretty decent deal based on the other cars I have seen and from what i've been told. Unfortunately my 75k mile, $4800 stock 951 is quickly turning into a $7500+ 951. Look at it this way though, you could blow that money on an insipid new car and by the time you're done paying off the loan you are driving something that holds a fraction of what you put into it, cost you way more than it's worth. that and you'll still probably want the 951.

Water944t

I found mine at a local dirt lot car sales place.

They were fairly scared of it, since they usually deal in ricemobiles and crap, they have a younger clientel. But i had cash, and they wanted to sell. I paid $4800 and probably could have gotten it for $4000. THe body is nearly perfect, never hit or painted, although I am going to paint it as the 100,000 mile gift to the car. (Got 15k to go.)

I bought the car with 74k on it, needed a clutch at 80k, and one small electrical gremlin that required shop time at about 82k, since I had just had a spinal fusion and couldnt wrench. Other than those two times, I do my own repairs.

She blows a bit of smoke under WOT, although some days it seems to go away. The hood is a bit garage rashed from the PO, and the drivers seat has a tear on the bolster. (PO was a cop, and his gun wore the leather out.) A few dash cracks, but I have seen worse. The car has LSD, the big Fuchs, full leather, a nice sound system, the original spare never run, even the plastic gloves and sheet for changing the tire! Everything works but the cruise, and I can resolder it once I find the time. I had been having problems with my radio reception, but after rewiring the powered antenna, it is perfect.

I drive it everyday, usually pretty hard. No leaks that drip, although a few seeping areas that I will tend to this fall. The car has never overheated, even after 100+ degree days when I beat on it. One bad exhaust leak, and a couple minor ones, but I still get almost to the 2BAR mark in 4th. I can smoke the tires in 1st and 2nd, but they just chirp loud in 3rd. The Yokohama AVIDs I put on arent the stickiest, but they are pretty kick *** for All-Seasons and I didnt want to replace them every 6 months. I blew a hole in the sidewall of the Pirellis that were on the car, at about 140MPH. The car barely shuddered, but I am glad it wasnt a high G curve.

Total costs:

car - $4800
new yokos - $500
clutch and misc - $1600
short in injector harness - $80
new oil sender - $40
new shift boot - $25
new cassette hinge - $20
new front speakers - $120

I figure I can cherry the car out almost completely and still be under $10,000. If I spent $2500 on the car, it would be almost perfect. New exhaust, new seals and bearings, rebuild turbo, maybe a P&P, and wraps for the turbo and headers. Repaint the hood, and fix a couple of small rock chips. And it would be a keeper.

This is my 3rd Porsche, and I am hooked bad. There isnt quite anything like the 951 as far as I am concerned. Its like driving the most solid feeling gocart ever built. I got to drive a friends modded Integra the other day, it was quick after the VTEC came on, and nimble as hell with the killer suspension work he has done. But I thought I was going to rip the door off the hinges when I opened it, and the whole experience was mindful of being a bug in a coke can while driving. My 951 is like a tank, solid as steel. With the windows up I can barely hear the engine unless its WOT.

I guess thats the difference between a $20,000 Japanese sporty car, and a $45,000 German sports car.

Bones944

Be patient Grasshopper and your car will come! I found my 87 951 in the classified section of 944central.com. PO had just inherited a Mercedes and something else when his Father retired to Fla, and his wife wanted the garage cleaned out. I paid $4500, perfect interior, fair paint (diamond blue), ABS, sport suspension upgrade, 78k miles, bone stock. He wasn't sure when the belts were last done, so I just replaced belts, sleeves, seals, and waterpump. Total price of parts....$611. Car runs perfectly, uses no oil, and drips no oil, shifts perfectly and is overall much tighter than my 86 n/a. Just keep an eye on all classified sites, and your options will open up if you would consider another color!