08-16 NNJR Watkins Glen DE summary
08-19-2002, 12:00 PM
#1
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08-16 NNJR Watkins Glen DE summary
What a great time was had by all! The weather was a little hot, but it got progressively better in the three days of driving.
To keep this on track (no pun) as a part of the 944 forum: there were about the same amount of 924/944/968 as 911's, by my estimation. At one point while I was out, there were four red 924/944's infront of me! A nice site to see, let me tell you!
This was my first time at the Glen. Here's my opinions:
Favorite spots:
-The Esses: fun going through threre flat out! You can really get a lot of momentum there! By Saturday, I was at WOT into turn 2. I think my exit speed was over 100! Yikes!
-The Off Camber: scary corner, due to the Blue Hedges (ie Armco) real close to the track at track-out, but with a little oversteer at track in, it feels real nice!
-The Inner Loop (ie Bus Stop): a couple of times, I was able to set the car up nicely for the exit: just a touch of oversteer, and the car would track out nicely into the outer loop.
Least favorite spots:
-The Outer Loop (ie Carousel): too afraid to push it, but it was fun to work on trailing throttle oversteer there.
-The Chute / Laces: couldn't find the line, and wasn't smooth enough with steering inputs to get that corner down...
It is really a fun track, but it isn't the easiest track to learn the line.
They combined the yellow run group (my group) with the blue (Al P's group, though I never did see Al on the track!) I thought it would be a little intimidating to be running with blue, but that was not the case. Eugene, my instructor was great! He is a very, very smooth driver, and was teaching me lots of great stuff! Thanks Gene!
The damage:
2 main crashes:
Unfortunately, a Boxster running in the Green run group lost it in the Bus stop and went sideways into the wall of the Carousel. The new foam 'soft wall' isn't that soft! The car's damaged pretty badly, but the driver was ok.
The second bad crash was a 911 that lost it in Turn 11 before the main straight: last run of the day, with about 5 minutes left of the run group: he got tail happy, slammed the front driver's side end into the barrier at the entrance to the pits, and then whipped the back end around for another hit. The driver and instructor were ok, but the car, unforunately, is in sad shape: they had to fork lift it off the track! (Al P saw it all in his rear mirror: yikes!)
Mechanical issues: 1 engine blew up (literally!) possibly due to a missed shift; one car's radiator got a nice hole due to engine parts travelling at a high rate of speed on the track (see above!); A wheel cracked; A 944 blew a CV joint; a 914 lost a spark plug (stripped threads).
The Glen definately favors higher hp cars, and since my 944S2 is considered to be a 'momentum car', it was a good challenge for me to drive well in the corners and get the car up to speed on the straights.
OK, I'll stop going on and on and on: sorry, but it was an absolute blast!
To keep this on track (no pun) as a part of the 944 forum: there were about the same amount of 924/944/968 as 911's, by my estimation. At one point while I was out, there were four red 924/944's infront of me! A nice site to see, let me tell you!
This was my first time at the Glen. Here's my opinions:
Favorite spots:
-The Esses: fun going through threre flat out! You can really get a lot of momentum there! By Saturday, I was at WOT into turn 2. I think my exit speed was over 100! Yikes!
-The Off Camber: scary corner, due to the Blue Hedges (ie Armco) real close to the track at track-out, but with a little oversteer at track in, it feels real nice!
-The Inner Loop (ie Bus Stop): a couple of times, I was able to set the car up nicely for the exit: just a touch of oversteer, and the car would track out nicely into the outer loop.
Least favorite spots:
-The Outer Loop (ie Carousel): too afraid to push it, but it was fun to work on trailing throttle oversteer there.
-The Chute / Laces: couldn't find the line, and wasn't smooth enough with steering inputs to get that corner down...
It is really a fun track, but it isn't the easiest track to learn the line.
They combined the yellow run group (my group) with the blue (Al P's group, though I never did see Al on the track!) I thought it would be a little intimidating to be running with blue, but that was not the case. Eugene, my instructor was great! He is a very, very smooth driver, and was teaching me lots of great stuff! Thanks Gene!
The damage:
2 main crashes:
Unfortunately, a Boxster running in the Green run group lost it in the Bus stop and went sideways into the wall of the Carousel. The new foam 'soft wall' isn't that soft! The car's damaged pretty badly, but the driver was ok.
The second bad crash was a 911 that lost it in Turn 11 before the main straight: last run of the day, with about 5 minutes left of the run group: he got tail happy, slammed the front driver's side end into the barrier at the entrance to the pits, and then whipped the back end around for another hit. The driver and instructor were ok, but the car, unforunately, is in sad shape: they had to fork lift it off the track! (Al P saw it all in his rear mirror: yikes!)
Mechanical issues: 1 engine blew up (literally!) possibly due to a missed shift; one car's radiator got a nice hole due to engine parts travelling at a high rate of speed on the track (see above!); A wheel cracked; A 944 blew a CV joint; a 914 lost a spark plug (stripped threads).
The Glen definately favors higher hp cars, and since my 944S2 is considered to be a 'momentum car', it was a good challenge for me to drive well in the corners and get the car up to speed on the straights.
OK, I'll stop going on and on and on: sorry, but it was an absolute blast!
08-19-2002, 03:34 PM
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Zman,
Too bad about the Boxter. that shouldn't happen in Green IMO. Unfortunately I saw a 996 lose it in front of me coming out of big bend at Limerock and slide across the grass and bounce off the tires. Not pretty. Fortunately I dove off the track since i could have gotten clipped by him.
How did your car handle? Didn't you recently change the rear sway bar with the 968 M030 one?
John
Too bad about the Boxter. that shouldn't happen in Green IMO. Unfortunately I saw a 996 lose it in front of me coming out of big bend at Limerock and slide across the grass and bounce off the tires. Not pretty. Fortunately I dove off the track since i could have gotten clipped by him.
How did your car handle? Didn't you recently change the rear sway bar with the 968 M030 one?
John
08-19-2002, 03:46 PM
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Zoltan,
Thanks for the writeup. I'll be heading up this weekend for the Metro NY PCA sponsored DE. It'll be my second of the year/ever for me. Your post has me psyched.
IIRC, the outer loop is one heck of a blind apexing turn. Without the assist of the apex marker cone, I'd be all over the place trying to hit the apex right on this plus a bunch of other turns.
If you had to pick the one, most helpful thing your instructor helped you with, what would it be?
Mike
Thanks for the writeup. I'll be heading up this weekend for the Metro NY PCA sponsored DE. It'll be my second of the year/ever for me. Your post has me psyched.
IIRC, the outer loop is one heck of a blind apexing turn. Without the assist of the apex marker cone, I'd be all over the place trying to hit the apex right on this plus a bunch of other turns.
If you had to pick the one, most helpful thing your instructor helped you with, what would it be?
Mike
08-19-2002, 03:49 PM
#4
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Thread Starter
John,
Honestly, I really could not feel a great difference with the M030 rear sway bar. My instructor suggested that I go to full firm for the next DE event (I'm on the middle setting now). It did seem a little more responsive to trailing throttle oversteer, but I'm not sure if it's the car or just that I'm more familiar with the feeling.
That said, the car did handle terrific! Well balanced with a little push in some of the corners (The Toe, Turn 1 especially). I am learning out to gently set the suspension for a turn, and have noticed how much that helps to get the car out of a turn faster. The old saying "slow in, fast out" is so true.
Seeing the Boxster and 911 crashes were a good reality check for me: on the track, 100% concentration is necessary to maintain car control. And knowing your limits is vital to survival, but knowing what to do after you have surpassed your limits is essential. Or something like that...
-Zoltan.
Honestly, I really could not feel a great difference with the M030 rear sway bar. My instructor suggested that I go to full firm for the next DE event (I'm on the middle setting now). It did seem a little more responsive to trailing throttle oversteer, but I'm not sure if it's the car or just that I'm more familiar with the feeling.
That said, the car did handle terrific! Well balanced with a little push in some of the corners (The Toe, Turn 1 especially). I am learning out to gently set the suspension for a turn, and have noticed how much that helps to get the car out of a turn faster. The old saying "slow in, fast out" is so true.
Seeing the Boxster and 911 crashes were a good reality check for me: on the track, 100% concentration is necessary to maintain car control. And knowing your limits is vital to survival, but knowing what to do after you have surpassed your limits is essential. Or something like that...
-Zoltan.
08-19-2002, 06:10 PM
#5
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Thread Starter
[quote]Originally posted by Mike S.:
<strong>Zoltan,
If you had to pick the one, most helpful thing your instructor helped you with, what would it be?
Mike</strong><hr></blockquote>
Patience is the key.
Be patient with the car and with yourself.
Some examples:
1. Wait for the car's suspension to settle on turn in: be very, very smooth and slow with your steering. Be gentle with throttle and brake inputs.
2. Wait for the proper braking/shifting/turn in points.
3. Focus on one thing at a time: first brakes, then shifting, then turn in. Don't try to think of all three at once as you approach a turn. You will have plenty of time to focus on them one after the other.
Many of the turns are blind apexes at The Glen. Turn 2 in the Esses, The outer loop, the turn going into the boot, the toe, and especially the Off Camber are all late blind apexes. Again: wait for the track in point: resist the temptation to turn in too early: early apexes at the Glen can get you into trouble!
Have a blast! Looking forward to your report!
-Z-man.
<strong>Zoltan,
If you had to pick the one, most helpful thing your instructor helped you with, what would it be?
Mike</strong><hr></blockquote>
Patience is the key.
Be patient with the car and with yourself.
Some examples:
1. Wait for the car's suspension to settle on turn in: be very, very smooth and slow with your steering. Be gentle with throttle and brake inputs.
2. Wait for the proper braking/shifting/turn in points.
3. Focus on one thing at a time: first brakes, then shifting, then turn in. Don't try to think of all three at once as you approach a turn. You will have plenty of time to focus on them one after the other.
Many of the turns are blind apexes at The Glen. Turn 2 in the Esses, The outer loop, the turn going into the boot, the toe, and especially the Off Camber are all late blind apexes. Again: wait for the track in point: resist the temptation to turn in too early: early apexes at the Glen can get you into trouble!
Have a blast! Looking forward to your report!
-Z-man.
