MWymard

thanks guys, does anyone have any pics of these Fuchs?? im curious to see what they look like...what are some web pages that sells aftermarket stuff for 944 (951)'s?

bron964

Mwymard - as with any "newbie" you are going to have a lot of questions...but maybe you should do a litle research to answer some of the more basic questions. here's a list(taken from a recent post) you might want to start with:

General
-----------
<a href="http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/944_buyers_guide/944_buyers_guide.htm" target="_blank">http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/944_buyers_guide/944_buyers_guide.htm</a>
<a href="http://vista.pca.org//stl/944turbo.htm" target="_blank">http://vista.pca.org//stl/944turbo.htm</a>
<a href="http://www.connact.com/~kgross/FAQ/944faq.html" target="_blank">http://www.connact.com/~kgross/FAQ/944faq.html</a>
<a href="http://944faq.986.org/" target="_blank">http://944faq.986.org/</a>
<a href="http://www.cantonia.com/watercooler.html" target="_blank">http://www.cantonia.com/watercooler.html</a>


944 Specalists
--------------
<a href="http://www.944online.com/" target="_blank">http://www.944online.com/</a>

Body Kits
---------
<a href="http://www.americaninternationalracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.americaninternationalracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.gt-racing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.gt-racing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.allporsche.com/" target="_blank">http://www.allporsche.com/</a>

Dismantlers
-----------
<a href="http://www.20thstreetauto.com/" target="_blank">http://www.20thstreetauto.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.944ecology.com/" target="_blank">http://www.944ecology.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.autotechplus.com/" target="_blank">http://www.autotechplus.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.easypor.com/" target="_blank">http://www.easypor.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.oklahomaforeign.com/" target="_blank">http://www.oklahomaforeign.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.partsheaven.com/" target="_blank">http://www.partsheaven.com/</a>

General Porsche Parts Suppliers
-------------------------------
<a href="http://www.autoatlanta.com/" target="_blank">http://www.autoatlanta.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.drivewerks.com/" target="_blank">http://www.drivewerks.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.paragon-products.com/" target="_blank">http://www.paragon-products.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.pelicanparts.com/" target="_blank">http://www.pelicanparts.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.allzim.com/" target="_blank">http://www.allzim.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.9xauto.com/" target="_blank">http://www.9xauto.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.eurowebparts.com/" target="_blank">http://www.eurowebparts.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.foreignintrigue.com/" target="_blank">http://www.foreignintrigue.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.pap-parts.com/" target="_blank">http://www.pap-parts.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.performanceproducts.com/" target="_blank">http://www.performanceproducts.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.sunsetimports.com/" target="_blank">http://www.sunsetimports.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.tweeks.com/" target="_blank">http://www.tweeks.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.vertexauto.com/" target="_blank">http://www.vertexauto.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.ajusa.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ajusa.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.crescentporsche.com/" target="_blank">http://www.crescentporsche.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.my-porsche.com/" target="_blank">http://www.my-porsche.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.perfection-plus.com/" target="_blank">http://www.perfection-plus.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.prestigeparts.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://www.prestigeparts.co.uk/</a>
<a href="http://www.strasseusa.com/" target="_blank">http://www.strasseusa.com/</a>

Other
-----
<a href="http://www.autothority.com/" target="_blank">http://www.autothority.com/</a>
<a href="http://extremegeez.com/" target="_blank">http://extremegeez.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.quaifeamerica.com/" target="_blank">http://www.quaifeamerica.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.recaro-nao.com/" target="_blank">http://www.recaro-nao.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.recaro.com/" target="_blank">http://www.recaro.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.sparcousa.com/" target="_blank">http://www.sparcousa.com/</a>

Racing Specialists
------------------
<a href="http://www.andersonmotorworks.com/" target="_blank">http://www.andersonmotorworks.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.blackforestautomotive.com/" target="_blank">http://www.blackforestautomotive.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.bkauto.com/" target="_blank">http://www.bkauto.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.ebsracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ebsracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.huntleyracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.huntleyracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.ioportracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ioportracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.kellymoss.com/" target="_blank">http://www.kellymoss.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.kokeln.com/" target="_blank">http://www.kokeln.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.lindseyracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.lindseyracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.performanceautoworks.net/" target="_blank">http://www.performanceautoworks.net/</a>
<a href="http://www.scargoracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.scargoracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.smart-racing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.smart-racing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.speedforceracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.speedforceracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.tarett.com/" target="_blank">http://www.tarett.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.technodyneracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.technodyneracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.theracersgroup.com/" target="_blank">http://www.theracersgroup.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.windward-perf.com/" target="_blank">http://www.windward-perf.com/</a>

Suspension & Brake Specalists
-----------------------------
<a href="http://www.bilstein.com/" target="_blank">http://www.bilstein.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.carrerashocks.com/" target="_blank">http://www.carrerashocks.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.eibach.com/" target="_blank">http://www.eibach.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.eshocks.com/" target="_blank">http://www.eshocks.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.frozenrotors.com/" target="_blank">http://www.frozenrotors.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.germanpartsusa.com/" target="_blank">http://www.germanpartsusa.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.hrsprings.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hrsprings.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.jrzsuspension.com/" target="_blank">http://www.jrzsuspension.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.koni.com/" target="_blank">http://www.koni.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.ledasuspension.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://www.ledasuspension.co.uk/</a>
<a href="http://www.morissdampers.com/" target="_blank">http://www.morissdampers.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.motonsuspension.com/" target="_blank">http://www.motonsuspension.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.penskeshocks.com/" target="_blank">http://www.penskeshocks.com/</a>
<a href="http://prospeedmotorsport.com/" target="_blank">http://prospeedmotorsport.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.qa1.net/" target="_blank">http://www.qa1.net/</a>
<a href="http://www.racersedge-inc.com/" target="_blank">http://www.racersedge-inc.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.rogerkrausracing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.rogerkrausracing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.sachs-automotive.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://www.sachs-automotive.co.uk/</a>
<a href="http://www.sbcats.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://www.sbcats.co.uk/</a>
<a href="http://www.shox.com/" target="_blank">http://www.shox.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.weltmeister.com/" target="_blank">http://www.weltmeister.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.zielmotorsports.com/" target="_blank">http://www.zielmotorsports.com/</a>

Tools
-----
<a href="http://www.harborfreight.com/" target="_blank">http://www.harborfreight.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.snapon.com/" target="_blank">http://www.snapon.com/</a>

Wheels & Tires
--------------
<a href="http://www.fikse.com/" target="_blank">http://www.fikse.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.frhinternational.com/" target="_blank">http://www.frhinternational.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.kinesismotorsport.com/" target="_blank">http://www.kinesismotorsport.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.rhwheels.com/" target="_blank">http://www.rhwheels.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.groupawheels.com/" target="_blank">http://www.groupawheels.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.ronalusa.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ronalusa.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.thewheelexchange.com/" target="_blank">http://www.thewheelexchange.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.wheel1.com/" target="_blank">http://www.wheel1.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.tirerack.com/" target="_blank">http://www.tirerack.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.upon3racing.com/" target="_blank">http://www.upon3racing.com/</a>
<a href="http://www.wheelenhancement.com/" target="_blank">http://www.wheelenhancement.com/</a>

<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Deepice

Dan you da man!

Robby

The only real thing that turns me away from '86's is their lack of ABS- this may or may not be important to you. Anyway, air bags were not available on the '86's either- a benefit if you ask me. LSD is another thing- you can sometimes find '86's w/LSD- I'm not sure about '87's- they DID have optional LSD AND ABS, but I'm not sure about air bags. '88's had all as an option, and the '88 Turbo S, as well as the '89's, had all of these things STANDARD- they also had larger brakes (same from the 928 S4), and MO30 suspension (slightly stiffer springs, adj Konis, larger t-bars, sways, bushings, etc), as well as shot peened 1st and 2nd, and several other small mods on the transaxle- I also understand that the oil cooler was either non-existent on normal 951's OR modified on the Turbo S- I may be wrong on this one though (I trust someone will let me know). Other perks include the 10-speaker stereo system and 10-band EQ (if you can find one that has all the stuff it's supposed to anyway), 16x7 & 16x9 forged Club Sport wheels wearing 225/50/16 & 245/45/16 tires, whereas the regular 951 had 16x7 & 16x8's w/205/55/16 & 225/50/16 tires- the rear tire on the Turbo S is a hair too small for the 9" wide rim though, but it's SUPPOSED to help handling to have more rim under there(?). I think that's it- what gave the Turbo S 247HP & 258TQ vs the normal Turbo's 217 & 238 (or 240 depending on where you read) were hotter chips and a k26#8 turbo vs k26#6- as has already been mentioned, modern day chips more than make up for this- you can narrow down the difference to ~10HP w/chips alone, AND, the normal turbo is better about spool-up: it's TQ peaks at 3500 & power at 5800 whereas the Turbo S is 4000 & 6000.

The 968 is a nice way to go, especially if you can get the sport package, and preferably '93 and up, since they have Torsen LSD's only- '92 would be fine, as it was an option, assuming you have the right one- the ZF's aren't bad though. The 968 CS is cool- it has 236HP & 225TQ w/17x7.5 & 17x9's wearing 225/45/17 & 255/40/17's. It also has the MO30 suspension which was changed for the 968 to have bigger sways AND helper springs for the rear- also has better weight distribution- 49/51 vs ~51/49 b/c of 6-sp trans and less weight up front due to lack of turbo- the 6-sp kind of bites though- too short- 6th is shorter than 5th is in a 951!

I personally wouldn't rule out ANY of these cars- I'd look for an S2, 968, or 951 of any year and assess each one individually maybe weeding them out by price and/or color until you narrow down the feild. If you're determined to get a turbo, hopefully what we've said will be of help- I personally would rather have a Turbo S, or at least an '87 & up w/LSD & ABS, but wouldn't rule out ANY of them for the right price....

Good luck...

Brian Wilson

Does anyone have the HP for the Euro S2 and possibly the weight of the coupe???

Olli Snellman

Euro S2 210 hp, US 208 hp.

M030 was not standard on 968 CS, it's quite rare option even with CS model.

Olli
'88 951

Brian Wilson

Thanks Olli.

Just checked, didn't realize Finland was so far away!

Dave

MO30 is an option code, the package that is called MO30 is an option, therefore it isn't standard on any model. LSD was available on all MY turbos as an option, IIRC it was standard on the turbo S. If it is important to you, find a car that has it.

ribs

Regarding fuchs...my car came with them. Here is a couple of pictures of it with faded wheels:





Here is a picture of my car with the 993 replica wheels:


Here is a closeup of just the wheel:



Bron, you are the man!

HTH,

-ribs

MWymard

those 993 reps are sweeeet, are they 17s? any modifications needed to fit them on the car? where can you purchase them at? and at what cost?

ribs

Yeah...17x7.5 and 17x9 w/ 225/45 17 front rubber and 255/40 17 rear rubber. I got them from tire rack...they are manufacturered by mille miglia, but FRH (?) also makes the same wheels, aparently in the same factory. They come with a spacer cast into the wheel if ordered in the correct offset, so no modification is necessary (all though I did have to roll one of my rear fenders because I had a mild body dent...it was easy though). I bought them from tire rack, and they were a bit under $1500 w/ shipping IIRC...$900 some odd for just the wheels, $500 some odd for the tires. I am happy with them...it really sets the car apart, making it look much newer than it actually is.

More pictures (I lost a center cap fyi):

icat

993 wheels are from Porsche 911's from the mid to late 90's (IIRC) and can be purchased used, new, or aftermarket (heavy). The least expensive option is used and a set is generally around $800. The wheel is a 17" wheel and does have the late model offset. If you decide to purchase an 86 951, then you will need to use spacers to fit the wheels. The spacers required are 21mm in the front and 28mm in the rear. Both front and rear will require new wheel studs. If you purchase an 87 or newer 951, then the wheels will bolt right on.



This is my 86 951 with 993 wheels.

MWymard

man, both of your 951s are soooo sweet, wow, i feel like i really learned a lot in the way of these porsches, do you guys regret buying the '86, or do you think it was wise? ive been shopping and ive seen some decent mileage, maintained '86 951's for aboutb 7500...now i just need to dump this friggin' supercharged mustang so i can get the car of my current dreams!

icat

I bought my 86 951 in 1997. At the time I was unaware of the differences between the models. So, I guess in this case ignorance was bliss!

I have not felt the need to modify mine until just this year. The power of the stock 951 is quite impressive, even if it does give up several horses to the newer turbos. Off the line acceleration will not impress anyone but your Grandmother, but look out from 40 to 100 - it comes in a heartbeat!

I do not regret buying the 86, however I was not looking for a red one. As a matter of fact, I looked for nearly 6 months trying to find one in ANY other color than red. Everyone I looked at that wasn't red was a real dog. I finally gave in when I found this one and picked it up.

Best advise I can give is to find a decent example and don't worry so much about the year. Each of the model years have their own set of advantages. Just don't be fooled into buying one that needs work to save on the initial purchase. The cost of bringing these cars "back to life" is mind boggling.

MWymard

oh yeah, i definitely know the debt ill put myself into if i buy one thats a lemon...yeah, when i started to look, i did not want a red one at all, but the more i look, the more i love the red color on these cars...ive seen silver ones, and they dont do it for me, and ive seen black ones, and every car ive owned has been black, so i dont want another black car, so i guess red will be the color i hunt for...thanks for all the info!