So why do Boxster/Cayman owners take such abuse?
11-04-2008, 04:10 PM
#1
Drifting
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So why do Boxster/Cayman owners take such abuse?
I've got 12 months of PCA membership and Porsche ownership under my belt and I think I have a pretty good grip on the various internal classifications that divide the Porsche community.
You have air cooled versus water cooled, front engine versus rear, older versus newer. Each group has its sense of superiority over the other(s). And there's a distinct pecking order. While I take some comfort in the fact that Boxsters/Caymans are disrespected almost as much as 944s [
], I often wonder why.
Is it just because they were the first mass market successes for Porsche? Is it because non-enthusiasts bought them? Why is popularity such a bad thing?
Or is there something fundamentally unworthy about the cars? Do they have reliability issues? In some ways, the Boxster/Cayman is the purest balanced platform Porsche has ever made; and if it weren't for the need to protect 911 culture, it would probably get much more development.
Audi was a narrow niche player until the B4 A4 was released. But the Audi faithful did not scorn the A4.
I only ask b/c I see my next track car being a Cayman; and I'm OK with the low esteem, but I want to make sure it's just image and not the car itself.
You have air cooled versus water cooled, front engine versus rear, older versus newer. Each group has its sense of superiority over the other(s). And there's a distinct pecking order. While I take some comfort in the fact that Boxsters/Caymans are disrespected almost as much as 944s [
], I often wonder why. Is it just because they were the first mass market successes for Porsche? Is it because non-enthusiasts bought them? Why is popularity such a bad thing?
Or is there something fundamentally unworthy about the cars? Do they have reliability issues? In some ways, the Boxster/Cayman is the purest balanced platform Porsche has ever made; and if it weren't for the need to protect 911 culture, it would probably get much more development.
Audi was a narrow niche player until the B4 A4 was released. But the Audi faithful did not scorn the A4.
I only ask b/c I see my next track car being a Cayman; and I'm OK with the low esteem, but I want to make sure it's just image and not the car itself.
11-04-2008, 04:19 PM
#2
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from what I see, the Boxter line was a "mass market - I got a Pooorsch" sell.
It also brought huge $$ into the company and allowed them to have the cash for future development.
I like it when I'm gassin up, and turn to a boxter owner and say " how do you like the 986 ", and they respond with " Its a Porsche Boxter " in a condescending way ......
Just in my apt. building there are like 6 or 7 Cayanne(sp) many Boxters, many 996/911 types, and only one other 944, and the 944 guy didn't even notice there was another 944 in front of him as he drove in the gate. Later I saw him in the elevator, and he had just bought it, so I gave him a Rennlist card of course
Don
edit: now I'll have a 944 & a 951 parked
It also brought huge $$ into the company and allowed them to have the cash for future development.
I like it when I'm gassin up, and turn to a boxter owner and say " how do you like the 986 ", and they respond with " Its a Porsche Boxter " in a condescending way ......
Just in my apt. building there are like 6 or 7 Cayanne(sp) many Boxters, many 996/911 types, and only one other 944, and the 944 guy didn't even notice there was another 944 in front of him as he drove in the gate. Later I saw him in the elevator, and he had just bought it, so I gave him a Rennlist card of course
Don
edit: now I'll have a 944 & a 951 parked
11-04-2008, 04:33 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
Here is the way I envision/describe a Boxster from a previous thread....
I know there have been threads in the past about why we love these cars, but maybe you have new stories you want to add. After a recent drive today, I am finding myself even happier with my choice of a "Fun" car.
We had a 2002 Boxster S Convertible in the shop for a few days now tracking down a check engine light issue. After making a repair to the air/oil separator, the vehicle needed to be drivin a few times for drive cycle reasons to ensure the light was not going to come on the moment the customer left the shop.
So of course, being the shop manager, I opted to take it to lunch today!
I came back slightly uninspired I must say. I can see why they call these a girls Porsche. The car feels fast if you are starting in 1st and moving through the gears. It only starts to open up when the rpm's are over 5k. I guess I was just expecting more from an S model. Cruising around even in 3rd gear and punching it, it just didn't feel the same. The whole time driving all I could think about was how much this car needed a turbo!!
Aside from the feel of the engine, the seats were bolstered poorly, and the interior felt like I was in a bigger version of a Miata. I love my P car, and would love to own a whole fleet. But you can count the Boxster off my list. I love my 951, and would love to own it until the day we have no more gasoline for me to enjoy it properly. Then maybe I can just look at it while parked in my garage dreaming of the booooooooost.
We had a 2002 Boxster S Convertible in the shop for a few days now tracking down a check engine light issue. After making a repair to the air/oil separator, the vehicle needed to be drivin a few times for drive cycle reasons to ensure the light was not going to come on the moment the customer left the shop.
So of course, being the shop manager, I opted to take it to lunch today!
I came back slightly uninspired I must say. I can see why they call these a girls Porsche. The car feels fast if you are starting in 1st and moving through the gears. It only starts to open up when the rpm's are over 5k. I guess I was just expecting more from an S model. Cruising around even in 3rd gear and punching it, it just didn't feel the same. The whole time driving all I could think about was how much this car needed a turbo!!
Aside from the feel of the engine, the seats were bolstered poorly, and the interior felt like I was in a bigger version of a Miata. I love my P car, and would love to own a whole fleet. But you can count the Boxster off my list. I love my 951, and would love to own it until the day we have no more gasoline for me to enjoy it properly. Then maybe I can just look at it while parked in my garage dreaming of the booooooooost.
11-04-2008, 05:15 PM
#5
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I don't know if this varies from Region to Region, but around here the Boxster and Cayman are much appreciated track cars. The 911 remains more powerful but a well driven Cayman S will show its heels to a well driven 911 Carrera (note I did not say an "S"). Pretty much everyone agrees that a Cayman with a GT3 engine would be THE TRACK car, nothing short of a Cup would touch it.
Best,
Best,
11-04-2008, 05:15 PM
#6
Herr Unmöglich
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As others have said, because these cars appealed more to the mass market, and not just the enthusiast. Like the earlier watercoolers, they aren't 911's so the purists snicker. I admit that driving mine around the only waves I get are from drivers of older 911's. You don't see it coming from most Boxster owners.
F 'em.
I didn't buy the car for the badge or the image I bought it for the engineering. In my early S, sure I could use some more hp. But honestly it does have just about all it needs for the street. It does like to be kept above 4K RPM's for optimum power, no question. But the car is sublime in the corners and a delight to take an alfresco drive with the missus on a fall evening like this one.
So what if other people have no clue what they are talking about, or let preconceptions cloud their judgment. Get one and REALLY wring it out. They are quite competent, fun little cars. And for the current market prices, a very good performance value.
F 'em.
I didn't buy the car for the badge or the image I bought it for the engineering. In my early S, sure I could use some more hp. But honestly it does have just about all it needs for the street. It does like to be kept above 4K RPM's for optimum power, no question. But the car is sublime in the corners and a delight to take an alfresco drive with the missus on a fall evening like this one.So what if other people have no clue what they are talking about, or let preconceptions cloud their judgment. Get one and REALLY wring it out. They are quite competent, fun little cars. And for the current market prices, a very good performance value.
11-04-2008, 05:17 PM
#7
Race Director
Personally I really like Boxsters and can see myself picking up a silver S to add to my stable in the next few years. The several that I have driven, including a couple of the early non-S models, have been very enjoyable. They are starting to depreciate to the point that they are becoming a great buy.
The Cayman is just bad-***. I love the look and stance of that car. I haven't driven one yet but I am certain I would love it.
As far as the snobbery goes, I wouldn't even think twice about it. I couldn't give two squirts as to what someone else thinks about my toys. The 944 people should be the closest bretheren to the Cayman/Boxster crowd anyway. Most of the 911/930/993/996/997 guys look at anything that doesn't have a motor in the rear as being "different". That's OK. (BTW I like all of those cars too)
Who cares if someone in a <insert model# here> doesn't wave at you? Drive what you like.
The Cayman is just bad-***. I love the look and stance of that car. I haven't driven one yet but I am certain I would love it.
As far as the snobbery goes, I wouldn't even think twice about it. I couldn't give two squirts as to what someone else thinks about my toys. The 944 people should be the closest bretheren to the Cayman/Boxster crowd anyway. Most of the 911/930/993/996/997 guys look at anything that doesn't have a motor in the rear as being "different". That's OK. (BTW I like all of those cars too)
Who cares if someone in a <insert model# here> doesn't wave at you? Drive what you like.
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11-04-2008, 05:23 PM
#8
I'm in PCA Potomac and am coming up on 12 months myself.
You can't really win. You will be looked down upon by others and will look down upon others depending on what P-car you own. I think it just shows the nearly universal passion owners have about each type of car.
Unless you have a 356, which everybody respects. But then you drive pretty slow so you still can't really win. :P
You can't really win. You will be looked down upon by others and will look down upon others depending on what P-car you own. I think it just shows the nearly universal passion owners have about each type of car.
Unless you have a 356, which everybody respects. But then you drive pretty slow so you still can't really win. :P
11-04-2008, 06:04 PM
#9
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My experience at DEs is that the Cayman/Boxster folks actually do gravitate to the 944 area of the paddock!
11-04-2008, 06:12 PM
#10
Race Director
I like the Cayman...the interior (of the one I have been eyeing) looks a bit "cheap", and it feels a bit heavy but other than that I really liked it.
The Boxster, however, just somehow falls in the category of Miata, Golf Cabrio, 6cyl Mustang Convert.,...you know what I am saying, a girls car. Just doesn't seem to have any testoerone....IMO. Not saying it isn't a good car, but if people have to stop and consider:
"...hey honey, look. That guy is driving a Boxster...do you think he is gay?"
I just couldn't do it...Just my opinion, which doesn't mean a thing.
The Boxster, however, just somehow falls in the category of Miata, Golf Cabrio, 6cyl Mustang Convert.,...you know what I am saying, a girls car. Just doesn't seem to have any testoerone....IMO. Not saying it isn't a good car, but if people have to stop and consider:
"...hey honey, look. That guy is driving a Boxster...do you think he is gay?"
I just couldn't do it...Just my opinion, which doesn't mean a thing.
11-04-2008, 06:34 PM
#11
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I dunno where all of you are meeting the Porsche snobs. Every PCA or Rennlist meeting I've been to has welcomed my vehicle into the crowd. And I've been in events in NY, NJ, PA, and NC where I'm often outnumbered by 911s and never have I ever heard any negative comments about my choice of vehicle.
I'm thinking the people who put down a Boxster (or 944 for that matter) are the same individuals who bought it for the badge. And in a year or two they'll get tired of the lack of electronic goodies, harsh ride, and loud interior and they'll trade it in for the next flavor of the week vehicle.
These people help the enthusiast's cause since they take the depreciation hit for us so we can purchase slightly used Porsches at a significant discount.
I'm thinking the people who put down a Boxster (or 944 for that matter) are the same individuals who bought it for the badge. And in a year or two they'll get tired of the lack of electronic goodies, harsh ride, and loud interior and they'll trade it in for the next flavor of the week vehicle.
These people help the enthusiast's cause since they take the depreciation hit for us so we can purchase slightly used Porsches at a significant discount.
11-04-2008, 08:30 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
I've been driving a 928. Few comments.
The other day, I drove our tired old 944 to work. Bunches of comments. One lady escorted me to the parking lot so she could actually drive it. The 944 / 951 lines are awesome. Lady says "I like the looks of this one much more than the other one you drive".
As far as the boxter / other Porsche folks, I avoid them. Anyway, their cars may be newer, and maybe a bit faster theoretically, but I'm f'n crazy and thus will always win.
For the record, I like the 944 a lot, but the 928 is my favorite, being an asxman. I do have to admit the black wheels and sunroof and stance make it very old school cool, though, without being Pacer-like.
The other day, I drove our tired old 944 to work. Bunches of comments. One lady escorted me to the parking lot so she could actually drive it. The 944 / 951 lines are awesome. Lady says "I like the looks of this one much more than the other one you drive".
As far as the boxter / other Porsche folks, I avoid them. Anyway, their cars may be newer, and maybe a bit faster theoretically, but I'm f'n crazy and thus will always win.
For the record, I like the 944 a lot, but the 928 is my favorite, being an asxman. I do have to admit the black wheels and sunroof and stance make it very old school cool, though, without being Pacer-like.
11-04-2008, 08:32 PM
#13
Drifting
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So far, the only people I hear talk down my car are non-Porsche owners. Usually goes something like "couldn't afford a 911, eh?" from some kid in a Honda or Kia. The Porsche enthusiasts have been nothing but friendly.
11-04-2008, 08:39 PM
#14
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I think that the original boxster got a bit of a rep as a "chick car" (soft top, low power, comfortable). Having spent considerable time driving my dad's 987S, however, I can say with great certainty that there's nothing "effeminate" about that car - it will kick *** and take names amongst even the most macho sports cars selling for under $100k.
And, in my experience, I've never really met anyone who looked down on the car really, but maybe I just don't hang out with snotty enough people
And, in my experience, I've never really met anyone who looked down on the car really, but maybe I just don't hang out with snotty enough people
