jjmson

A beat cop in NY City I respect, that's a tough, dangerous and underpaid job.

Then again you rarely find a NY Beat cop standing on the side of a dark road with a small stop sign.

It's the cops outside of the City that we have more of a problem with. Your house gets broken in "We'll file a report, but the chances of finding the perpetrator...", your car gets stolen "We'll file a report, but the chances of finding the perpetrator...", You get mugged or attacked "We'll file a report, but the chances of finding the perpetrator...", Yet fully 90% of the police force in any small town is sitting on the side fo the road trying to get speeders or Fecking up.. Sorry directing traffic.

In NY the situation is reversed. You guys could probably care less about speeders and the like.

Parking tickets on the other hand.....

 

First off, I always have had alot of respect for cops and do not think that they are all jerks by any means.
But some sure can be!
One summer I got pulled over at least once a month in Montclair, NJ in my 911 for doing nothing wrong. One evening a friend and I where coming home from shooting pool about midnight, nice evening with the top down and this cop pulls us over and admits I was doing nothing wrong, as he gives me my license back he says " You have to be careful in a car like this, it's easy to speed" I just looked at him with disbelief. Nothing good can come from mouthing off to a cop so I just shuddup and left.
Living in NJ I do find that some towns have a different cop culture than others.

That said, I have been let off the hook more times than I can count for speeding by cops, NJ State Troopers have been very cool to me and living in NYC or close to it all my life I have never had an issue with NYPD. A cop in my town is even a 951 owner.

Just my .0002 cents

 

"Cops" in the broad sense are no different than any other group of people. As a defense attorney, I have to deal with cops all the time. Most are decent, hard-working people. However, a few let their power go to their head. They believe that since they're the ones on the street, no one understands them. I represented death row inmates in FL for nearly 2 years. More than a few were there b/c a police officer lied on the stand to get them off the street. I agree a lot of these people were/are bad, but one person doesn't get to decide who lives or dies. Police have that power and I believe that's why Joe/Jane American holds them up to such high standards. The idea of someone being an ******* is something we accept. The idea of that ******* being a cop with a GUN is pretty damn scary!

 

There are two things that cause police to get a negative reputation.

1: Setting up radar traps and ticketing drivers who are not excessively speeding

2: Not being there when needed or not doing anything when they are there.

I believe police should not enforce speed limits by setting up radar traps. Such practice is pure entrapment and does not serve any purpose other than to generate funds. Radar traps do not contribute to increasing safety. If anyone wants to argue this, I'll gladly explain why. To generate funding there is a much much more cost effective way of doing so: speed cameras.

This not only costs LESS, but it frees up police to be where they are needed, when they are needed.

Lastly, I know police like everyone else, are human, and as such are prone to the emotional falacies we all have. However, if a cop has a bad day on the job, and at the end of it, decides to take it out on me, (22yr old in a red porsche) because he's jealous he's driving a cheapo ford escort - HE HAS NO RIGHT to do so whatsoever. That is called powertripping and police do it WAY TO OFTEN.

I respect the job police have to do, but they have to respect that they cannot treat innocent taxpayers with contempt whenever they are in a bad mood. Around here, you cannot disagree with a police officer about anything, even if they are wrong, unless you are in a court room. (because that is the only place a cop has to watch his behavior.)

I would like to scan an article in today's paper about police using excessive force to deal with local people. If anyone wants to read it, i'll scan it.

jjmson20, it's not police, especially not beat cops, that I have issue with, it's the traffic cops that take out thier pent up problems with motorists who don't deserve to put up with thier crap. Manning's post is a perfect example of a smart *** cop who needs a bitch slap.

 

First off, there will always be an amaf, rather he be a Rennlister or a cop directing traffic. That having been said, I have great respect for the cops that actually do their job to serve and protect. I was watching the movie 44 Minutes last night about the North Hollywood shoot out and it was amazing how this cop ran out from behind his car, into the direct line of fire only to save a civilian that he had never met before. This cop was shot but fortunately he was able to survive thanks to the quick thinking and bravery displayed by his comrades.

 

ahhh i feel much better after a nights sleep....i agree with that ill say that small towners may have nothing more to do than set up speed traps or stand on the road being invisibe. Sorry Rich but setting up a radar trap is certainly not entrapment. If the signs said feel free to drive as fast as you want..then they nailed you with a gun that would be entrapment. Michelle I can say that my run-ins with defense attorneys have been nothing but unpleasant...Sure I'm not saying all cops are straight shooters, but a majority are because we have too much to lose if we get caught in a lie. I have yet to take out a bad day on anyone , especially with a nicer car..i compliment them and talk car talk its a way of gaining that much more respect and connecting with people who think your brainwashed robots. Thanks Tom R. you know what the deal is here, I'm up in north flatbush in the 70.

 

Just my 2 cents: The ONLY way to (potentially) successfully deal with law enforcement (from a citizen's perspective) is with a good and cooperative attitude. You've got to remember that cops have probably seen it all, and have almost definitely heard it all (regarding excuses!). And they are used to dealing EVERY DAY with people who don't want to be dealing with them: Victims of crime, victimizers of others who happened to get caught, or drivers who were "just minding their own business" when they see the reds and/or blues in their rearview mirrors.

Bottom line: If you treat a cop with respect, knowing and understanding what they do every day, then you MIGHT get a break. If you bust their ***** and bad-mouth them, you can virtually be assured to get that ticket, and it will most likely be for the max infraction they can come up with.

Manning - I think that what you did was admirable, trying to help out a guy (who may or may not put his life on the line every day), and keep him from getting wiped out due to his being in a bad situation with bad equipment. I believe that his response was entirely inappropriate, and can only hope that he was either having a really bad day or is just one of the vast minority of mediocre/poor cops.

There has been one post about getting stopped repeatedly (while actually doing nothing wrong) because of driving a car that looks fast (even while parked). This too is in the vast minority. I think that all of us would have many more tickets if we were stopped every time we did something stupid or illegal. I know that I would. Therefore, when you do get stopped, you have to think about all the times you got away with it, but didn't get caught. Getting stopped is usually your own fault, and there is no reason to get pissed at the cop. Suck it up, take it like an adult, treat the cop with the respect and dignity appropriate for someone wearing a badge, and hope for the best.

By the way, they've most likely already heard that excuse you were working on as they were walking up to your window...

Post has drifted. Manning you were right to say what you said, and it sounds as though you said it with respect to the officer. It is too bad that you ended up with a sour taste in your mouth for just trying to "protect and serve" on your own. Let's be generous and just chalk it up to one cop having a bad day. I hope that if the same situation happened tomorrow that you would do and say the exact same thing. You can be happy with who you are, even if this one cop couldn't be happy with who he was.

Tom

 

Hey Tom,

While I agree with you on several points there is no excuse for being stopped for doing nothing wrong. It is a waste of my time and the officers.
Profiling is a big debate these days, pulling over someone driving a sports car is nothing more than harassment. I take issue with being some bored cops amusement.

I have no problems with cops, the reason I think I escape tickets is because I always admit what I did and am pleasant when pulled over.
As someone mentioned, these guys have heard it all and insulting their intelligence is a bad idea.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Marc Gelefsky:
<strong>
I have no problems with cops, the reason I think I escape tickets is because I always admit what I did and am pleasant when pulled over.
As someone mentioned, these guys have heard it all and insulting their intelligence is a bad idea.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Marc,

I am not defending every bad cop, or every bad move that they make. It sounds like you already do things 100% correctly when stopped, and that has led to your success.

Some things will not change, however, and we can only really work to optimize a non-optimal situation. I may get in big trouble for saying this, but profiling has worked to some extent in getting bad guys off the street (which is the only reason police departments would use the technique). Only trouble is that some good guys also get swept up in the net, at least for a short time. Is it the ultimate, best technique for law enforcement? Definitely not. Does it work to make the streets safer for the majority of users? Many times, yes. Is there a better way? Probably, and ultimately something better will be put into use. Cops are generally understaffed, and will utilize the tools which they are aware of which are the most effective and least "staff consuming".

And while I am in no way faulting you, your driving or your attitude/concern, you must be a significantly better driver than I am. I probably can't remember a time when I was out for a drive and did absolutely nothing wrong (obeyed EVERY speed limit, stayed at least 1 car length for each 10 MPH from the guy in front of me, came to a full and complete stop at every stop sign, etc.) You did something which brought you to the cop's attention, which was incidentally magnified by your one of your beautiful red "ticket-me" machines.

Yes it is a hassle and a delay, and even an embarassment to be pulled over. It is even worse to then get cited, which you have avoided. But it is something we will have to put up with until better police systems and methods come along (if ever). The nature of the beast, the name of the game.

Driving is a priviledge, not a right. As such we choose to take the good with the bad, and deal with things on a case-by-case basis. At least with beautiful p-cars, there is so much more good than bad...

Tom

 

Tom,

Yes, I most certainly would approach the officer in much the same way if it should happen again. If he was irritable the first time, image how pissy he would be if he got laid out by some driver who couldn't see him because he was so poorly equipped.

I know as a fact the reflective vest he was wearing was not the proper equipment for the task at hand, having researched this when we were trying to get the contract to supply safety equipment for Atlanta Police Dept. for their bicycle mounted units.

I try to not be so thin skinned about run ins with the police, but have to tell you it gets old after a while (I have a lot of person stories if you want to read them. In all cases I was either in the right or an innocent by-stander). They are in a high stress/high risk career, but they volunteered for the job. If you are going to be trusted to carry a gun and make life and death decisions, then you are going to be held to a higher standard. jjmson20 perfectly illustrates part of the problem; he got emotional about this thread only to come back later after a good nights sleep with a more rational point of view. How many other police are out there that haven't had a good nights sleep?

I will, however, continue to give them the benefit of the doubt. I just wish they would do the same, more often than not.

 

The thing about cops that really gets me is that they seem never to be there when you need them, but are there for the smallest infraction. No cops showed up or did anything when a homeless guy broke into my apartment and stole a bunch of electronic equipment and ran down the street in broad daylight (5pm). But, and off-duty cop chased me down from the grocery store to my apartment to tell me my license plate didn't light up. May just be where I live, but seriously, where are the priorities? God forbid my plate doesn't illuminate, but let the guy living in a dumpster run away with hundreds of dollars worth of electronics.

 

yes, we all need to rant and bitch every once in a while. doesn't it feel good?

In defense of all police officers (in my region at least) they all work 12hour shifts, and often can't get adequate rest. I totally sympathise with that because I work graveyards and for the past week the City of Vancouver has been laying down a new watermain 10 feet away from my 1/32" thick bedroom window, for the entire time I should be sleeping. BUT - I do not go to work and **** on all the customers that night. In the private sector we have a term called customer service. Wouldn't it be nice if police treated law abiding taxpayers as valuable customers? Too bad they have a monopoly on the business

 

A word of advice. Never EVER try to give a cop a word of advice or communicate with them in any way.

I once had a cop very angrily and physically agressively order me across the street. He was on a traffic stop, but the two of us weren't even near it. I told him that was rude and unneccesary.
and that "he needed to grow up"

10 hours later I was released from jail for $1500 bond and with two charges and a court date.
Both totally fabricated and absurb and will be dismissed, but I spent the night in jail regardless. (public intox, disorderly conduct)

I had lots of political debates with 4 or 5 officers while getting booked.
I was horrified to find that these guys are more like super right wing ****'s. They don't support freedom of speech and if you don't agree with their views then "you need to get the hell outta our country"

Avoid police officers at all cost.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by jjmson20:
<strong>First off to all you people who think you say these witty remarks to cops to there face are full of crap. Maybe these small town hick cops dont have the gall to take action , but i promise you if anyone mouths off in the city they pay. It's a tough job..here anyway. So on behalf of the cop/rennlisters I'm not gonna let you white collar pencil pushers bad mouth a job you know nothing about, the things i see and deal with on a daily basis are unreal. I promise that most peeps would crap there pants if they walked a beat in brooklyn south. I just got in from work and I may be cranky...but i did the most important part i came home with the same amount of holes i went to work with. Now lets all drive our p-cars in peace...have a nice night</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Ahhh.. and here it is. The excuse to forget what one's job actually is. Personally, I think that any police officer that misinterprets "protect and serve" should be dismissed regardless of their excuses.

In my case, having to deal with ****ty people every day is no excuse to totally fabricate a police report and be extremely rude to ordinary law abiding citizens. Just keep using that excuse and you'll be so far past the line soon that you won't be able to see it anymore.

 

Tom,

Tom wrote:
&gt;And while I am in no way faulting you, your driving or your attitude/concern, you must be a &gt;significantly better driver than I am. I &gt;probably &gt;can't remember a time when I was out &gt;for a drive &gt;and did absolutely nothing wrong
(obeyed EVERY &gt;speed limit, stayed at least 1 car &gt;length for &gt;each 10 MPH from the guy in front of &gt;me, came to &gt;a full and complete stop at every &gt;stop sign, &gt;etc.) You did something which brought &gt;you to the &gt;cop's attention, which was &gt;incidentally magnified &gt;by your one of your &gt;beautiful red "ticket-me" &gt;machines.
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;

Well gee Tom, I did not say I am out doing nothing wrong, I simply stated that when I was pulled over I was indeed doing nothing wrong. As I stated if I am pulled over for doing something stupid, and I sure have done my share of stupid things I admit it.

I am sure I will get flamed for this but I agree profiling can indeed work in some situations and It certainly is a double standard that I think I am above being profiled. I admit that!
However, what profile does some twit like myself fit? Driving an old sports car at the speed limit?

Nothing like a good debate on a Monday!