New toy. 87 944S w/ 3.0 liter block
08-06-2008, 10:54 PM
#16
Rennlist Member
Congrats on the new car!
Hey, I thought you were getting that S2 for $5k out in oregon or washington? Did that fall through?
Hey, I thought you were getting that S2 for $5k out in oregon or washington? Did that fall through?
08-06-2008, 11:09 PM
#17
Have you looked to see if it has the "S" style oil cooler (water/oil heat exchanger box on the lower passenger side of the engine) or the "S2" air cooled oil cooler that's simular to the turbo (I think) ?
Either way, do yourself a favor and don't drive the car very far, if at all, before you fix the oil seals.
I believe the workshop manual says to replace the rod bearings in the event of oil/water mixing.
Good luck with your new toy !
Either way, do yourself a favor and don't drive the car very far, if at all, before you fix the oil seals.
I believe the workshop manual says to replace the rod bearings in the event of oil/water mixing.
Good luck with your new toy !
08-06-2008, 11:24 PM
#18
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08-06-2008, 11:27 PM
#19
Instructor
Thread Starter
I'm going to voice a concern.
Nice score- just get us some codes on the transmission. It doesn't say what kind of transaxle it is. The relevant codes are well up on the casing, may be hard to see. The S transaxle isn't strong enough for turbo/S2 power, and the NA box is marginal for the 2.5 cars, forget a 3 liter. I hope that's an S2 or turbo transaxle. Go easy on it until you find out.
Nice score- just get us some codes on the transmission. It doesn't say what kind of transaxle it is. The relevant codes are well up on the casing, may be hard to see. The S transaxle isn't strong enough for turbo/S2 power, and the NA box is marginal for the 2.5 cars, forget a 3 liter. I hope that's an S2 or turbo transaxle. Go easy on it until you find out.
08-06-2008, 11:29 PM
#20
Instructor
Thread Starter
So far i've just noticed the milkshake in the coolant tank. Nothing has shown up on the dipstick. Hopefully it hasn't mixed yet.
08-06-2008, 11:33 PM
#21
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08-06-2008, 11:54 PM
#22
Instructor
Thread Starter
Is there any replacement for the cap and rotor? Some other form of ignition upgrade or something.
08-07-2008, 05:33 AM
#24
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Cool! My car is the same exterior and interior color -- and also a 3.0L! Excellent choice. 
The tranny code is extremely difficult to access without removing the transmission -- it is at the TOP of the transmission bell-housing. You'll need to know exactly what to look for, a tiny mirror, and the ability to read letters with very little light from an awkward angle. You might be better off asking the previous owner....
For what it's worth, I've been beating the crap out of an 'S' LSD tranny with a 3.0L motor for a couple of years now. Whereas my original non-LSD na tranny blew up right away, this one keeps on ticking.....
BTW, congrats on buying the Washington S2 as well -- that was also a good deal! Welcome to the 'Multiple 944 Owners Club' !
The tranny code is extremely difficult to access without removing the transmission -- it is at the TOP of the transmission bell-housing. You'll need to know exactly what to look for, a tiny mirror, and the ability to read letters with very little light from an awkward angle. You might be better off asking the previous owner....
For what it's worth, I've been beating the crap out of an 'S' LSD tranny with a 3.0L motor for a couple of years now. Whereas my original non-LSD na tranny blew up right away, this one keeps on ticking.....
BTW, congrats on buying the Washington S2 as well -- that was also a good deal! Welcome to the 'Multiple 944 Owners Club' !
08-07-2008, 08:09 PM
#26
I had a pinched O-ring on my oil cooler that I didn't know about and really didn't see anything on the dipstick either (there was some dark stuff in the overflow tank I didn't notice either, because I was using the dark blue Audi coolant). Sometime after that oil-cooler seal job by that dumba$$ mechanic, I noticed a strange vibration I could feel thru the floorboard at a certain RPM only. Tried several things to find the source but eventually I HEARD a strange noise at the same rpm. Put the car in my garage and started going thru everthing. To make a long post shorter, I had trashed rod bearings (yes, all 4 sets).
Some will debate that because the oil pressure is much greater that the coolant pressure, you'll never get coolant into the oil (That's what the shop guy told me
). BUT that ignores the fact that when you shut the engine off, oil pressure drops to zero but the coolant pressure in a hot engine could be 25 psi or greater, depending on what pressure the coolant cap is rated for.PLEASE learn from my bad experience. DON'T drive the car before fixing the oil-cooler O-rings and seal. If it were me and I didn't know how long the oil-coolant mixing had been going on, I'd replace the rod bearings as a precautionary measure.
Just my hard earned 2cents
08-08-2008, 12:03 AM
#27
Nordschleife Master
Funny story...
I once test drove that car back a few years ago maybe around 2002-2003 in Xenia Ohio and I ran out of gas in your beloved 944. (Gas gauge works and so does the gas light) but the owner had not warned me before test drive so I figured it was broken. Long story short I come to rest in a drive way only to have seconds later the owner of the house drive out in his Shelby Cobra and give me a ride back to the then owner of the 944 so we could get some more gas..
P.S.
427 Shelby Cobras are fun (P.S. It was a superformance fake! but still sweet!)
Also, if your wondering the guy who put the engine in the car seemed to have a good idea about working on Porsches and at the time had a White 928S4 apart in the garage doing some transmission work.
I once test drove that car back a few years ago maybe around 2002-2003 in Xenia Ohio and I ran out of gas in your beloved 944. (Gas gauge works and so does the gas light) but the owner had not warned me before test drive so I figured it was broken. Long story short I come to rest in a drive way only to have seconds later the owner of the house drive out in his Shelby Cobra and give me a ride back to the then owner of the 944 so we could get some more gas..
P.S.
427 Shelby Cobras are fun (P.S. It was a superformance fake! but still sweet!)
Also, if your wondering the guy who put the engine in the car seemed to have a good idea about working on Porsches and at the time had a White 928S4 apart in the garage doing some transmission work.
08-08-2008, 01:30 AM
#28
Instructor
Thread Starter
Just a FWIW.
I had a pinched O-ring on my oil cooler that I didn't know about and really didn't see anything on the dipstick either (there was some dark stuff in the overflow tank I didn't notice either, because I was using the dark blue Audi coolant). Sometime after that oil-cooler seal job by that dumba$$ mechanic, I noticed a strange vibration I could feel thru the floorboard at a certain RPM only. Tried several things to find the source but eventually I HEARD a strange noise at the same rpm. Put the car in my garage and started going thru everthing. To make a long post shorter, I had trashed rod bearings (yes, all 4 sets).
Some will debate that because the oil pressure is much greater that the coolant pressure, you'll never get coolant into the oil (That's what the shop guy told me). BUT that ignores the fact that when you shut the engine off, oil pressure drops to zero but the coolant pressure in a hot engine could be 25 psi or greater, depending on what pressure the coolant cap is rated for.
PLEASE learn from my bad experience. DON'T drive the car before fixing the oil-cooler O-rings and seal. If it were me and I didn't know how long the oil-coolant mixing had been going on, I'd replace the rod bearings as a precautionary measure.
Just my hard earned 2cents
I had a pinched O-ring on my oil cooler that I didn't know about and really didn't see anything on the dipstick either (there was some dark stuff in the overflow tank I didn't notice either, because I was using the dark blue Audi coolant). Sometime after that oil-cooler seal job by that dumba$$ mechanic, I noticed a strange vibration I could feel thru the floorboard at a certain RPM only. Tried several things to find the source but eventually I HEARD a strange noise at the same rpm. Put the car in my garage and started going thru everthing. To make a long post shorter, I had trashed rod bearings (yes, all 4 sets).
Some will debate that because the oil pressure is much greater that the coolant pressure, you'll never get coolant into the oil (That's what the shop guy told me
). BUT that ignores the fact that when you shut the engine off, oil pressure drops to zero but the coolant pressure in a hot engine could be 25 psi or greater, depending on what pressure the coolant cap is rated for.PLEASE learn from my bad experience. DON'T drive the car before fixing the oil-cooler O-rings and seal. If it were me and I didn't know how long the oil-coolant mixing had been going on, I'd replace the rod bearings as a precautionary measure.
Just my hard earned 2cents
08-08-2008, 02:23 AM
#29
Viperns,
The rod bearings are just standard type bearing material I think. I'm no expert, But it looked like the base metal (steel) was coated with a copper alloy and then coated with some kind of softer gray/silver alloy. I think I remember this referred to as Bi-metal bearings ?
I think I bought my replacement bearings at Paragon Parts (this was all about 6-7 years ago).
Yes the car still ran, but I was first feeling a strange vibration at a particular rpm range (Again, this was some time ago, but I believe I made notes as to the rpm. I'll try to find them in the next couple of days). I started looking for loose sheet metal shields and other such dead-ends. Finally, I remember coming off an exit ramp and I heard the vibration. I knew that whatever it was, it was getting worse. Thats when I parked it.
Keep in mind that this was in my early 944S ownership days, where I was trusting a shop to do my repairs and maintenance. I had always heard that you practically needed to be factory trained to work on a Porsche.
When I finally figured out that the shop techs where I was going were dumber than I was, I bought
the factory shop manuals and started fixing everything myself. Actually I started by having to redo everything that the shop techs had touched (this is another long story).
When I finally pulled the oil pan and rod bearings, the bearings were down to the copper coating.
After doing the rod bearings, and while I had the exhaust off the car, thus better access, I pulled the oil cooler and found, finally, the cause of my problems. The pinched O-ring, which was causing coolant-oil mixing.
I hope you do not have anything close to the same troubles as I had, BUT if I were in your shoes,
I'd pull the oil cooler asap. Maybe send an oil sample for testing to see how much coolant (or bearing material) is in your oil.
Maybe you have lucked out and there is no coolant in your oil. If so, you should run, not walk, to buy a lottery ticket !!!
To those still reading, VERY sorry for the long post.
The rod bearings are just standard type bearing material I think. I'm no expert, But it looked like the base metal (steel) was coated with a copper alloy and then coated with some kind of softer gray/silver alloy. I think I remember this referred to as Bi-metal bearings ?
I think I bought my replacement bearings at Paragon Parts (this was all about 6-7 years ago).
Yes the car still ran, but I was first feeling a strange vibration at a particular rpm range (Again, this was some time ago, but I believe I made notes as to the rpm. I'll try to find them in the next couple of days). I started looking for loose sheet metal shields and other such dead-ends. Finally, I remember coming off an exit ramp and I heard the vibration. I knew that whatever it was, it was getting worse. Thats when I parked it.
Keep in mind that this was in my early 944S ownership days, where I was trusting a shop to do my repairs and maintenance. I had always heard that you practically needed to be factory trained to work on a Porsche.
When I finally figured out that the shop techs where I was going were dumber than I was, I bought
the factory shop manuals and started fixing everything myself. Actually I started by having to redo everything that the shop techs had touched (this is another long story).
When I finally pulled the oil pan and rod bearings, the bearings were down to the copper coating.
After doing the rod bearings, and while I had the exhaust off the car, thus better access, I pulled the oil cooler and found, finally, the cause of my problems. The pinched O-ring, which was causing coolant-oil mixing.
I hope you do not have anything close to the same troubles as I had, BUT if I were in your shoes,
I'd pull the oil cooler asap. Maybe send an oil sample for testing to see how much coolant (or bearing material) is in your oil.
Maybe you have lucked out and there is no coolant in your oil. If so, you should run, not walk, to buy a lottery ticket !!!
To those still reading, VERY sorry for the long post.
08-08-2008, 03:02 AM
#30
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
The visible difference between S and S2 heads/blocks: the water jacket. Look at the front driver's side corner of the head where it mates the block to see the shape of the water jacket. If it is flush with the front and it has one stud/nut then it's a 3.0.
