Need help with Reference Sensor Removal
Hey Man
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From: Nor Cal, Seal Rock, OR
Sorry but it goes into the block. The bad news is I can't see how you can get enough clearance in there with the engine in the car. If you can get the other bolt and sensor out you might be able remove the bracket and expose enough of the remaining bolt to get some heat and vise grips on it. That is one of the hardet placest to reach on the engine. I wish I had better news for you.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 184
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From: Monterey, CA
Sorry but it goes into the block. The bad news is I can't see how you can get enough clearance in there with the engine in the car. If you can get the other bolt and sensor out you might be able remove the bracket and expose enough of the remaining bolt to get some heat and vise grips on it. That is one of the hardet placest to reach on the engine. I wish I had better news for you.
. Just tossing ideas out there. May the force be with you.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Rochester, MN
I really don't want to pull an entire engine to fix this...
Anyone besides kandyman think I have half a chance if I try to cut the bracket with a dremel too, leaving a slot in the middle of the bolt that I could get a driver into and maybe twist it out? Or should I just bust it off, trying to leave enough of the bolt to center the bracket like a pin with the threads ground down, and then use the other bolt to secure it?
Eventually the engine will come out, but I'd like to drive it in the mean time.
Anyone besides kandyman think I have half a chance if I try to cut the bracket with a dremel too, leaving a slot in the middle of the bolt that I could get a driver into and maybe twist it out? Or should I just bust it off, trying to leave enough of the bolt to center the bracket like a pin with the threads ground down, and then use the other bolt to secure it?
Eventually the engine will come out, but I'd like to drive it in the mean time.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 184
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From: Monterey, CA
Actually if you could dremel a slot in the bolt for a flat head bit/socket you can get to it from under the car with 1 or 2 long extensions and swivel joint. I would try that before any cutting or breaking.
Hey Man
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From: Nor Cal, Seal Rock, OR
I think you might find that if you cut a crude slot with a Dremel that it will be much, much weaker than the bolt head that got broken off in the first place. If a socket couldn't get it off before I doubt a flat bit would either. Again if you can get the other sensor off you can remove the bracket and hopefully have enough stud left to grip with a bolt extractor or vise grips. PB Blaster and some localized heat would really help. Trying to cut the bracket off might just lead to other issues and then you committed to still getting the broken bolt out and buying another bracket. I removed the bracket with the engine in the car on my first clutch job and it wasn't that hard. There is a guide tube in the block on the lock bolt that requires you separate the bracket straight back from the block about 5/8" before it is free. Hope this helps.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Rochester, MN
What about a whole different approach... drilling out the bad reference sensor, and leaving the bracket in place (Until I do my next engine/clutch job)? Is it possible to gut the sensor enough to get it through the bracket hole even if it's mushroomed on the end? Can I pull the guts out of the aluminum casing, and then collapse it and get it through? Presumably, the bracket is being held in the right place by the broken bolt... If I can get the old sensor out that way, maybe I'm good enough for now?
Hey Man
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 16,545
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From: Nor Cal, Seal Rock, OR
What about a whole different approach... drilling out the bad reference sensor, and leaving the bracket in place (Until I do my next engine/clutch job)? Is it possible to gut the sensor enough to get it through the bracket hole even if it's mushroomed on the end? Can I pull the guts out of the aluminum casing, and then collapse it and get it through? Presumably, the bracket is being held in the right place by the broken bolt... If I can get the old sensor out that way, maybe I'm good enough for now?
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Team Owner
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 26,394
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From: Ontario
Thats really a bad situation. In mine the sensor metal tube was frozen into the hole, even though the body turned. I was lucky and removed the sensor bracket. If you can't get that, then the only thing is to take the sensor out in chunks. I don't believe there is any other option.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 152
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From: Rochester, MN
Update!
I was looking at a diagram, over at DCAutomotive, figuring I would end up destroying the bracket and needing a new one, and I realized that the bolt that broke was the one that the bracket pivoted on ... different than the late model one that was posted above.
Given that, I figured it should slide off the bolt since it couldn't be threaded through the bracket and turn. Sure enough, with a careful wedging and tapping with a hammer, it does slide to the rear. Unfortunately, after about 3 of 4 mm of sliding, the reference sensors themsevles get caught on the bellhousing holes that they stick into... so I've made progress... I think this is the right way to approach it... but I am temporarily stuck again. I'll contemplate whether I just use brute force, bend the reference sensors, and replace them, or come up with some other approach.
Given that, I figured it should slide off the bolt since it couldn't be threaded through the bracket and turn. Sure enough, with a careful wedging and tapping with a hammer, it does slide to the rear. Unfortunately, after about 3 of 4 mm of sliding, the reference sensors themsevles get caught on the bellhousing holes that they stick into... so I've made progress... I think this is the right way to approach it... but I am temporarily stuck again. I'll contemplate whether I just use brute force, bend the reference sensors, and replace them, or come up with some other approach.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 184
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From: Monterey, CA
I don't think attempting to bend the sensors is the proper way to go at it. Just focus on removing the sensors right now. They may be super stuck, but they are still possible to remove. Just get creative. Then worry about the bracket next.
Thread Starter
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2006
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From: Rochester, MN
No luck removing them... that's why we moved on to removing the brackets. The first one is toasted... It's destroyed from trying to get it out... and we think the bottom is mushroomed which is making it impossible to remove.
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 184
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From: Monterey, CA
You're just not trying hard enough. IIRC Campeck hooked up an eyehook to the sensors and attatched it to an engine hoist. The head on mine was mushroomed, but with enough force it simply tore the metal casing from the sensor and allowed me to pull it out and have enough room to work.
