O2 sensor cost & replacement
Intermediate
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: South Carolina
I apologize for the late reply but my computer locked up before I finished. This is what I know.
The 13913 is an adequate sensor however it does not include the universal connector kit as discussed before. The released universal sensor that will work for the 944 Turbo and 968 is the 15725(I will have to check the other vehicles tomorrow). This sensor has the correct heater, ceramic, and protection tube and should be cheaper than the 13913 because you are not paying for the Ford connector.
This sensor has been cross referenced and a similar part(different number)is sold in Europe. But because the volumes in the US are low this universal has not been cross referenced in the states and therefore only the OE is available. I am not sure what cross referencing scheme some aftermarket suppliers are using in supplying the "fits all" three wire. In this case the part seems to be ok.
But again ask your autoparts store for the 15725(part# 0258005725) and I will inform the list of the other makes and models this sensor will fit.
Remember that Bosch does not monitor all vendor sales and when looking in my aftermarket sensor book there are no universals listed for Porsche in the US, therefore I do not know where the aftermarket vendors are getting their info.
If anybody knows let me know(I dont work in sales).
The 13913 is an adequate sensor however it does not include the universal connector kit as discussed before. The released universal sensor that will work for the 944 Turbo and 968 is the 15725(I will have to check the other vehicles tomorrow). This sensor has the correct heater, ceramic, and protection tube and should be cheaper than the 13913 because you are not paying for the Ford connector.
This sensor has been cross referenced and a similar part(different number)is sold in Europe. But because the volumes in the US are low this universal has not been cross referenced in the states and therefore only the OE is available. I am not sure what cross referencing scheme some aftermarket suppliers are using in supplying the "fits all" three wire. In this case the part seems to be ok.
But again ask your autoparts store for the 15725(part# 0258005725) and I will inform the list of the other makes and models this sensor will fit.
Remember that Bosch does not monitor all vendor sales and when looking in my aftermarket sensor book there are no universals listed for Porsche in the US, therefore I do not know where the aftermarket vendors are getting their info.
If anybody knows let me know(I dont work in sales).
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,910
Likes: 3
Sorry to jump in late here, this looks like an interesting topic.
Anyway, maybe Zucker can explain what the deal is with the 4 wire sensor and whether it makes a difference or not, especially when using an AFR meter. Also, if it does, what are the various part numbers.
Thanks
Anyway, maybe Zucker can explain what the deal is with the 4 wire sensor and whether it makes a difference or not, especially when using an AFR meter. Also, if it does, what are the various part numbers.
Thanks
Instructor
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 142
Likes: 0
From: Cincinnati, OH
I don't know if this will help anyone or not, but on the Audi list I belong to, I was told that the VW dealers have 4 wire sensors very cheaply right now. They are selling for just a shade over $20. They are universal 4 wire ones. Don't know if it is a sale, or the new price.
HTH!
Greg Roa
83' 944
86' 4kcsq
93' 90 CS
HTH!
Greg Roa
83' 944
86' 4kcsq
93' 90 CS
Intermediate
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: South Carolina
Ok here it is for all of the 944/968 people.
The 15725 will fit all 944/968(including turbo) 85-95. You pre-85 1/2 people may want to look and make sure that the sensor is a one or three wire. If its a 3 wire use the above if its a 1 wire then use the 11027 as this is the universal one wire. The part number mentioned earlier(somebody else in an earlier post) is discontinued and I am unsure what ceramic it has.
OK as far as the three wire four wire thing goes here it is.
The four wire parts come in two different varieties...case grounded and isolated ground.
The case ground acts like the three wire where the outer electrode of the sensor is grounded through the sensor housing, however in the case of the four wire case ground the sensor has an additional ground that is wired directly to the ECU(reduces noise in SOME cases). Putting a 4 wire CASE ground sensor in place of a 3 wire has NO added benefit. In fact since the fourth wire has no were to go and also if the owner grounds it near the ECU or on the vehicle this could introduce water into the sensor because the sensor restores the reference air through the wire harness(see my earlier post)and having this non-sealed ground could contaminate the reference air.
Using a four wire isolated ground(outer electrode has an isolated ground running from the electrode to the ECU)on a three wire application simply wont work because the sensor circuit is open because the sensor is not grounded.
Its best to use what originally came with the car.
Hope this helps!!
The 15725 will fit all 944/968(including turbo) 85-95. You pre-85 1/2 people may want to look and make sure that the sensor is a one or three wire. If its a 3 wire use the above if its a 1 wire then use the 11027 as this is the universal one wire. The part number mentioned earlier(somebody else in an earlier post) is discontinued and I am unsure what ceramic it has.
OK as far as the three wire four wire thing goes here it is.
The four wire parts come in two different varieties...case grounded and isolated ground.
The case ground acts like the three wire where the outer electrode of the sensor is grounded through the sensor housing, however in the case of the four wire case ground the sensor has an additional ground that is wired directly to the ECU(reduces noise in SOME cases). Putting a 4 wire CASE ground sensor in place of a 3 wire has NO added benefit. In fact since the fourth wire has no were to go and also if the owner grounds it near the ECU or on the vehicle this could introduce water into the sensor because the sensor restores the reference air through the wire harness(see my earlier post)and having this non-sealed ground could contaminate the reference air.
Using a four wire isolated ground(outer electrode has an isolated ground running from the electrode to the ECU)on a three wire application simply wont work because the sensor circuit is open because the sensor is not grounded.
Its best to use what originally came with the car.
Hope this helps!!
Thread Starter
Advanced
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
From: Paramus, NJ
Zucker,
I never thought that my original post would attract so much attention. Thanks a lot for all your help. Last questions. Is the 944 Turbo original equipment O2 sensor Bosch P/N 13012, and is the universal Bosch P/N 15725. Any idea approximately how much these should cost?
Thanks again for all the assistance.
Steve '86 944 Turbo
I never thought that my original post would attract so much attention. Thanks a lot for all your help. Last questions. Is the 944 Turbo original equipment O2 sensor Bosch P/N 13012, and is the universal Bosch P/N 15725. Any idea approximately how much these should cost?
Thanks again for all the assistance.
Steve '86 944 Turbo
Intermediate
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 33
Likes: 0
From: South Carolina
Yes the 13012 is the original Porsche sensor for the 944 turbo. The 15725 is a direct replacment for the sensor as it has the same ceramic, heater, and protection tube. In fact the 15725 is of laser welded construction and the original part is crimped. The original Part I have seen in excess of 180 bucks but I called NAPA about the 15725 and they have it for 60.
The three wire discussed earlier(I believe it was a 13913..see earlier post) is ok for the 85-95 944/968 series vehicles but it does not include the universal connector kit which has been designed to keep the breathability of the sensor when mating the old and new wire harnesses.
The three wire discussed earlier(I believe it was a 13913..see earlier post) is ok for the 85-95 944/968 series vehicles but it does not include the universal connector kit which has been designed to keep the breathability of the sensor when mating the old and new wire harnesses.