Track day: 944 whooping on a C5 Z06 (pics)
11-03-2006, 06:22 PM
#17
Rennlist Member
Yeah, I can't understand why he was upset. His $50k car taken out by a POS 944 that might be worth $5k in a good year. That's equivalent to you being taken out by a Yugo. I'm sure you would have walked up the Yugo driver afterward and patted him on his back and said, "great drive!". <-- Note: extreme sarcasm
But like one guy said, that's racing, and that's what can happen. I know a guy who had an oil line go on a 911 on the track and it took out a couple guys behind him. He wasn't on everybody's favorite list after that.
____________________________________
1986 944 NA - Guards Red - 91k miles - minty
1983 944 NA - Platinum metallic - 5000 mi beginning a new life
1985.1 944 NA - Guards Red - donor car
1984 911 Carrera Coupe - Guards Red (gone, but not forgotten)
"If you're not living on the edge, you're not living"
But like one guy said, that's racing, and that's what can happen. I know a guy who had an oil line go on a 911 on the track and it took out a couple guys behind him. He wasn't on everybody's favorite list after that.
____________________________________
1986 944 NA - Guards Red - 91k miles - minty
1983 944 NA - Platinum metallic - 5000 mi beginning a new life
1985.1 944 NA - Guards Red - donor car
1984 911 Carrera Coupe - Guards Red (gone, but not forgotten)
"If you're not living on the edge, you're not living"
11-03-2006, 06:39 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Chicago
Posts: 696
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Couple of things to add here:
I tell all of my students to look at their car one last time. 'Cause stuff happens, and it may not look like that when we get back. You have to understand that at a race track.
I have had MANY people who are within their first 5 or 6 events in a 996, 997, or GT3 come up behind me way too fast, and get way too close in non-passing zones and stay there. I always wave people by (I have had probably more practice waving people buy than an entire region combined -914,944
) and wait till after the session to have a chat. "That's a really nice $80k car 'ya got there, I paid $2000 for mine. It's gonna be a real shame when your too close again and it breaks and takes you out"
Lastly, at the first event I ran this year, a ZO6 blew it's engine and took out a GT3. So, all is well in the Universe.
I tell all of my students to look at their car one last time. 'Cause stuff happens, and it may not look like that when we get back. You have to understand that at a race track.
I have had MANY people who are within their first 5 or 6 events in a 996, 997, or GT3 come up behind me way too fast, and get way too close in non-passing zones and stay there. I always wave people by (I have had probably more practice waving people buy than an entire region combined -914,944
) and wait till after the session to have a chat. "That's a really nice $80k car 'ya got there, I paid $2000 for mine. It's gonna be a real shame when your too close again and it breaks and takes you out"Lastly, at the first event I ran this year, a ZO6 blew it's engine and took out a GT3. So, all is well in the Universe.
11-03-2006, 08:50 PM
#19
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: San Francisco, CA Porsche: '92 968 Blk/Cashmere
Posts: 1,699
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Eyal 951
Not many people DE on R comp's.
11-03-2006, 10:42 PM
#20
Pro
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Lovettsville, VA
Posts: 726
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by chris luckett
Most people in norcal I see that are not in beginner groups are runnning DOT Rs. Street tires overheat too quickly and get "greasy" when driven hard. Not to mention the annoying squeel.
11-04-2006, 12:57 AM
#21
Race Director
The Audi club is the ONLY group that restricts use of R-tires in a DE type environment.
Personally I'd rather see beginners on street tires since it is easier to learn, but I am strongly against and rule does not allow a beginner to run R-tires. There are many reasons why beginners may have R-tires. Just one is sharing a car with an advanced driver.
With respect to the C5 944 incident. 944 lost the engine. crap happens. Z06 lost it and crunched the car. crap happens. It is NOT the 944 driver's fault. Oil on the track are hazards we must all deal with. It is sad to see a car wadded up, but you can't blame the 944 driver. He did not go out there planning to blow the engine.
Once back 4 years ago my 944 motor popped and dumped oil in a 90 mph turn surrounded by walls. I got luck as when it popped I spun on my oil and missed all the surrouding walls. A very nice M3 BMW slide in the oil and tagged a wall. Not really bad damage, but it still needed repair. We were in the race goup and crap happens. I was not responsible for the BMW's damage.
I have also been on the other side. Last event a former Speed GT BMW blew something and layed down oil in the same corner. I saw the oil and prepared for it, but my competitior 5 car lenghts in from never saw the smoke clould. By the time he got there the scene appeard clear. He hit the oil going flat out exiting a corner 100 mph. Car did a 1/2 spin and he nearly hit the outside wall at what would have been 90 mph. He saved it and got lucky. I when through the same oil and my car moved a bit, but was fine. Now if he had hit the wall it would have been nasty, but there would be no reason to blame the BMW or BMW driver. Crap happens you need to deal with it.
Personally I'd rather see beginners on street tires since it is easier to learn, but I am strongly against and rule does not allow a beginner to run R-tires. There are many reasons why beginners may have R-tires. Just one is sharing a car with an advanced driver.
With respect to the C5 944 incident. 944 lost the engine. crap happens. Z06 lost it and crunched the car. crap happens. It is NOT the 944 driver's fault. Oil on the track are hazards we must all deal with. It is sad to see a car wadded up, but you can't blame the 944 driver. He did not go out there planning to blow the engine.
Once back 4 years ago my 944 motor popped and dumped oil in a 90 mph turn surrounded by walls. I got luck as when it popped I spun on my oil and missed all the surrouding walls. A very nice M3 BMW slide in the oil and tagged a wall. Not really bad damage, but it still needed repair. We were in the race goup and crap happens. I was not responsible for the BMW's damage.
I have also been on the other side. Last event a former Speed GT BMW blew something and layed down oil in the same corner. I saw the oil and prepared for it, but my competitior 5 car lenghts in from never saw the smoke clould. By the time he got there the scene appeard clear. He hit the oil going flat out exiting a corner 100 mph. Car did a 1/2 spin and he nearly hit the outside wall at what would have been 90 mph. He saved it and got lucky. I when through the same oil and my car moved a bit, but was fine. Now if he had hit the wall it would have been nasty, but there would be no reason to blame the BMW or BMW driver. Crap happens you need to deal with it.
11-04-2006, 04:41 AM
#22
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I'll try to answer some of the questions/comments.
Yeah, I can completely understand the vette driver being pissed off about it (I sure as hell would be). Just when I talked to him afterwards he had a negative tone towards the 944, to the extent that the accident was done on purpose. Vette owner flipped off Tim (944 owner) when the Vette was being unloaded from the tow-truck, started bitching about how "a set of tires costs more for my car than that f***ing piece of sh*t", he claimed he was debating going over and beating the **** out of the 944, etc. Also then started to talk about how he wasn't going to fix the car at all, just sell it as is and buy a new one, so I figure he had the whole rich-snob mentality going on. I mean it makes sense to be pissed that your car is wrecked, but its an accident, its not like the guy in front of you purposely blew his motor.
No tire restrictions for the run groups - my instructor had a race-prepped cayman runing slicks (I unfortunatly didn't get a ride in it because the power steering pump blew in the pits so he left early), and many of the other cars were running slick-type tires.
Turn 4 is the right hander after passing under the tire bridge, bleachers are on the left side. The left turn going uphil is turn 5.
I'm being lazy with the videos juan - it takes a hell of a long time for the computer to get the video and then compress it, but since you complained I'll work on it after work today.
Now to make everyone happy I'll put up some more pics, the cayman my istructor had, the two ariel atoms that were there (that were surprisingly slow), and the carrera gt that was there. I'll work on getting the video of that up now - hearing that thing racing was so freaking awesome!!! :drool:
*edit* SOB, because the retarded camera was in the wrong function all the pictures are so overexposed they're all crap. I'm about ready to boot-kick this freaking camera. I'll start working on the video of the carrera gt.
Yeah, I can completely understand the vette driver being pissed off about it (I sure as hell would be). Just when I talked to him afterwards he had a negative tone towards the 944, to the extent that the accident was done on purpose. Vette owner flipped off Tim (944 owner) when the Vette was being unloaded from the tow-truck, started bitching about how "a set of tires costs more for my car than that f***ing piece of sh*t", he claimed he was debating going over and beating the **** out of the 944, etc. Also then started to talk about how he wasn't going to fix the car at all, just sell it as is and buy a new one, so I figure he had the whole rich-snob mentality going on. I mean it makes sense to be pissed that your car is wrecked, but its an accident, its not like the guy in front of you purposely blew his motor.
No tire restrictions for the run groups - my instructor had a race-prepped cayman runing slicks (I unfortunatly didn't get a ride in it because the power steering pump blew in the pits so he left early), and many of the other cars were running slick-type tires.
Turn 4 is the right hander after passing under the tire bridge, bleachers are on the left side. The left turn going uphil is turn 5.
I'm being lazy with the videos juan - it takes a hell of a long time for the computer to get the video and then compress it, but since you complained I'll work on it after work today.
Now to make everyone happy I'll put up some more pics, the cayman my istructor had, the two ariel atoms that were there (that were surprisingly slow), and the carrera gt that was there. I'll work on getting the video of that up now - hearing that thing racing was so freaking awesome!!! :drool:
*edit* SOB, because the retarded camera was in the wrong function all the pictures are so overexposed they're all crap. I'm about ready to boot-kick this freaking camera. I'll start working on the video of the carrera gt.
11-04-2006, 06:28 AM
#23
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Here's a short video of the carrera gt and areil atoms.
Do me a favor and rt-click save as.
http://billthe3.net/videos/cgt_atoms_lagunaseca.wmv
Do me a favor and rt-click save as.
http://billthe3.net/videos/cgt_atoms_lagunaseca.wmv
11-04-2006, 09:35 AM
#24
Administrator - "Tyson"
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Originally Posted by Dr.Porsche
Insurance companies like to use pics from forums to demonstrate why the activity should not be covered by a policy.
Page 5 - post #68
For the longest time State Farm was the company to go with for DE's. Not anymore - looking over this thread, there are not many (if any) normal auto policies that will cover anything on a track. Even if you are on a parade lap during lunch time touring.
11-04-2006, 01:01 PM
#25
Race Car
Having your car take out by a yugo is an understatement. Imagine the nicest 968 cab you modified into a turbo RS (probably still cost you less than a z06) you take to the track and someone in front of you with a VW rabbit (costs about the same as a 944 n/a) blows an engine (probably not well taken care of and with an inherent #2 rod bearing problem built into the car) so you wipe out totaling your car. The car costs you $40k+ (my estimate) to repair and YOU have to come out of pocket to repair it (most of the 944 owners I imagine don't even have $4k consistently in their bank accounts like the rest of the people in the country). I think thats enough to make the nicest person an A$$hole momentarily.
On a track, $hit happens. Its the nature of the game but expect the guy to get pissed.
On a track, $hit happens. Its the nature of the game but expect the guy to get pissed.
11-04-2006, 02:35 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by Dr.Porsche
. . . . . Lastly, at the first event I ran this year, a ZO6 blew it's engine and took out a GT3. So, all is well in the Universe.
11-04-2006, 02:54 PM
#27
Herr Unmöglich
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by Legoland951
The car costs you $40k+ (my estimate) to repair and YOU have to come out of pocket to repair it (most of the 944 owners I imagine don't even have $4k consistently in their bank accounts like the rest of the people in the country).
My track car cost less than 2% of my annual salary for initial purchase, and I could buy many more with what's in the bank... sure I'd be pissed if I wiped out half of my gross pay for the year, but then maybe it would be my own fault for taking something so valuable out there and not being prepared to leave it there. But that gives no right to be pissed at or to threaten the other guy... if it was an accident as I said. Besides, he's got a blown motor too! He was just smart enough to buy a car that he can replace the motor for the cost of the Z06's tires
Just cause I drive a 944 and someone else drives something more valuable, does not mean jack about ***** size or bank account. Thanks for perpetuating stereotypes. Add you even own a 944... just cause it's a turbo doesn't mean anyone will think any differently about you.
11-04-2006, 02:58 PM
#28
Under the Radar
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 5,869
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Legoland951
(most of the 944 owners I imagine don't even have $4k consistently in their bank accounts like the rest of the people in the country)
11-04-2006, 05:37 PM
#29
Race Car
Eric, I hope you will be as gracious as you expect the other guy to be when your car gets wadded up at the track for any reason. My point is, anyone would be pissed off for a while even if he is making 500k a year. I know a few $100 mil+ net worth individuals and I can tell you they get pissed off just like anyone else. One of those $100 mil+ individuals I know doesn't even own a car and uses public transportation at over 80 years old. Having a lot of money doesn't make you any less human or appreciate value of money any less, maybe only the stupid ones who probably made their money in a short amount of time like winning the lottery. It doesn't matter what percent of their income the car costs. Expecting them not to get pissed off when $hit happens is just rediculous in my opinion even though $hit happens every day.
As far as debt is concerned, every person in this country owes over $28,651.25 already in the form of a national debt http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/. The unlimited power of taxation will ensure we pay the interest until this country is bankrupt or we pay it off. Forget about the measly $8k average credit debt of an average card holder who owes money. Now the CC companies can and will raise interest rates up to 32 percent for pretty much any reason (like someone running your credit report and your credit score drops down... YES THEY CAN DO IT and its been done).
BTW, the bankruptcy laws changed very recently where credit card debt stays with you just like tax liens even if you declare bankruptcy.
As far as debt is concerned, every person in this country owes over $28,651.25 already in the form of a national debt http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/. The unlimited power of taxation will ensure we pay the interest until this country is bankrupt or we pay it off. Forget about the measly $8k average credit debt of an average card holder who owes money. Now the CC companies can and will raise interest rates up to 32 percent for pretty much any reason (like someone running your credit report and your credit score drops down... YES THEY CAN DO IT and its been done).
BTW, the bankruptcy laws changed very recently where credit card debt stays with you just like tax liens even if you declare bankruptcy.
11-05-2006, 09:51 PM
#30
Three Wheelin'
**** happens. BUT, I think to come out and post on a worldwide website an almost bragging thread that you "whooped" on a Vette and post photos of a busted up car just isn't cool. But, it sounds like he wasn't being a good sport about it either.
I just got back from the track where real "whoopings" are handed out with both cars coming back in one piece.
I just got back from the track where real "whoopings" are handed out with both cars coming back in one piece.
Last edited by VaSteve; 11-05-2006 at 10:10 PM.