Driving a manual, advice needed
06-14-2006, 08:41 AM
#16
Drifting
Originally Posted by theedge
IIRC you have legal recourse. If you roll into him because hes 2 inches off your bumper, you do the claim and he looses since he was an unsafe distance from your car.
The other way to deal with this is let off the brakes a tad and roll, then stop as that person is approching you. If that person is paying any sort of attention, the should clue in not to try to suck your exhaust pipe.
At the end of the day, the best defence is a good offence. Master hill starts and youll roll back a minimum. Once youre good at driving manual, it can almost seem like an automatic to other drivers, and you can do it without thinking and while talking to passengers, laughing at the radio, etc.
Practice makes perfect for that.
The other way to deal with this is let off the brakes a tad and roll, then stop as that person is approching you. If that person is paying any sort of attention, the should clue in not to try to suck your exhaust pipe.
At the end of the day, the best defence is a good offence. Master hill starts and youll roll back a minimum. Once youre good at driving manual, it can almost seem like an automatic to other drivers, and you can do it without thinking and while talking to passengers, laughing at the radio, etc.
Practice makes perfect for that.
06-14-2006, 08:42 AM
#17
Campeck Rulez
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Originally Posted by Techno Duck
A trick i find better than the e-brake method (Which in my opinion is to confusing) is to hold the brake down and slowly let the clutch till you hit the friction point..you know your at this point because the car will start to shudder and revs will drop, at that moment quickly release the brake and goto the gas. Then engage the clutch as usual. I dont like the e-brake method personally because its making me 'think' to much and its a rather slow method i think.
i was just about to say that. all my freinds that drive my car, the first thing i tell them (over and over) is that the clutch is not a switch. it has hundreds of different pressure spots and whatnot. second thing is that trick right there. ^
06-14-2006, 08:49 AM
#18
Campeck Rulez
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oh and by the way. you may think someone is really close behind you and tailgating the crap outa you. but i laugh everytime i see a new manual driver start driving around. i swear they get SUPER paranoid of ppl behind them. I did the same thing and my dad would always say, dont pay attention to him. and ill be like HE WONT GET OFF MY ***. when he was really like 10ft behind me at a stop sign. lol good luck.
06-14-2006, 09:20 AM
#19
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Hey, I hope this will help you on hills the same way it helped me.
We all know everyone does rolling stops, and I think out of lazyness, when I drive a standard car I do more of them.
The first time I went out in my bosses old Chevy truck, he taught me how to hold his truck on a hill by never coming to a stop at all. He said, when you're almost done braking, let out the clutch and give it some gas, and get a feel for the grip point that way. Within a month I was confident enough to try it coming to a full stop and then taking off.
Good luck, you'll get the hang of it. Keep us posted and of course don't be afraid to ask questions!
We all know everyone does rolling stops, and I think out of lazyness, when I drive a standard car I do more of them.
The first time I went out in my bosses old Chevy truck, he taught me how to hold his truck on a hill by never coming to a stop at all. He said, when you're almost done braking, let out the clutch and give it some gas, and get a feel for the grip point that way. Within a month I was confident enough to try it coming to a full stop and then taking off.
Good luck, you'll get the hang of it. Keep us posted and of course don't be afraid to ask questions!
06-14-2006, 01:54 PM
#20
Nordschleife Master
I used to do the roll back thing to let people know...well i roll back. Anyway im not sure if its a New York thing, or maybe just a Long Island thing.. but people tend to get even closer after i do that! I dont get it...
Now i just do it to annoy people... or maybe make them wonder "Oh no, hes going to hit me!!"
Now i just do it to annoy people... or maybe make them wonder "Oh no, hes going to hit me!!"
06-14-2006, 02:03 PM
#21
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Originally Posted by Geo
Sure fire way to learn to drive a standard:
From a stop on a flat surface (start with parking lots). Learn to rev the car th 3k rpm and hold it there. That will take a little practice at first, but not much. When you get that down, start coming off the clutch slowly. If you have held the throttle steady, you should be able to come off the clutch w/o stalling the car.
From a stop on a flat surface (start with parking lots). Learn to rev the car th 3k rpm and hold it there. That will take a little practice at first, but not much. When you get that down, start coming off the clutch slowly. If you have held the throttle steady, you should be able to come off the clutch w/o stalling the car.
Oh, and +1 on not depending on the e-brake. It was too much for me to process. Now I could do it for kicks, but adding that to the mix is too much to learn at once. Same with rev matching and double clutching.
06-14-2006, 02:08 PM
#22
Race Director
To be honest I found it easiest to just not think about it. Keep all movements of hte feet slow and consistent and you'll get it within a day. DON'T rev it up to 4K and slip the clutch slowly though.. I almost **** myself the first (and last) time I let my friend who has been "driving stick every day for the past year" drive my car did it.
944kid- is that you in a tank top
btw: 99% sure I'm picking up another N/A in the next day or 2. if your interested in my silver one it doesnt need a damn thing done to it
944kid- is that you in a tank top
btw: 99% sure I'm picking up another N/A in the next day or 2. if your interested in my silver one it doesnt need a damn thing done to it
06-14-2006, 02:18 PM
#23
A trick I've not seen listed here and that I've used to show my wife how to drive the 944 is to go into an empty parking lot;
1 - put it in 1st, then release the clutch very slowly so you get a feeling of where the friction is but do it without ever touching the gas pedal. Get the car in movement without giving gas at all, once the car is moving, stop and do it again.
2 - Go back to step 1 about 50 times
1 - put it in 1st, then release the clutch very slowly so you get a feeling of where the friction is but do it without ever touching the gas pedal. Get the car in movement without giving gas at all, once the car is moving, stop and do it again.
2 - Go back to step 1 about 50 times
06-14-2006, 02:24 PM
#24
Race Director
Pixel.
Lots of good advice here. Not much more I can add other than it took me alot of practice to get things right.
I learned on a 83 Plymouth reliant K. 4spd, no tach, cable clutch. Let me tell you that clutch was pain to feel out. I spend probably 30-40 hrs driving up and down a county road by our house. 2-3 hr at time just stop and starting over and over again. Took me a LONG time to get it right. I probably stalled the car 40-50 times. That was all before I got my license.
Once I got ok at staring from stop on level group I worked on inclines. That took me years to feel comfortable. Best thing for me was just repetition. Doing it over and over and over again.
Don't feel bad or get frustrated. It takes time and no mater how long it takes you can still turn into a solid driver. I have been driving for 16 years now and have become profecient at street clutch work and now even pretty good at stuff on the track. Heel&Toe is something I taught myself about 5 years ago. It took me time as well, but that was it. Time
Don't ever think that you "can't" or "won't ever be able". Stick with it and never settle for "sloppy". Even now I get pissed at my self if I have a sloppy heel & toe down shift on the street, I have not stalled the car in years, but any smooth gear shift still irritates me.
Lots of good advice here. Not much more I can add other than it took me alot of practice to get things right.
I learned on a 83 Plymouth reliant K. 4spd, no tach, cable clutch. Let me tell you that clutch was pain to feel out. I spend probably 30-40 hrs driving up and down a county road by our house. 2-3 hr at time just stop and starting over and over again. Took me a LONG time to get it right. I probably stalled the car 40-50 times. That was all before I got my license.
Once I got ok at staring from stop on level group I worked on inclines. That took me years to feel comfortable. Best thing for me was just repetition. Doing it over and over and over again.
Don't feel bad or get frustrated. It takes time and no mater how long it takes you can still turn into a solid driver. I have been driving for 16 years now and have become profecient at street clutch work and now even pretty good at stuff on the track. Heel&Toe is something I taught myself about 5 years ago. It took me time as well, but that was it. Time
Don't ever think that you "can't" or "won't ever be able". Stick with it and never settle for "sloppy". Even now I get pissed at my self if I have a sloppy heel & toe down shift on the street, I have not stalled the car in years, but any smooth gear shift still irritates me.
06-14-2006, 02:25 PM
#25
Mexican Ambassador
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best thing i learned was learning where it engages on a flat road, and playing with it, then taking it to an incline when no one was around (night, etc).
that was after my first day owning the car, lol.
the first day i had my 944, i brought it back from San Jose to Sacramento, i had literaly never driven manual until that day.
too bad my dad and i didnt calculate that by the time we got back to sacramento, it would be rush hour traffic.
boy THAT was fun!
not to mention the highway overpass (incline) that i had to go over in traffic.....
somehow i made it without backing into anyone.
there was lots of unnecessary clutch slipping......
looks like there's lots of good advice here.
holding the car steady on an incline with the clutch and the gas may look cool, but edge is right, it's going to put you in a world of hurt....
that was after my first day owning the car, lol.
the first day i had my 944, i brought it back from San Jose to Sacramento, i had literaly never driven manual until that day.
too bad my dad and i didnt calculate that by the time we got back to sacramento, it would be rush hour traffic.
boy THAT was fun!
not to mention the highway overpass (incline) that i had to go over in traffic.....
somehow i made it without backing into anyone.
there was lots of unnecessary clutch slipping......
looks like there's lots of good advice here.
holding the car steady on an incline with the clutch and the gas may look cool, but edge is right, it's going to put you in a world of hurt....
06-14-2006, 07:22 PM
#27
Cleveland Rocks
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All kinds of good advice for a beginner from the folks in here so far. 
About the only thing I see to add is a way to help you stay smooth while letting out........if you can, keep your heel on the floor. This will help on the "slowly and smoothly" thing. Instead of having your thigh muscle do the work (while your leg is suspended) of both lifting your leg and letting out the clutch, you can just rock your foot back and forth on your heel. Much smoother than a quivering thigh.
And I am a firm believer in the using as little throttle as possible method too.......I think it has served me well (see my signature about '86 N/A).
About the only thing I see to add is a way to help you stay smooth while letting out........if you can, keep your heel on the floor. This will help on the "slowly and smoothly" thing. Instead of having your thigh muscle do the work (while your leg is suspended) of both lifting your leg and letting out the clutch, you can just rock your foot back and forth on your heel. Much smoother than a quivering thigh.
And I am a firm believer in the using as little throttle as possible method too.......I think it has served me well (see my signature about '86 N/A).
06-14-2006, 07:53 PM
#28
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On hills in hairy intersections I always try to make a "pocket" which means either slowing incredibly with the car still in gear to try to get the guy to stop early behind me, or in extreme cases resort to the e-brake, once you are confident abandon the e-brake. Although it is bad on the clutch I will sometimes engage the clutch on the hill move forward and roll back once this usually signals to the driver behind me that either 1. this guy can't drive I better stay back or 2. Please give me a little room
I learned on a honda civic, I remember dding for a friend, he'd tell me when to depress the clutch and shifter for me, then I drove a toyota tacoma for 100k or so and driving stick becomes 2nd nature. I still think about the synergy of shifting, clutch depression and acceleration, learning where the 'friction point' is is key, then on a hill just give it a bit more gas and you should be on your way.
If all else fails you could resort to the terrible mudflaps with the looney tunes character, "Back off!" kidding of course! Good luck, you'll be shifting like a pro in no time...
I learned on a honda civic, I remember dding for a friend, he'd tell me when to depress the clutch and shifter for me, then I drove a toyota tacoma for 100k or so and driving stick becomes 2nd nature. I still think about the synergy of shifting, clutch depression and acceleration, learning where the 'friction point' is is key, then on a hill just give it a bit more gas and you should be on your way.
If all else fails you could resort to the terrible mudflaps with the looney tunes character, "Back off!" kidding of course! Good luck, you'll be shifting like a pro in no time...
06-14-2006, 08:46 PM
#29
A few years ago I let some one who had never driven a clutch play with my 951 to see what it was all about.
She made all the common mistakes (released the clutch too fast and stalled the engine, over-reved the engine, etc), but the final problem was she'd smoothly release the clutch without enough RPM and this would cause the car to buck. She tried to add more gas, but when the RPM gets too low that doesn't help. My final suggestion was to be smoother on the clutch and if the car starts to buck, add gas AND press the clutch a tad. She had not thought of re-pressing the clutch.
PS: Using the e-brake on an uphill is wimpy. I grew up in hilly Pittsburgh, and learned to never use the e-brake. Once you get the hang of using a clutch, you should be able to use both the gas and clutch and balance the car on an uphill.
She made all the common mistakes (released the clutch too fast and stalled the engine, over-reved the engine, etc), but the final problem was she'd smoothly release the clutch without enough RPM and this would cause the car to buck. She tried to add more gas, but when the RPM gets too low that doesn't help. My final suggestion was to be smoother on the clutch and if the car starts to buck, add gas AND press the clutch a tad. She had not thought of re-pressing the clutch.
PS: Using the e-brake on an uphill is wimpy. I grew up in hilly Pittsburgh, and learned to never use the e-brake. Once you get the hang of using a clutch, you should be able to use both the gas and clutch and balance the car on an uphill.
06-14-2006, 09:40 PM
#30
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i dont have the seat time that most of the guys on here have, im only 18, but i have only driven stick. The easiest way that i can put it, is that the start should be an equal transition, this meaning that if you let the clutch out a little give it a little gas, finesse will be the biggest problem at first. However it will be your necks best friend. As far as the hill thing goes, the e-brake works but i find that later on down the road when you learn to heel-toe, you can use this method on a hill if need be. What this means is that you keep the ball of your foot firmly on the brake and at the same time pivot your foot so that you are able to depress the throttle with either the side or heel of your foot, in conjunction with releasing the clutch. Practice will be the best thing to do, learn all about the characteristics of the car, rpm diffrences between gears and so forth will help you become a better driver.
Always have fun, if you get frustrated it will be tuff to be smooth.
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Always have fun, if you get frustrated it will be tuff to be smooth.
Post pictures of your porsche