my new dream project
#16
Captain Obvious
Super User
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Originally Posted by 944J
My friend has a dodge cummins truck that I looked at. It didn't seem any bigger than our 944 engines or the v8's that lots of people are puttingin their cars. But I do need to verify the size and weight. Keep in mind that this is a v6 engine and the 944 was originally designed to hold a v6. I'm also not interested in putting a 135HP engine in my car since it allready has one of those. I might put one of those vw tdi's into a vw van, but not a porsche.
Why would waste vegetable oil cost me a lot of money when the following is true?
1) a man who owns 4 McDonald's in Alabama now pays nothing for his fuel for his VW New Beetle
2) the same man has enough fuel (waste oil) to run 20-30 vehicles annually
3) McDonald's prepares more than 6.8 million pounds of french fries every day to meet customer demand around the world. (thats a lot of FREE FUEL)
4) McDonald's alone produces enough free fuel to power around 150,000 cars each year (http://www.licenseenews.com/news/news167.html)
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11809771/
"I throw away 10,000 gallons of grease every year from all my locations," Tomey said. "I have more than I can use."
Why would waste vegetable oil cost me a lot of money when the following is true?
1) a man who owns 4 McDonald's in Alabama now pays nothing for his fuel for his VW New Beetle
2) the same man has enough fuel (waste oil) to run 20-30 vehicles annually
3) McDonald's prepares more than 6.8 million pounds of french fries every day to meet customer demand around the world. (thats a lot of FREE FUEL)
4) McDonald's alone produces enough free fuel to power around 150,000 cars each year (http://www.licenseenews.com/news/news167.html)
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11809771/
"I throw away 10,000 gallons of grease every year from all my locations," Tomey said. "I have more than I can use."
I hate to break this to you, but McDonald's DOESN'T USE VEGITABLE OIL. They use vegitable shortening in their friers. A lot of the dielsel sites will tell you this and warn youto stay away form them. What you want is chineese food restaurans and such.
As I said before, go do more research before deciding what to do. Have you priced out the equipment and supplies needed to produce biodiesel? I have and once you add up all the costs and time that it takes to make the fuel every week, it became not worth it to me. Now it might worth you to do it, but it takes considerable amount of time, space and effort to keep you car filled up. Used VEGETABLE OIL needs to be filtered and processed to remove any trapped poisture and other contaminants. Also, if you live in a moderate climate the car needs to be converted to have a heater and an addition fuel tank for the vegetable oil.
Another thing to consider, a 135hp TDI is much much, much stonger than a gasoline powered 135hp engine, the difference is not the hp, but torque. Turbo Diesels make a lot more torque that a gasoline engine and this is why a TDi will have alot more power right off idle. As for the transmission, you might have to change it, casue Diesels don't like to rev. They make 90% of the torque just off idle (1900rpm).
As a comparison, I've raced (just to see how slow I was) a mid 90's Civic hatch and he was barely able to pull on me untill he reached top of 3rd gear. My car is 90hp and his at least 110hp. The Civic is alot lighter too, so now imagine if I had 50% more hp (135) and 50% more torque, the outcome would have been brutal for the Honda.
#17
Burning Brakes
You could have the distinction of the slowest 944 if you installed a 57 hp W123 type diesel 2.4 or 3.0 turbo diesel if you wanted slightly more power.
Momentum would be your driving style.
Ask me how I know this - I'm living the dream.
Momentum would be your driving style.
Ask me how I know this - I'm living the dream.
#18
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any diesel car can run vegetable oil. There are two approaches.
1. modify the vegetable oil via a process called 'transesterification' - basically, add methanol/ethanol and lye/potassium hydroxide. You can pour that straight into your tank.
2. add a second fuel system and a switchover. Then you can run 'SVO' - straight veggie oil.
check out www.greasecar.com
it's the revolution that isn't being televised, 'cause the oil companies will go into meltdown when it catches on. I almost bought an old Merc diesel wagon as my DD to do this with. then, one afternoon i parked behind a 968 and it was. . . all . . . over. . .
1. modify the vegetable oil via a process called 'transesterification' - basically, add methanol/ethanol and lye/potassium hydroxide. You can pour that straight into your tank.
2. add a second fuel system and a switchover. Then you can run 'SVO' - straight veggie oil.
check out www.greasecar.com
it's the revolution that isn't being televised, 'cause the oil companies will go into meltdown when it catches on. I almost bought an old Merc diesel wagon as my DD to do this with. then, one afternoon i parked behind a 968 and it was. . . all . . . over. . .
#19
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oh, and btw if you make your own biodiesel using transesterification, the cost savings are there but not huge. It's more of a granola thing.
If you go with door #2 and find a good waste source you can save some money. but it would take a lot to recoup your investment.
that being said when we're all complaining about super-premium at $3.50+ a gallon, you'll be laughing your *** off
If you go with door #2 and find a good waste source you can save some money. but it would take a lot to recoup your investment.
that being said when we're all complaining about super-premium at $3.50+ a gallon, you'll be laughing your *** off
#21
I'm not talking about biodeisel, talking about straight vegetable waste oil. It runs fine once filtered.
Originally Posted by ether_joe
oh, and btw if you make your own biodiesel using transesterification, the cost savings are there but not huge. It's more of a granola thing.
If you go with door #2 and find a good waste source you can save some money. but it would take a lot to recoup your investment.
that being said when we're all complaining about super-premium at $3.50+ a gallon, you'll be laughing your *** off
If you go with door #2 and find a good waste source you can save some money. but it would take a lot to recoup your investment.
that being said when we're all complaining about super-premium at $3.50+ a gallon, you'll be laughing your *** off
#22
you can also run a single stage (single tank) SVO (straigh vegetable oil if you have the right kind of glow plugs and/or modify your engine to have the right kind of glow plugs and pump. Then you can have the option of biodeisel, regular diesel, or SVO.
Originally Posted by ether_joe
any diesel car can run vegetable oil. There are two approaches.
1. modify the vegetable oil via a process called 'transesterification' - basically, add methanol/ethanol and lye/potassium hydroxide. You can pour that straight into your tank.
2. add a second fuel system and a switchover. Then you can run 'SVO' - straight veggie oil.
check out www.greasecar.com
it's the revolution that isn't being televised, 'cause the oil companies will go into meltdown when it catches on. I almost bought an old Merc diesel wagon as my DD to do this with. then, one afternoon i parked behind a 968 and it was. . . all . . . over. . .
1. modify the vegetable oil via a process called 'transesterification' - basically, add methanol/ethanol and lye/potassium hydroxide. You can pour that straight into your tank.
2. add a second fuel system and a switchover. Then you can run 'SVO' - straight veggie oil.
check out www.greasecar.com
it's the revolution that isn't being televised, 'cause the oil companies will go into meltdown when it catches on. I almost bought an old Merc diesel wagon as my DD to do this with. then, one afternoon i parked behind a 968 and it was. . . all . . . over. . .
#23
i believe the cummins motor in the dodge trucks is a straight 6, not a v6. they also make 4 cylinder diesel turbos.
for reference, i know someone that has a tdi in a corrado (similar weight to a 944) that is mostly stock. i played around with him on the highway with my gas turbo golf and he always pulled on me. its quite fun from what he says.
for reference, i know someone that has a tdi in a corrado (similar weight to a 944) that is mostly stock. i played around with him on the highway with my gas turbo golf and he always pulled on me. its quite fun from what he says.
#24
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Originally Posted by 944J
you can also run a single stage (single tank) SVO (straigh vegetable oil if you have the right kind of glow plugs and/or modify your engine to have the right kind of glow plugs and pump. Then you can have the option of biodeisel, regular diesel, or SVO.
also I would worry about starting the car in lower temperatures.
More power to you. Sounds like a good project. Tons of good resources out there by the way, incl the book 'From the Fryer to the Fuel Tank' by Tickell.
#25
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
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I dont think a MB engine would suit your needs, they typically don't and can't produce much power. And I would stay away from the Cummins engine, just because it's so damned heavy. In fact, aren't most good diesel engines completely cast iron (for strength), and thus heavy?
#26
Captain Obvious
Super User
Super User
Originally Posted by FRporscheman
I dont think a MB engine would suit your needs, they typically don't and can't produce much power. And I would stay away from the Cummins engine, just because it's so damned heavy. In fact, aren't most good diesel engines completely cast iron (for strength), and thus heavy?
I also remember that the Dodge Cummins are straight 6 not a V6.
As for the MB diesels, they only have one late model engine but they are almost not existent. The early ones are slow. A VW transplant is probably the only suitable engine at this time. The main problem with then is they are set up for FWD. To transform them to a RWD setup will cost a heck of a lot more than it's worth. All the accessories brackets need to be custom made and since it's a serpentine belt system it will cost a small fortune to fabricate a bracket that holds all the accessories in line. Then the issue of the hydraulic engine mounts. They also need to be somehow modified to fit into the 944. If you make the mounts solid like the OEM 944 are, you’ll get a ton of vibration. Now the TDI mounts let the engine move quiet a bit so hooking that the Porsche TT will be another huge problem. Maybe even impossible to do at a reasonable cost.
Some things are just not worth doing. If you really want a diesel, buy one that already is or at least transplant it into a FWD car.
#27
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Interesting TDi club thread on a TDi swap. Euro spec 2.5l TDi into an A4 Quattro:
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=131414
I'd forgotten about smog testing. That would be hell to sort out in some areas (like here.)
-J.
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=131414
I'd forgotten about smog testing. That would be hell to sort out in some areas (like here.)
-J.
#29
You could also run the diesel on propane, I saw a Toyota 4X4 pickup spank the living daylights out of a bunch of Mustang 5.0's about five years ago at the Wednesday nite drags at Sear's Point 1/4 mile track. The truck would smoke all four tires during burn outs and was running low 14's almost into the 13's, while the Mustangs were runing mid 14's. Noone could believe how fast that diesel truck was, its amazing how propane will wake a diesel motor!!
#30
Burning Brakes
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Sweet idea... I'm heading off in about an hour to pick up my recently purchased 97 Jetta TD. I put the deposit down 2 days before Sebring, so I was celebrating.
I really want to see this project develop.
I really want to see this project develop.