silverBean

All you need to do is throw one good 8 inch sub back there. It will have plenty of kick, and much more clarity and definition in the sound than a 12.

ehall

I have a set of door speaker panels in black, with the factory speakers still installed. I haven't installed them but would part with them for 80.00 plus shipping.

Techno Duck

ehall, thats very tempting but all money i have to sprare is going into paying the body shop to paint my headlight covers and new nose panel, also to straigten everything out when all is said and done. I will defenetley keep that in mind though, if you still have them in a few weeks maybe i will take you up on that offer if you still have them. Any idea how difficult it is to wire these in?

Robby

ehall- are you referring to just the black plastic frames w/the speakers, or, the whole door panel w/these intact? Also, are there two speakers in the plastic frames OR just one larger one? Many of the M490 systems had only one- the 5.25... this was not nearly as good- that 3.5 w/3-way X-over added a lot of SQ... Last, the wiring- there are two wires for each positive & negative... I've never understood this, but, there are many people on here who I'm sure could help w/that... should be quite simple... You can buy these plastic frames new for ~$40/ea- at least two years or so ago you could... the speakers w/them for $80, if in good shape, is a good deal... The door panels are REALLY expensive though... I have some Turbo S panels I would sell w/pockets.... for the mag-light, would it fit in the front part of the pocket IF that part were deeper, like the 968 ones? It's probably too thick for that part, but, just curious... there are so many options for this part of the car, it's not even funny, but, unfortunately, none of the options are really head & shoulders above the rest & I've never been able to hear anyone's car who has really strayed from the main-stream to find out how good it really was....

Robby

Hey Techno... did you ever decide what to do for the speakers? As for 4x6's all around, I would nix that idea... I mean, at least put 6.5's in the rear under the 1/4 windows... there's plenty of room there & you might not even have to cut metal... wooden adapter plates are easy to make- I can help you through it if you need... the biggest prob is getting to them, so, if you're planning to go through that trouble & replace them w/new speakers, at least go to something larger than new 4x6's there... up front, I would actually go to a 5.25 component before a 4x6... or a 4x6 plate w/seperate tweeter maybe...? depth is the obvious prob, but as long as you position it right- a tiny bit lower- you can use a spacer & make it work well... I'm toying w/the idea of getting 6.5's there- I REALLY want a 3-way component but most 6.5's I've seen in 3-ways are REALLY deep & I have 968 pockets- would have to lose them if I spaced more than 1/2".... oh well, I don't have $500 for speakers right now anyway so I guess I have time....

Techno Duck

With the autocross season coming up i have fought the urge to put any more audio stuff into my car. I need to focus on tires and also sorta recover from the new wheels i just bought. I already have the Infinity 4x6 plates under the 1/4 window and im pretty impressed with how well they sound. The 4x6 Blaupunkts in the front door defenetley leave something to be desired though.

I dont want to be ea hyprocrite anyway, i bust all my friends chops for putting these huge heavy subs into their trunks.. "Thats just dead weight man".

Robby

Yeah, I can understand the desire to run w/out subs... IMO, unless you really listen to certain types of music, you really don't need them anyway... I'm big on keeping things to a minimum & part of that is for weight reduction too. I've heard some great systems that had excellent bass w/just four 6.5's w/the fronts being components... I mean, good enough for me to ask if they actually had a small sub in the back- it just takes more effort w/some cars than others, especially if you're a picky SOB like me w/out money (also like me...).... I've also heard some good systems using plate speakers & smaller 5.25's & 4x6's, etc... you can definately get by- harder to do, but the 944 was not designed for perfect stereo... in all honesty, one of the best 944 systems I've heard was Ahmet's bone stock Turbo S system w/factory CD & EQ/amp...

Yabo

Robby , would you suggest 5x7 2 ways or a 6.5 inch subs for under the rear quarter windows? I am going to order soon and i can't decide. 50 watt rms is the power im allotted.

Robby

Devon- From what I've seen, it depends more on what you're trying to accomplish & what you're going to use up front to go w/them... Not to mention budget... Personally, I'd advise spending enough for good quality- that's a seriously relative call though- I'm in the $150 - $200 zone- you just want something good b/c you don't want to have to get back under that PITFA window to replace them a few months later b/c of poor SQ...

I want bass w/out subs, so I went w/5x7's- they're really inbetween 5x7 & 6x8- I've always called them 6x8's b/c I think they're closer to that size. They do have a lot more surface area than 6.5's- I had 6.5 Kappa coaxes back there first. Since the imaging in these cars leaves a bit to be desired, I went w/components in 6x8's- there are a lot of 5x7/6x8 components out there now, but when I did it, there were only two- Boston Accoustics & Infinity Reference 6800CS- I got the Infinty's.

Many will tell you not to worry about components in the rear, but the stock M490 set-up used a 6.5 component w/good results & it can help the imaging prob. That big hollow area makes a great enclosure, being metal & is great for bass. So I'd say to fill it up w/as much speaker as possible. I'm going to take some measurements soon b/c CDT just came out w/a 6x9 component for $200- it's much bigger than a 5x7/6x8 though, so I'm afraid it wont go- definately take some metal cutting- not afraid of that but it still might not go- my 6x8's went in at a slight angle w/no cutting... If the CDT's wont go, I'm going w/the new Infinity Kappa 6x8 components- Kappas are better than Reference so it will be a nice upgrade I think, & the Reference already sound great IMO... I've seen the Kappa 680.7cs on ebay for just under $140, although some places try to rip you on S&H... Either way, the specs are:

Power Handling, RMS: 90 Watts
Power Handling, Peak: 270 Watts
Sensitivity:94dB
Frequency Response:40Hz - 25kHz
Mounting Depth: 2 - 1/4"

I'm actually even considering Kappa components for up front too... I'm not positive though, partly b/c I'm still not sure what size I'm going with... 5.25 or 6.5... I REALLY REALLY want a 3-way component up front w/the largest being a 6.5 but most are too deep- Infinity's are usually shallower than most & they make the 1.7CS 3-way component, BUT, it's NOT available in the US & I'm having one hell of a time finding them

What speakers are you considering anyway? Oh yeah, one other thing- sealing them in well is important for several reasons. It's not hard at all, but you'll have to make an adapter plate- very simple & I'd be glad to help- I made templates out of poster board which I bought at Walmart for ~$3...

So, how's that for a novel...??? I guess the short answer to your question is... "I'd pick 5x7 / 6x8 components..."

Yabo

Here is what my system was, and here is what i plan.

Was:

Sony Xplod CD head unit 50x4 watt RMS (i know not great, but it came with one of my cars and is decent)
Front Doors were 4x6 boston acoustic plate speakers 40 watt RMS.. which sounded great, but the "plate" of the speakers was thick enough that the stock grills looked crappy on it.

Nothing under the quarter panels

Rear cubby's behind wheels... Boston RX-97 50 watt RMS 6x9 3 way speakers http://www.carreview.com/cat/car-aud...1_1805crx.aspx
These were also ran off the head unit.

SO i had those 4 speakers run off the head unit.


I changed my interior to a differnt color so in teh process i ran all the wiring to the back of teh car for an amp incase I ever wanted one.. might as well when you have the carpet out and it adds basically no weight to have wires under there...

Plan

I still have all the speaker areas with the trim out, so i might as well change my plan. I alreayd sold my front plate speakers as I had decided i want it to look stock up front.

Front New Plan:
Alpine 4x6 sp460a. I've heard these fit good, and my friend just got them so in his 944 so I can listen to test. I haven't yet but he said they sound good, and as I said people on rennlist have given good reviews. These will be run off the head unit.

Mid Plan:
Trying to decide between 5x7 2 or 3 ways, or 6.5 subs or component. Budget is about 100 dollars for the speakers. These will be run off the head unit so 50 RMS for each is what is available.

Rear Plan:
I am probably going to wait and see how the rest of teh setup sounds before I finalize the rear I think, maybe I won't even need it.. BUT The plan is:
Keeping my 6x9's in teh rear cubbys, run off a separate 50x2 amp (using my wiring for the rear amp).

I figure a 50x2 amp won't weigh too much, and i'll probably make the rear stuff quick disconnectable, for autox and such.


Music style is mix of mostly alternative/rock/punk with some rap and R&B here and there. I DO find bass important, and would like to get the most bass out of the sizes i have available for bass, but still keeping the front and mid in teh stock locations with out having aftermarket grills; and i want all 50 watt rms speakers, and still have good clarity, and able to turn it up. I find some speakers that have good bass don't sound very good if you turn them loud. (i know fading and bass controls help, but you know what i mean)



What do you think? I have to read over that last novel of a post and see what I get out of it.. but thats the plan.

Keep in mind.. I use ebay for all my speaker buying. I generally can get (i'm willing to wait and search for the deals) 30-50 percent off the retail price.. For instance, those sp460a's my friend just got at the Alpine dealer for 100 or a little over 100. I've been watching auctions on them and I can get them for around 50-60 shipped. When i bought them, those 6x9's were going for 150-200 at teh store, and I go tthem for 60 shipped (and yes they were new).

I'm also not too worried about having the newest models, I can go to a model that was put out last year or 2 years ago if it was a quality model and i can get it cheaper. I'm also not too much of a stickler about used or new, but most likely i will go for new.

So, anything up to about 250 retail i would consider. for the middle speakers, but preferrably around 150-200 retail


What do you think I should do, in your opinion?

Yabo

Also, I will just cut the metal to be able to attach teh speaker's screw holes to. I'm not worried about cutting the metal under the trim panels under the quarter windows, this car is not going to resale for anything anyway, and noone would know.

One thing is I guess I would consider just putting the 6x9's that I have in there, and doinig nothing in the rear, but checking by holding it up, it seemed like fitting the 6x9's in there is a little too much, and the trim panel (areas where the speaker dot holes arent there) would probably block some of the component speakers, and i don't want to modify it.

Scuba Steve

Looks like I'm getting into this a little late...

I have (Alpine) 6x9s installed in the hatch of my 924S. What I did to make them fit was first remove the backing behind the carpet above the side pockets. The (black) carpet folds under pretty well. Next I cut from plywood a couple of 'panels' that fit the original size of the board / foam backing. After cutting holes for the speakers in the plywood i upholstered them in black. Such a small amount of fabric ran under $5 and it's more or less the same material people cover speaker boxes in.

I have a 300W amp that powers all 4 speakers (nothing in stock rear location - they're blown and too hard to get at). Fronts are Alpine or Clarion 4x6s that came with the car and the head unit is a Nakamichi TD-700 that I bought off Rennist. All wiring is run under the carpet on the passanger side.

The setup is allright, but the 6 speaker system in the Toyota sounds nicer. Future plans are to go somewhere locally and have them make a box for the 6x9s similar to that in the P-car profile mentioned earlier, but I want the box to run to the sides of the hatch and (hopefully) be big enough to hide the amp in. Right now the amp is at the front of the hatch under some folded (clean) white rags. It actually looks ok and doesn't built up heat. I would also like the box to be big enough to hold a 8 inch sub in the middle because the 6x9s don't give the kind of bass I want. Maybe it's the size, the compartment made from the side pockets isn't sealed correctly, or the fact that the speakers are at the rear of the car pointed upward but I don't get the bass and clarity that the stereo in the Toyota has. Anyway if get a sub I'll probably have to get a second small amp to power it. I don't run the stereo very loud and have never had any heat or electrical problems of any kind so I think this will work out ok.

Robby

I've heard bad things about Sony Explode HU's but have heard several that have sounded really nice, so I don't really know... they're very inexpensive though, so I have nothing negative to say about them... Most BA's I've heard were pretty good speakers...

I have no prob w/going back a year or two for cheaper brand new speakers, but would be leary of buying used unless I heard them first. At any rate, if you up your budget to $150 for the mids, you can get the same Kappa 680.7CS 6x8 components. But, you will need to run them w/an amp. My suggestion would be to find a nice, smaller 4-ch amp w/~50w rms/ch... I'm looking into the Alpine V12's- there is one that is 75w/ch rms that is pretty damn small- I HAD an ADS 4-ch PQ10 that was very small for it's power rating, etc- very light, etc- it put out ~35w/ch rms- was MUCH stronger than my 22w/ch rms Kenwood deck- most of the Sony's are not quite that strong although they advertsie 50w/peak- this is not the # to be looking at though- RMS is a much better indicator. my Kenwood shows 47w/peak but I've heard several Sony's of several dif ratings & can't really tell one way or the other from a few watts of HU power. The amps are the way to go- I foight it for a year or two, BUT, remember, when you go to nicer aftermarket speakers, you are going to NEED MORE power to make it sound as loud- stock stuff & cheaper aftermarket speakers are lighter & give you the full range of sound w/much less power- I stuck severa l types of speakers in my car & ran from the HU & stock wasa MUCH better, louder, etc... but when I hooked that little ADS up to them, it was a completely dif story- not only that, but I bridged the amp to DBL that power for awhile to find amazing results w/hte Infinity's- that's ~70w/ch- this is whay I'm looking in the 70-80w/ch range for amps now, but it's tough to find one of that powoer rating, in 4-ch mode, that is small & lightweight & that's still important to me...

BTW- newer Infinity's have increased their sensitivity ratings- the 680.7CS is 94 or 95dB depending on where you look- this is very high & will help them sound good w/less power, but they still can handle 90w rms so they would need at least 50w rms to get them sounding good IMO... HU just wouldn't do it... Personally, I would skip the rear speakers, if you don't mind digging under the 1/4 window to replace those- considering that you can easily get 6x8's there- yes, I think 6x9 will be too big also, but again, I'm going to do some real measureing soon to find out... I really want those CDT's... But, the rear area is a little too far back for our cars for anything but real bass... Think about where the speakers are located in most hatchbacks- like my 89 Integra- they would be right at the top edge of the rear seat-backs- in our cars, they're another 1 - 1.5ft further back... And, they're lower... They're also more isolated if you have the seat backs still in the car...

For the front, I would recommend several things before I'd recommend 4x6's, but, don't take that the wrong way- I haven't heard any of these cars w/4x6 up front but have heard some people say they've gotten good sound from some- my first choice would probably be to get some shallow 6.5 components. would have to find a good place for the tweeter, but that shouldn't be tough. I'd put it where the Turbo S &/or 968 did- you can buy those tweeter grills from either model... 968 looks better IMO. My next choice would be to get a Turbo S plastic mounting frame & a set of 5.25 components & mount the 5.25 in the frame under the armrest on the door- you would also buy the Turbo S or 968 speaker grill to cover it- would lose the storage under the armrest, IF that's important to you- could also buy ome 968 door pockets to regain some of it by having deeper forward section map pockets... looks nicer too & would help cover the holes left by the 4x6, which you'd have to do w/something else too, but the 968 pocket covers this much higher... Another option is to buy the M490 (Turbo S or 968) front 3-way set-up & use it- I can get part #'s, easily- the VERY BEST here would be to mount the smaller of the two drivers in the 4x6 location like the later 968's did- they had very nice factory stereos in late '94 & '95... changed them a lot actually.. Anyway, the other option, really the best IMO, is to find a good aftermarket 3-way component & use the Turbo S adapter frame & mount the 6.5 at front of door, etc... This is what I'm trying to do, but I'm not having a lot of luck for several reasons.... one of them is money as good 3-way comps are expensive... Also, a good plate speaker in 4x6 frame w/seperate tweeter, etc, might sound better than stadard coax 4x6... might still look into that- you need to listen to your friend's 4x6 to decide how that sounds, of course...

Either way, I'd try to find a nice, small, 4-ch amp- I can send you some of the ones I've found, but they're all in the 60w minimum range- checking for 50w/ch would yield more results for smaller amps...

Robby

Steve- you have more front options than we do- simpler to get 6.5 components up front b/c you don't have dash clearance probs in your car... Find a nice shallow speaker like a Kappa 60.7CS 6.5" & make a thin spacer (probably 1/4" if that, do a little trimming & mount it... sounds like you've got plenty of power... I've heard that rear-most location can give pretty good bass, partly b/c of reflecting off the glass, but I think it has to be angled slightly to work at it's best... what amp are you running? It's 75w/ch rms, right???

F451

Hey guys,

I just bought an '83 944 and will be looking to upgrade the speaker setup soon so this is a great thread. I was interesting in seeing the pics Robby had, so had them emailed to me. Here they are if anyone is interested. I don't know anything about these setups, so if there are any questions, I guess Robby would be the guy to answer them.

Ed

I think I have the descriptions correct here...

Jeremy's 968 Cab Rear Deck 1


Amazon 968 Interior


Jeremy's 968 Cab Rear Deck


'94 Cab Tray


Jeremy 968 Cab Rear Deck


911 CS


Custom Seat Delete


Custom Seat Delete


Carpeting


Carpeting 2