Jon Moeller

Turbo is better, hands down, no contest.

Granted, I've never driven an S2, even though I considered buying one, before purchasing my Turbo, but the Turbo has this really cool "Turbo" script under the rear spoiler, while the S2 just has a stupid "S2" under the rear spoiler. I mean, what is that? "S2" Sheesh!

Z-man just can't admit that the S2 isn't as cool as the Turbo. He may think it is, but subconsciously, that "Turbo" script is calling him.

-Jon
disclaimer - post written with the utmost sarcasm, if you couldn't tell. Drive both, then decide.

Rally Guy

The tensioner issue has to be addressed once every 100K miles or so. It's a $300 part and takes minutes to replace - okay about 60 minutes.

So factored over the 3-6 years between tensioner replacements, I don't see them being a huge maintence factor. It's not like valve adjustment difference between a 964 and 993. That's ~$1000/yr savings, every year.

RK

jim944s2

The best plan is the buy the nicest, most well maintained, best deal of either one!
I miss the 'whoosh' of my '86 951, but the '89 S2 is a great car too. I think it really depends on what you want to use the car for. If DE is your main goal, the 951s (especially S's) are probably better suited. For daily driver and/or auto-x, the S2 is probably better.

Z-man

Hehe... By now, you should know that 'being cool' is not one of my biggest attributes!

The problem I have with the turbos is they've got great speed on the straights, but often, they slow me down in the corners! I went a whole track session once with a turbo (996, actually), in front of me: he'd 'turbo' me on the straights, and then for the corners, he's slow down so much, I swear he was looking for street signs.

Then there's the story of my friend who has 951 with a bunch of suspension upgrades. He was following me up the esses at The Glen. His video shows me pulling away from him through that series of fast connected turns! Problem is, half way down the back straight, I had to let him by. Stupid cheating turbos! Talk about getting the wind knocked out of your sails!

I still like my naturally aspirated 16-valve 3.0 liters of joy!

Regards,
-Z.

mpw

I think I followed that same guy at VIR, except he'd give me a pass coming out of oak tree and onto the front straight and then not lift. Yeah, my 3600 lbs. 250HP sedan is going to get around your 3200lbs. 415HP 996.


Curious, do you remember what your speed was either coming out of the uphill esses or right before braking for the bus stop? Just curious what a 944 S2 will do through there.

- Matt

M758

Just remember Z-man a turbo can just as fast as your S2 in the corners. I just think the most Turbo guys love the boost TOO much and forget about the corners. Since you have no boost you need to get joy somewhere. That be in the corners and you spend time working beating people there. When you do it is fun.

PS... Owning a Turbo S and tracking that only to switch to an 8v 944 NA I know all about being dusted on the straights, but eating folks for lunch in the corners.

PPS.... Hey guys .... see what I race now?

Z-man

Matt:
When I apex turn 2 just right, and keep my foot in it through the whole section (sometimes I'm chicken hehe), I'm at about 120mph at the top of the Essses. Grab 5th, (with S2 gearing, you're at redline in 4th at 120) and I'm around 130-135 as I approach the braking zone for the Bus stop.

Awfully fast & really thrilling!
-Z.

mpw

Yep, I'm pretty much the same thing, and I can totally understand about chickening out at times. I always thought my foot was on the floor, but going back and watching my videos, I realized that I often wasn't. I also made the mistake of running up on the right hand curb at the top of the esses at about 115 in August. Highest pucker factor I've experienced at the track so far. That's cool that there's so much speed in the S2. I really hope I get this car, I'm psyched. Also, I'm really looking forward to not paying $300 for a two day event, you P-car guys have it good. BTW, what tires are you running on the track?

- Matt

Z-man

Matt:
I run Pirelli P-Zero C's. (R-compounds) 245-45/16's at all four corners. I use 8Jx16's at all four corners on the track - they fit - no rubbing. Totally changes the handling dynamics of the car - much crisper turn in, and you can actually get some good rotation in the corners! And they wear very well, especially since I can rotate these tires front to back, left to right!

Regarding price: yeah, PCA has the best deal in town, in terms of track fees! (Helps to be non-profit, ya know!) As part of the track operations group for NNJR (I'm one of the track tech co-chairs), I pay instructor's fees, which is even better!

Hope to see you this season out there!
-Zoltan.

rsrdan

What you call the bus stop,your talking about the oak tree right?.
I dont have any trouble with any of the 951's at the track,or 911's new or old,the only ones that run with me are a viper,996tt,993tt and thats about it,unless its a track only..I run the kumho 17in.

M758

Oak tree = VIR

Bus Stop = Watkins Glen

mpw

What M758 said. I'd probably kill myself if I were going 135 before braking for Oak Tree.

Z-man

Yeah, 135 @ Oak Tree @ Vir = sudden off track experience!!

rsrdan: wrong set of Esses!

-Z-man.

ewainwright

Small point. Turbo lag is only from a dead stop. Both cars can corner at the same rate of speed. If the S out pulls a turbo coming out of even a slow corner then the turbo is in the wrong gear or has the wrong turbocharger for the track. With a turbo you have to decide what you want - quick spool or high horsepower.

I suggest actually driving both examples (I have). Beware however. The turbo can make you into a boostaholic. Its worst and almost as expensive as crack and (puff puff) its hard to put down always looking for (puff puff) the next fix (ah). Trust me its fun ed

ERAU-944

all these guys will tell you to 'go turbo' if you're all about the fun on the track. i myself refuse to buy a turbo, and although i drive my roommate's now and again, i still don't feel the need to at all. imo, its better to start out with a car that isn't nuts on the horsepower and learn how to drive, then when you're good, step up the hp. too many people (as in Z-man's experience) just go straight for the HP, and because it makes you SEEM so fast, its kind of a wash. i'll stick to my light little n/a for now. so it depends on what you want to do, and/or how you want to do it. either car will make a fine daily driver or track car. find the best example of either and buy it. you won't be let down.

-Michael-