EFI Impressions
#16
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Chet,
Would seem to make perfect sense, whether its forced induction or NA, any improvement in volumetric efficiency in a motor is a good thing. They're basically air pumps so increasing the volume of air you can pull into the cylinder allows you to burn more gas which them makes more power. Other little tricks, like swirling the flow and etc would just improve on that. As long as you can keep the thermal properties under control so you're not frying pistons or valves, and timing has enough to get you the anti-knock you need why not? Good luck with it and keep us posted how it does as you drive it around.
Would seem to make perfect sense, whether its forced induction or NA, any improvement in volumetric efficiency in a motor is a good thing. They're basically air pumps so increasing the volume of air you can pull into the cylinder allows you to burn more gas which them makes more power. Other little tricks, like swirling the flow and etc would just improve on that. As long as you can keep the thermal properties under control so you're not frying pistons or valves, and timing has enough to get you the anti-knock you need why not? Good luck with it and keep us posted how it does as you drive it around.
#18
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YES cost is not a consideration for someone who wants to push a 930!
Pushing with CIS is crazy, in my opinion.
The cis is fine with 260 US HP, but these engines are a little too expensive to wreck when you push.
I probably wouldn't even push a 930 WITH EFI, but I am a conservative guy.
Pushing with CIS is crazy, in my opinion.
The cis is fine with 260 US HP, but these engines are a little too expensive to wreck when you push.
I probably wouldn't even push a 930 WITH EFI, but I am a conservative guy.
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#20
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Chet, shame about your PW.
I think the Kpa is the same as bar, except that you -1 from the reading. eg 1.9Kpa is 0.9bar.
1.0Kpa is 0bar.
.5Kpa is -0.5bar.
Just a guess though. I guess you could google it.
I think the Kpa is the same as bar, except that you -1 from the reading. eg 1.9Kpa is 0.9bar.
1.0Kpa is 0bar.
.5Kpa is -0.5bar.
Just a guess though. I guess you could google it.
#22
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CIS is capable of producing in-spec A/F ratios up to ~400HP at the rear wheels throughout the RPM range when properly tuned. Beyond that the CIS modifications needed to retain proper A/F ratios become diminishing returns.
There is no doubt that Chet's engine has benefitted from EFI but it also got there with CIS, the ragged edge yes, but it got there. Backing off the boost a smudge and further tuning would have proven reliable and passed smog.
Building an ultra high powered 930 engine will take EFI. Hitting those numbers with a 3.0L is a home run. Nice job!
There is no doubt that Chet's engine has benefitted from EFI but it also got there with CIS, the ragged edge yes, but it got there. Backing off the boost a smudge and further tuning would have proven reliable and passed smog.
Building an ultra high powered 930 engine will take EFI. Hitting those numbers with a 3.0L is a home run. Nice job!
#24
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Originally Posted by NineMeister
It's the work of a madman for sure, making a 930 that powerful. Should lock them up and throw away the key ![Wink](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/wink.gif)
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Fair point, but then there isn't a sane person in Warrington so you can't comment
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Chet, thanks for the explanation, I was under the impression that a standard K27 could only get somewhere IRO 400fwhp in a 3.3 at 1bar. My heads have been ported, by the Ninemeister, along with other normal mods and a BB 9m turbo and 1bar got me 497bhp
I’m curious as to what boost you were running in a 3.0ltr with a standard K27 to get 440rwhp on CIS, good job
#25
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Originally Posted by RarlyL8
CIS is capable of producing in-spec A/F ratios up to ~400HP at the rear wheels throughout the RPM range when properly tuned. Beyond that the CIS modifications needed to retain proper A/F ratios become diminishing returns.
There is no doubt that Chet's engine has benefitted from EFI but it also got there with CIS, the ragged edge yes, but it got there. Backing off the boost a smudge and further tuning would have proven reliable and passed smog.
Building an ultra high powered 930 engine will take EFI. Hitting those numbers with a 3.0L is a home run. Nice job!
There is no doubt that Chet's engine has benefitted from EFI but it also got there with CIS, the ragged edge yes, but it got there. Backing off the boost a smudge and further tuning would have proven reliable and passed smog.
Building an ultra high powered 930 engine will take EFI. Hitting those numbers with a 3.0L is a home run. Nice job!
There is no comparsion between a CIS car and a efi CAR .. the cis car will have more lag , smaller T/Q curve and poor Throttle response, while the peak numbers are close , the cis car will be slower, it might feel faster as the nothing then everything feel , but line both cars up 2nd gear roll on and watch the efi car go away.. also a cis car making 400 whp vs efi at the same power , the cis car will have less reliabilty.
Have to say , i have never seen a converted cis car to efi make less or the same power, the efi one is always higher ..now a cis car making 400 whp at
13:8 A/F is not the same as 400 whp @ 11:9 A/F , the leaner engine will not have any power after one run thru the gears .
#26
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Originally Posted by A.Wayne
13:8 A/F is not the same as 400 whp @ 11:9 A/F , the leaner engine will not have any power after one run thru the gears.
So people have to ask when their cars are running 14s and maxed out which is more expensive, the EFI or the CIS with an engine build. Not everyone needs it and if you are happy with your HP and it is in a safe range then you can take or leave it. Bottom line is Chet's car while it made GREAT HP for a 3.0 it was a time bomb waiting to happen. Not if....just when. Those kind of numbers are not uncommon for a 3.4 build we do, but not a 3.0. Period.
Now his car has a better power band, makes the same power but with less boost and carries a 11.7-11.9 at WOT full boost and redline. Perfect. It did not do that before.
#27
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Have to say , i have never seen a converted cis car to efi make less or the same power, the efi one is always higher
#30
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I guess you all think I am an idiot.
I am very aware of how A/F ratios affect performance and engine longevity. CIS is capable of 12.0-12.2 A/F ON BOOST at 400+ HP WHEN PROPERLY TUNED. Who said anything about 13.8? That would be REDICULOUS.
I guess the real issue is that nobody knows how to tune CIS.
I am very aware of how A/F ratios affect performance and engine longevity. CIS is capable of 12.0-12.2 A/F ON BOOST at 400+ HP WHEN PROPERLY TUNED. Who said anything about 13.8? That would be REDICULOUS.
I guess the real issue is that nobody knows how to tune CIS.