Lowering my 87 930
04-12-2004, 09:45 PM
#16
Racer
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Well I just came back from the Perfect Power in Libertyville. Very nice set-up. Unfortunately Sol wasn't in, he was at the opening day for the Cubs, I think that must be like a religious pilgrimage around these parts...lol. The office manager was in and she spoke with another mechanic and gave me quote for the ailingment, lowering and corner weighting....holy bejebus it will be $1100-1200!!! Does this sound right? Not replacing anything just doing the above mentioned labor. If I am going to have spend that much how much more would it be to just change out the sway bars and t-bars while they are in there? And what sways and t-bars would you guys recommend, remember street with some auto-x and DE's, and who to get them from? How much should the parts run...geez I wasn't expecting that much
Anyways dicuss guys.
Lane
Anyways dicuss guys.
Lane
04-12-2004, 10:49 PM
#17
AutoX
$1200 OUCH!!!!
Lane,
I'd much rather have met you today than watch the Cubs get killed by the Pirates.
I was alerted to your posts here by a customer at the end of the day, and thought I could explain a few things.
1. Unless your car is close to the desired ride height in the rear, you will need to have you rear torsion bars set correctly by someone who has the knowledge and equipment to do this job.
2. You cannot lower the car on the spring plates and still have the alignment in spec at the end. You can raise the car, but not lower it.
3. Up front, the ride height is easily adjusted by relocating the torsion bar caps (if necessary) and adjusting the preload screws to the desired ride height/corner weight.
In any case, after adjusting ride height until the car looks good and measures out with a yardstick, there is no guarantee whatsoever that corner weights, camber or toe are anywhere in spec anymore. The car must be adjusted for ride height, rake and balance, on the scales, and then be aligned at all four corners. Anything less is a poor job. Even for the street, it can ruin the handling of the car completely if these things are way off. With all due respect to Mitch, I would be willing to bet that his car would fail my corner balance and alignment criteria. When completed, this job often runs into 14-16 hours of labor. Any quality shop, doing this job right, will charge accordingly. In our case: 12 hours @$100/hr or $1200.
PerfPow (Sol)
www.perfectpowerinc.com
I'd much rather have met you today than watch the Cubs get killed by the Pirates.
I was alerted to your posts here by a customer at the end of the day, and thought I could explain a few things.
1. Unless your car is close to the desired ride height in the rear, you will need to have you rear torsion bars set correctly by someone who has the knowledge and equipment to do this job.
2. You cannot lower the car on the spring plates and still have the alignment in spec at the end. You can raise the car, but not lower it.
3. Up front, the ride height is easily adjusted by relocating the torsion bar caps (if necessary) and adjusting the preload screws to the desired ride height/corner weight.
In any case, after adjusting ride height until the car looks good and measures out with a yardstick, there is no guarantee whatsoever that corner weights, camber or toe are anywhere in spec anymore. The car must be adjusted for ride height, rake and balance, on the scales, and then be aligned at all four corners. Anything less is a poor job. Even for the street, it can ruin the handling of the car completely if these things are way off. With all due respect to Mitch, I would be willing to bet that his car would fail my corner balance and alignment criteria. When completed, this job often runs into 14-16 hours of labor. Any quality shop, doing this job right, will charge accordingly. In our case: 12 hours @$100/hr or $1200.
PerfPow (Sol)
www.perfectpowerinc.com
04-13-2004, 11:35 AM
#18
Racer
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Just to chime in... the 1st time I had my car lowered & corner balance, I was quoted ~6 hours. It turned out to be 15 hours; though the mechanic felt so bad that he spoke to the owner (this is dealer we are talking about) to lower the charge to 11 hours for me.
I was shocked a little to say the least... But when I re-corner balance the car the 2nd time myself then re-align, it took a lot less (~2.5 hours).
I was shocked a little to say the least... But when I re-corner balance the car the 2nd time myself then re-align, it took a lot less (~2.5 hours).
04-13-2004, 11:56 AM
#19
Burning Brakes
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Dallas, then Annapolis - now Laguna Beach CA. Well, not so fast - I'm back in Dallas. For good!
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Sol is right.
If you want to do right, an alignment is absolutely required. I neglected to mention it in my post. My post was one end of the spectrum in terms of the easiest path to lowering. Not necessarily the best.
Corner balancing IS labor intensive - it requires a lot of checking and rechecking. For my purposes - a part time weekend car - not required at this time. If you are serious abt track times or someone who just "wants it right" go for the corner balance. It's only money.
If you do reindex the rear T bars, do a 4 wheel alignment, then a corner balance, 12 hours sounds abt right. At least there are no parts to buy!
If you want to do right, an alignment is absolutely required. I neglected to mention it in my post. My post was one end of the spectrum in terms of the easiest path to lowering. Not necessarily the best.
Corner balancing IS labor intensive - it requires a lot of checking and rechecking. For my purposes - a part time weekend car - not required at this time. If you are serious abt track times or someone who just "wants it right" go for the corner balance. It's only money.
If you do reindex the rear T bars, do a 4 wheel alignment, then a corner balance, 12 hours sounds abt right. At least there are no parts to buy!
04-13-2004, 12:15 PM
#20
Rocketrider,
Give Midwest Eurosport in Bensenville a call. I know alot of people that have been very happy with them. They are involved with setting up race cars, PCA club events,etc..as well as general service.
Give Midwest Eurosport in Bensenville a call. I know alot of people that have been very happy with them. They are involved with setting up race cars, PCA club events,etc..as well as general service.
04-13-2004, 07:39 PM
#22
Racer
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Re: $1200 OUCH!!!!
Originally posted by PerfPow
Lane,
I'd much rather have met you today than watch the Cubs get killed by the Pirates.
I was alerted to your posts here by a customer at the end of the day, and thought I could explain a few things.
1. Unless your car is close to the desired ride height in the rear, you will need to have you rear torsion bars set correctly by someone who has the knowledge and equipment to do this job.
2. You cannot lower the car on the spring plates and still have the alignment in spec at the end. You can raise the car, but not lower it.
3. Up front, the ride height is easily adjusted by relocating the torsion bar caps (if necessary) and adjusting the preload screws to the desired ride height/corner weight.
In any case, after adjusting ride height until the car looks good and measures out with a yardstick, there is no guarantee whatsoever that corner weights, camber or toe are anywhere in spec anymore. The car must be adjusted for ride height, rake and balance, on the scales, and then be aligned at all four corners. Anything less is a poor job. Even for the street, it can ruin the handling of the car completely if these things are way off. With all due respect to Mitch, I would be willing to bet that his car would fail my corner balance and alignment criteria. When completed, this job often runs into 14-16 hours of labor. Any quality shop, doing this job right, will charge accordingly. In our case: 12 hours @$100/hr or $1200.
PerfPow (Sol)
www.perfectpowerinc.com
Lane,
I'd much rather have met you today than watch the Cubs get killed by the Pirates.
I was alerted to your posts here by a customer at the end of the day, and thought I could explain a few things.
1. Unless your car is close to the desired ride height in the rear, you will need to have you rear torsion bars set correctly by someone who has the knowledge and equipment to do this job.
2. You cannot lower the car on the spring plates and still have the alignment in spec at the end. You can raise the car, but not lower it.
3. Up front, the ride height is easily adjusted by relocating the torsion bar caps (if necessary) and adjusting the preload screws to the desired ride height/corner weight.
In any case, after adjusting ride height until the car looks good and measures out with a yardstick, there is no guarantee whatsoever that corner weights, camber or toe are anywhere in spec anymore. The car must be adjusted for ride height, rake and balance, on the scales, and then be aligned at all four corners. Anything less is a poor job. Even for the street, it can ruin the handling of the car completely if these things are way off. With all due respect to Mitch, I would be willing to bet that his car would fail my corner balance and alignment criteria. When completed, this job often runs into 14-16 hours of labor. Any quality shop, doing this job right, will charge accordingly. In our case: 12 hours @$100/hr or $1200.
PerfPow (Sol)
www.perfectpowerinc.com
No sweat about the game, most of the guys I work with at Circuit City are Cubs fans, thats why I said it must be like a pligrimage...lol.
I just always underestimate what these beast require. You will be seeing me soon. While you are in there adjusting everything wouldit be more cost effective for me to change out sways and t-bars? If so what would I be looking at for the parts and how much more labor. Thanks for hopping in the thread, I need all the professional guidance for this matter I can get.
Thanks guys!!
04-13-2004, 08:21 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
To me it sounds high. I did my car with corner balance, alignment and new t bars at Johnson alignment for $1000. johnson in torrance does lots of Porsche Owner Club racers and is a Aprroved PCA tech station. So I think he know what he is doing.
04-19-2004, 12:21 AM
#24
perfect power is the type of place that spends 10 hours on your car and charges you for 8. most shops spend 6 hours and charge 6. it should never be about cost, it should always be about value. at 150mph its money well spent.
04-19-2004, 11:12 PM
#25
Racer
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Well guys I will have the car sent over to Sol as soon as the Last Detail is finished. I have no doubt Sol will take great care of the car and me. My big question now is should I have the t-bars and sway bars done at this time as well. If so what will I be looking for in parts and what should they run? Also how much more in labor will I be looking at. Any help appreciated.
Lane
Lane
