Jay H

Let time due it's job. Remember, a now cherished SC coupe was just a "regular" 911 back then. Nothing really all that special verses the Turbo and the ultra expensive 928.

There will be a time when a base 996 will be a coveted car and will feel raw and very demanding to drive verses what the current transportation is going to be.

Also, when the '78 SC came out, it was again another departure from the very raw feel of the previoius generation cars and I remember reading about journalist that declared the end was near for the 911 since it was becoming a very luxury oriented car. Porsche purposely designed in more comfort features for the SC. Power windows, cruise, bigger 16" Fuchs, sunroofs, cassette players, etc. were all luxury and 'bling' type things back then for 911's.

Drive a 356 or a very early long hood car and you'll feel immediately how much of a change an SC is over those cars... Those long hoods feel like tractors as compared to a much more modern SC.


John: Points well taken on the money thing.

Pedro356C

I don't know Jay...as Elvis would say...after 1998 "They lost that loving feeling..."

Time will tell us so...I heard the 997 came with a Japanese tranny...as soon as you buy a new P-car...it's already "non-maching #s"...

Peter Zimmermann

Jay H: So right. Many of those rust-free, nice, partially used up long hood cars used to be maintained at my shop. Then along came CA smog requirements, and the unwillingness of most owners to spend as necessary to make their MFI car comply (the carb cars were much easier). Before CA reversed their decision, and exempted cars '73 and earlier, brokers combed the streets of L.A. with a wad of cash in their pocket. The cars were purchased and shipped off to Belgium, then sold in Germany, Italy and France. I know of 2.2Ss that sold for less than $7500, 2.4Es for even less, and some for as little as $4K, etc., man, if only those cars were all sitting in a SoCal barn instead of being on display in Europe!

Jay H

Yeah, but as new cars continue to improve, a 996 will be loud and raw at some point in time. As I said, just compare a '70 911 with a '78 SC...

Aisin makes A LOT of transmissions for various vendors, maybe 35 car companies... Porsche can't afford to make their own transmissions now and they have been outsourcing transmissions for years... BorgWarner partnered with Aisin at one point. Keep in mind the 928 came with a Mercedes automatic transmission for years... Japan builds some of the best products in the world and I would argue they can build stuff better than the Europeans can.

Why not buy a transmission from a company that specilizes in transmission verses spending tons of money on R&D and then the manufacturing process?? Let the experts do what they do best and source it out from them. It's a global economy, so you can buy from anywhere now verses years ago when it only made sense to either make it yourself or buy it from your own back yard.

Pedro, I'm not flamming you, just offering some counterpoint!

Peter: Back in 1996, I passed on a pretty nice '72 coupe in my area for $9000. It was sitting in the corner of this high end used car lot that I would view a lot of more modern cars at. Gold over brown/tan. Quite original yet. No rust. The salesman disuaded me from buying it saying that it needed some mechanical work "and they are just not that nice to drive". "I don't know what we're going to do with that dog...I don't think it'll sell". It stood around most of that summer...

In 1995, I passed on a 1973 "T" with 16,000 miles on it for $14,000 asking price. It was mint and untouched. Blue over black. Showroom new and stunning. The salesman stated that it was really just sitting around too much and would need some new seals and stuff. What would that car be worth now? $40k? $50k? $60k? $100k??

Times have changed in regards to the long hoods...

Amber Gramps

WE are in a market where even my boss, a 997 owner, forked out $8,500 for a rancid 912E just to drive it for a weekend. as soon as he got it home he sold it to his brother-in-law who begged him for it. No interior, no smog, no headliner, missing 2 pistons, and it went for that much that fast. it's like every dog on the block has to have a porsche in the shed to keep him company.

p.s. yes the neighbor with the 914/6 did buy the 911 slant nose cab. I think that brings the total to 9 porsche between here and the next stop sign.

1986951

"Please try to post pictures again."

Yep, I will see if I can get some better ones in brighter sunlight.
This is a GREAT Thread! Love it! All points are well thought, and nicely stated...
Keep it going!

Pedro356C

Hi Jay...I'd never take it as flaming...I'm a big fan of your posts...always eloquent, interesting and knowledgeable...

It's my problem...I'm a bit of a romantic purist...globalization makes me sad... yesterday I bought my favorite Argentinean wine (Malbec grape) and they replaced the traditional cork for some plastic weird clone...It almost made me cry!!!

This is definitely a rich thread...

Jay H

Pedro, thank you for the kind words. I'm glad to hear that you took no offense. Text on the intenet is terribly flat and we lose all the human interaction/voice inflection that conveys the real meaning behind the words.

I too am very much a purist and didn't care much for Porsche's choice of using an Aisin transmission in the new crop of cars. However, I did a bit of research on that company (isn't the internet great?) and was pretty comfortable with their decision (like it's up to me anyway!) to use those transmission. It seems Aisin knows what they are doing.

I personally would love everything on a new 911 to say "Made in Germany" for some odd reason, and I'd sure like a new 911 to be hand built by expert German craftsman like the old days, but unfortunately, that's not how the world works anymore... Again, that's another aspect of these older 911's (such as the SC's we're talking about in this thread) that we like so much...there was a lot of hand assembly done on them by real pros. They really screwed these cars together well. Kinda cool...

Best to all,

Jay

ked

"...they replaced the traditional cork for some plastic weird clone...It almost made me cry!!!"
don't cry - just drink the **** & see if it is still any good.

Pedro356C

Hi Ked...I just did and 2005 was a way better!!!!


But...Getting back to SCs....I was browsing the PCA classifieds and there are at least 3 amazing cars there...these babies are coming closer to the 3.2 Carreras pre-G50...

ked

keep taking data.
I think the '80s & 70s vintages are best.

flatsixnut

I know I cant see the future, but I really doubt that the early run 996's will ever see any kind of following. You can almost buy one now for what you pay for a 3.2 in average condition. ( I know I will probably get flamed for that one) Honestly though, I am as die hard Porsche as they come, but i would rather own something else if my only choice for a Porsche was a 1999 996.

The longhood prices have grown big time in the last 4 years. Avergae of $10,000, and $15,000 an S.
The impact bumper cars are right behind them. I seriously think we'll see the first watercooled 911's down in the teens in another 8 years.

I have friends selling their 996's and Boxters, and buying pre-90 911's.

911scTarga

Jay H

Keep in mind that there are young people that grew up with 996 posters on their wall and that model is THE 911 for them. As they grow older, they are going to want that model and will view the 993 and older cars as just that, old cars. It may not be desireable for them to have an old school air cooled car. Let time do it's job. Each generation is going to have 'their' 911. I'm stuck on 3.2 Carreras. It's my 911 of choice since I grew up in the '80's lusting after these cars. I do really like the long hoods, but I still chose a 3.2 for my main driving 911.

Also, it used to be you couldn't give a 2.7 liter mid year 911 away. Even concours ready cars with low mileage were $10,000 cars. Now, we're seeing even these cars bring in the mid teens for pricing and some models from that area are at or above $20k now. Who would have guessed that?

Spend some time in a 996. It's not a bad car. I too would never choose one for a toy, but if I had to have a daily driver 911 for the type of conditions I have to drive in, it may just be a 996...

More food for thought...

flatsixnut

The only 996's that will have a following will be the Turbo's, GT2's, and GT3's.
Now this is just my opinion but every other 996 is an UGLY SOB. (first run 996's)

I believe that the 997's have really come around, and look quite sexy. But they still dont turn my head. My head will turn quicker for an impact bumper car long before it turns for even a ferrari/lambo..etc...