JackOlsen

So long as it's got a place for the air to go, the center-mount cooler should be plenty. You can fabricate a sheet metal piece to install in the front trunk that allows you to cut away some of the nose to let air exit after going through the cooler.



TRE Motorsports also sells one that matches the factory piece.

The problem with fender-mounted coolers is getting enough air through them. I had to do a lot of ducting before mine were good enough. Bill Verburg's street car has a 3.8 an no oil cooling drama at all because he has the front-mounted cooler.

TonyG

Jack

We were planning to cut out as necessary for the front mount oil cooler.

If, with the front cut out, the front mount big Mocal is OK, then I don't have to go buy another Carrera oil cooler for my SC :-)

I'll take your advise.

Thanks,

TonyG

Bill Verburg

I've had super results from B&B front mounts I'm using a single FPOR-9100(nothing else) on my 3.8, temps always stay below 212F and usually below 185F. The 9400 would be an ultimate track solution if you have the room

Here are B&B sizes:

FPOR-9000 Front Soiler MountOil Cooler 5 1/2" x 2 1/4" x 15"

FPOR-9100 Front Soiler MountOil Cooler 5 1/2" x 2 1/4" x 20"

FPOR-9200 Front Soiler MountOil Cooler 5 1/2" x 2 1/4" x 24"

FPOR-9300 Front Soiler MountOil Cooler 6" x 3" x 20"

FPOR-9400 Front Soiler MountOil Cooler 6" x 3" x 24"

Cajun

Hey guys,

I just stumbled across this thread. I have a '76 with a blown 2.7 (I definitely mean "blown" in a bad way!!!!). I was considering the 3.2 upgrade. I did not know that upgrading to an even later 3.6 was possible. I have been watching the 3.2 engine market for a couple of months now and it appears that a good engine goes for between 6-7k. How much does a good 3.6 go for? Are the modifications that have to be made to the car more extensive?

Anyhow, any advice is greatly appreciated!

Cajun

JackOlsen

Here's a link with lots of information on doing a 3.6 swap. Steve Timmins is pretty much the godfather of 3.6 swaps.

Cajun

Thanks for the link.

How much faster is a 3.6 than a 3.2 in an early car? Is it worth the extra $$$???

Brian_77_3.6

I believe it is worth the difference. I had a 3.2 in my car with a Mass Airflow, chip and modified exhuast and thought that it was pretty quick. Had Steve Timmons do a 3.6 conversion about a month ago and have no regrets. I am a track junkie and as a black run group driver the 3.6 gives me the torque to take my driving to a whole different level. If all you are going to do is drive the car on the street then I am not sure the difference is worth it. But if track events are in your future then go with the 3.6

Cajun

The game plan with my car is to use it on the street the majority of the time in the beginning. I plan to start DE'ing it after the new engine is put in. Eventually, the car will become a dedicated track car.

Thanks for the reply.

KLehmann

With a friend, I recently exchanged engines between his two cars.

1. Recently purchased 78 SC Targa with a 3.6 already installed. 3.6 is said to be a '94 motor built to "RS" specs, whatever that means. B&B headers, chip, Fabspeed/Flowmaster exhaust.

2. 88 Carrera coupe, basically stock 3.2 with the obligatory Dansk premuff and SteveWong chip.

The SC was seriously fast w/ the 3.6, now it's just quick with the 3.2

The '88 3.2 was like most Carreras- kinda fast, but nothing to write home about. Now with the 3.6 dialed in, the '88 is a hoot. Pulls strong from anywhere in the rev range. It's a huge difference as far as torque is concerned. Much more low end grunt.

As far as the conversion goes, yes, Steve Timmons is the man. No doubt. He provided us with the appropriate clutch setup to assemble the 3.6 to the '88 G50 trans., and he was very helpful with wiring questions pertaining to the 3.6 and in regards to putting the 3.2 in the '78

Best part about the job was that we already had all the rest of the stuff needed to put the 3.6 into the '88. That's because the '78 already had pretty much all of the necessary parts to do the job. My point being? The job is pretty simple when you've got a car that's already had the 3.6 conversion done. Then there's very little of the "what do I need.............." phone calls, emails and parts shopping. Worked out pretty good. Bernie seems really happy with it.

One thing that people have to deal with on these conversions is an exhaust setup. The motor already had the B&B headers, converion oil lines and Fabspeed muffler kit. Yet the exhaust note was a bit much, so I suggested to Bernie he swap the Flowmaster for a #17725 Dynomax muffler to tone down the exhaust note. The hotrod was a little loud with the Flowmaster and is now plenty tolerable with the more sound-deadened Dynomax. I'd suggest the Dynomax muffler to someone before the Flowmaster. The Flowmaster setup sounded but was too much after awhile. And that was with one outlet capped-off!!! Dudes like Bill and Jack firing off the double barrel exhaust note are hardcore. I don't think I could take it. I know I tired of the dual out on my own 87 3.2 with B&B headers.

People looking to cut the budget a bit (no matter how you coordinate the 3.6 swap, it ain't cheap) can put 3.2 heat exchangers on the 3.6 964 motors, and then get some sort of custom muffler setup. Jack can elaborate on this if someone needs more info.

Bill Verburg

Kevin great post, very interesting about the sound differences between the Fabspeed/Flowmaster and the Dynomax.

We just bought a very expensive sound meter and I had intended to take some readings.

Was that Paul's car?

KLehmann

Bill,

The Dynomax is a cheaper alternative to the sturdier, welded case Flowmaster. #17725 Super Turbo is a aluminized dual-in, dual-out crossflow muffler with 2-1/4 in. pipes. Basic details:

http://www.dynomax.com/superturbo.stm

Sounds similar to the Fabspeed, with less volume and more smoothness. Reduced resonance as well. Probably not as durable as the Fab., but should last pretty long nonetheless. I'm betting the Ultra-Flo Dynomax would be sorta like the Fabspeed in that it is a straight thru design, but has a bit of fiberglass to control sound. The Fabspeed/Flowmaster is just a case with perforated straight pipes to tune the sound. I can see (literally, you can see thru it! )why it's quite loud!

And yes, it is Paul's car we "vultured" for the rorty 3.6. But even with the replacement 3.2, it's still a great little car. Very nimble, responsive (both engine and body) and light feeling. Should be a fun car for the future owner.

JackOlsen

Kevin, that's good to know about. The Flowmaster on my car is 18.5 inches wide. The dynoMax is 2.5 inches narrower. This doesn't matter so much if you have B&B headers, as I do, but the guys who want to adapt 993 exhausts to 3.6 swaps might be able to fit the dynoMax between those (narrower) outlets.

KLehmann

Good point Jack. The 993 manifolds really seem to present a challenge to people. I believe Paul tried them once on his old 3.6?

But I don't see the cool gold powdercoated valve covers on the motor , so maybe it's not Paul's shown here?

Porsche Doc

We just got done putting a 3.6 in a 72 911 RSR look Outlaw.
Weighs 2200# and is a real blast.

Alan Herod

The Instant-G muffler has 2.5 inch inlet and outlet pipes - so it looks like no interchange with either of those products - Flowmaster or Dynomax.

[IMG]Instant G exhaust system[/IMG]

I was looking for something until Steve can get my muffler replaced. As for coolers - I have a 28 row in one fender and a Mocal in the other -- both are boxed in so the air (that gets in) must flow through the cooler.