Lotus Emira vs Porsche Cayman GTS 4.0 Reviews
06-09-2022, 05:14 PM
#46
proving the point that looks are subjective. I wasn't offending any other cars. My point was that from a looks department, trendy or not, your average non-enthusiast is MUCH more likely to see the lotus as an exciting car (visually).
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jorijori (06-12-2023)
06-09-2022, 05:43 PM
#47
Drifting
We can watch reviews all we want, but in reality, driving is so subjective. There is only one way to figure it out, drive it back to back yourself. I did the comparison between 991.2 GT3/RS and 992 GT3, it was a day and night difference and you notice it right away. Many people on this forum say you cannot feel it because xxx review and yyy theory. For those folks, talk all you want because it is your right, but I am getting first-hand experience and unless you drove them all, I have more credibility than you on the driving feedback of those cars.
On this note, I am buying an emira and I will do the comparison with a 718 GT4, or spyder, or a GTS when I drive them back to back. I will share my driving impressions but note, it is going to be subjective.
On this note, I am buying an emira and I will do the comparison with a 718 GT4, or spyder, or a GTS when I drive them back to back. I will share my driving impressions but note, it is going to be subjective.
06-09-2022, 07:05 PM
#48
Three Wheelin'
Lotus has a philosophy to spring the car pretty darn soft due to the terrible roads in the UK. For this Evora, they seem to have tuned it for the street instead of for a dual use car. Hopefully they come out with a "GT" version of the Emira before it's all said and done.
I've posted my impressions from seeing the Emira in person elsewhere, but it looks very exotic, but not as composed or refined Porsche.
I've posted my impressions from seeing the Emira in person elsewhere, but it looks very exotic, but not as composed or refined Porsche.
06-09-2022, 09:17 PM
#49
We can watch reviews all we want, but in reality, driving is so subjective. There is only one way to figure it out, drive it back to back yourself. I did the comparison between 991.2 GT3/RS and 992 GT3, it was a day and night difference and you notice it right away. Many people on this forum say you cannot feel it because xxx review and yyy theory. For those folks, talk all you want because it is your right, but I am getting first-hand experience and unless you drove them all, I have more credibility than you on the driving feedback of those cars.
On this note, I am buying an emira and I will do the comparison with a 718 GT4, or spyder, or a GTS when I drive them back to back. I will share my driving impressions but note, it is going to be subjective.
On this note, I am buying an emira and I will do the comparison with a 718 GT4, or spyder, or a GTS when I drive them back to back. I will share my driving impressions but note, it is going to be subjective.
There is very little difference in the way they drive, in fact the RS is still more visceral. Ask me how I know
Here's a thought for you - many people rate the Elise and Exige - there is good reason for this, both light, mid-engined, double wish bone etc. The Exige was released in the early norties and eventually ended up in peak guise with the 430 Cup. However, the reality is/was none of the engines or gear boxes were particularly good and certainly not on par with the chassis/suspension dynamics.
So what did lotus do, they doubled down and made the Evora which kept the bad stuff and lost some of the chassis dynamics of the Exige.
Roll on to 2022 - we now have the Evira, which kept all of the bad stuff from the Evora including the heavy weight, and seemingly have added even more compliance........I suggest you drive a 430 Cup back to back with the Emira and you will see how far Lotus have fallen.
Lotus are a classic case of company failure due to their inability to evolve, adapt, improvise and overcome. How far have they dropped - look at a modern formula one car - everything you see, engine placement - suspension placement - aero all came from Colin Chapman.
The motoring journalists need a class in open and honest disclosure (1) Lotus is owned by Geely (in fact Zhejiang Geely Holding Group Co (2) the engine is the V6 engine found in the Toyota Camry and modified by Lotus (3) I believe the gear box is also made by Toyota or based around a Toyota derivative...........................................these are not insignificant points, particularly if the price point is above that of the far better made and engineered Cayman GTS.
Last edited by groundhog; 06-09-2022 at 10:24 PM.
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Noah Fect (06-10-2022)
06-10-2022, 12:33 AM
#50
Rennlist Member
Just blew your own credibility right out the water -
There is very little difference in the way they drive, in fact the RS is still more visceral. Ask me how I know
Here's a thought for you - many people rate the Elise and Exige - there is good reason for this, both light, mid-engined, double wish bone etc. The Exige was released in the early norties and eventually ended up in peak guise with the 430 Cup. However, the reality is/was none of the engines or gear boxes were particularly good and certainly not on par with the chassis/suspension dynamics.
So what did lotus do, they doubled down and made the Evora which kept the bad stuff and lost some of the chassis dynamics of the Exige.
Roll on to 2022 - we now have the Evira, which kept all of the bad stuff from the Evora including the heavy weight, and seemingly have added even more compliance........I suggest you drive a 430 Cup back to back with the Emira and you will see how far Lotus have fallen.
Lotus are a classic case of company failure due to their inability to evolve, adapt, improvise and overcome. How far have they dropped - look at a modern formula one car - everything you see, engine placement - suspension placement - aero all came from Colin Chapman.
The motoring journalists need a class in open and honest disclosure (1) Lotus is owned by Geely (in fact Zhejiang Geely Holding Group Co (2) the engine is the V6 engine found in the Toyota Camry and modified by Lotus (3) I believe the gear box is also made by Toyota or based around a Toyota derivative...........................................these are not insignificant points, particularly if the price point is above that of the far better made and engineered Cayman GTS.
There is very little difference in the way they drive, in fact the RS is still more visceral. Ask me how I know
Here's a thought for you - many people rate the Elise and Exige - there is good reason for this, both light, mid-engined, double wish bone etc. The Exige was released in the early norties and eventually ended up in peak guise with the 430 Cup. However, the reality is/was none of the engines or gear boxes were particularly good and certainly not on par with the chassis/suspension dynamics.
So what did lotus do, they doubled down and made the Evora which kept the bad stuff and lost some of the chassis dynamics of the Exige.
Roll on to 2022 - we now have the Evira, which kept all of the bad stuff from the Evora including the heavy weight, and seemingly have added even more compliance........I suggest you drive a 430 Cup back to back with the Emira and you will see how far Lotus have fallen.
Lotus are a classic case of company failure due to their inability to evolve, adapt, improvise and overcome. How far have they dropped - look at a modern formula one car - everything you see, engine placement - suspension placement - aero all came from Colin Chapman.
The motoring journalists need a class in open and honest disclosure (1) Lotus is owned by Geely (in fact Zhejiang Geely Holding Group Co (2) the engine is the V6 engine found in the Toyota Camry and modified by Lotus (3) I believe the gear box is also made by Toyota or based around a Toyota derivative...........................................these are not insignificant points, particularly if the price point is above that of the far better made and engineered Cayman GTS.
No one is hiding that Loti engines are Toyotas or that they are owned by Geely. The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there. I have never read of watched a review that didn't mention that.
Colin Chapman has been long gone and although he was a brilliant engineer he was not a good businessman and his company has been on the brink since day one.
Are cars heavier and more complex than ever? Yes. Will the Evira save the company from ruin? I hope so. I hope it maintains enough Lotusness while still appealing to the masses in order to be able to sell at a profitable rate.
Full disclosure, I own a Geely (XC-90 T8 Inscription) and it is a great family car. Geely know how to turn a company around and make it profitable. Hopefully enough Lotus DNA survives.
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jorijori (06-12-2023)
06-10-2022, 12:51 AM
#51
+ 1 Emira reviewed as a very good car (not quite as good as the Cayman), but still very good. It will sell for sure, which is the primary marketing & survival objective of Geely/Lotus. The Evora didnt really sell well. It is great to have another mid-engine sportscar in the market.
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981KMAN (07-04-2023)
06-10-2022, 07:53 AM
#52
Groundhog day again?
No one is hiding that Loti engines are Toyotas or that they are owned by Geely. The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there. I have never read of watched a review that didn't mention that.
Colin Chapman has been long gone and although he was a brilliant engineer he was not a good businessman and his company has been on the brink since day one.
Are cars heavier and more complex than ever? Yes. Will the Evira save the company from ruin? I hope so. I hope it maintains enough Lotusness while still appealing to the masses in order to be able to sell at a profitable rate.
Full disclosure, I own a Geely (XC-90 T8 Inscription) and it is a great family car. Geely know how to turn a company around and make it profitable. Hopefully enough Lotus DNA survives.
No one is hiding that Loti engines are Toyotas or that they are owned by Geely. The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there. I have never read of watched a review that didn't mention that.
Colin Chapman has been long gone and although he was a brilliant engineer he was not a good businessman and his company has been on the brink since day one.
Are cars heavier and more complex than ever? Yes. Will the Evira save the company from ruin? I hope so. I hope it maintains enough Lotusness while still appealing to the masses in order to be able to sell at a profitable rate.
Full disclosure, I own a Geely (XC-90 T8 Inscription) and it is a great family car. Geely know how to turn a company around and make it profitable. Hopefully enough Lotus DNA survives.
LOL - a car is only as good as its bones and the reliability is only as good as the engineering and QA/QC. So yes, the owner/manufacturer, construction and type of core components matter.
"The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there" - yawn. I'm telling it exactly as it is - and I've tracked a 430 Cup lol.
Do you think - the Emira should be priced more than the far better Cayman GTS - if so why? Is it better made? Does it have a better engine? Does it have a better gear box? at least put forward a case.
If you said, I don't care about any of that - I just love the look, great I would buy that point of view. I basically did that when I bought my 720S - I liked the design and incredible view.
Last edited by groundhog; 06-10-2022 at 08:10 AM.
06-10-2022, 11:24 AM
#53
Rennlist Member
LOL - a car is only as good as its bones and the reliability is only as good as the engineering and QA/QC. So yes, the owner/manufacturer, construction and type of core components matter.
"The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there" - yawn. I'm telling it exactly as it is - and I've tracked a 430 Cup lol.
Do you think - the Emira should be priced more than the far better Cayman GTS - if so why? Is it better made? Does it have a better engine? Does it have a better gear box? at least put forward a case.
If you said, I don't care about any of that - I just love the look, great I would buy that point of view. I basically did that when I bought my 720S - I liked the design and incredible view.
"The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there" - yawn. I'm telling it exactly as it is - and I've tracked a 430 Cup lol.
Do you think - the Emira should be priced more than the far better Cayman GTS - if so why? Is it better made? Does it have a better engine? Does it have a better gear box? at least put forward a case.
If you said, I don't care about any of that - I just love the look, great I would buy that point of view. I basically did that when I bought my 720S - I liked the design and incredible view.
I'm on the list for an Emira and will make a decision when my name comes up. The Yota lump is pretty robust so not worried about that aspect. The Merc 4 cyl will be interesting to see if they can keep it cool on the track. I had a GLA 45 and while the engine pulled like a freight train the turbo lag was pretty significant so unless something is changed I'm not a fan. In the mean time I will suffer with my mundane GT4. Peter
06-10-2022, 08:55 PM
#54
LOL - a car is only as good as its bones and the reliability is only as good as the engineering and QA/QC. So yes, the owner/manufacturer, construction and type of core components matter.
"The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there" - yawn. I'm telling it exactly as it is - and I've tracked a 430 Cup lol.
Do you think - the Emira should be priced more than the far better Cayman GTS - if so why? Is it better made? Does it have a better engine? Does it have a better gear box? at least put forward a case.
If you said, I don't care about any of that - I just love the look, great I would buy that point of view. I basically did that when I bought my 720S - I liked the design and incredible view.
"The way you keep repeating that almost sounds like there are some underlying biases there" - yawn. I'm telling it exactly as it is - and I've tracked a 430 Cup lol.
Do you think - the Emira should be priced more than the far better Cayman GTS - if so why? Is it better made? Does it have a better engine? Does it have a better gear box? at least put forward a case.
If you said, I don't care about any of that - I just love the look, great I would buy that point of view. I basically did that when I bought my 720S - I liked the design and incredible view.
Have you driven the Emira? Do you know something we don't about its long term reliability? Look we get it. You don't like the Lotus. The good news is that you don't have to buy one. You are also well within your rights to continue bashing a car you've never driven or seen in person on the internet. I do however suspect that many people will see otherwise. For the VAST majority of people that buy cars its an emotional purchase. The fact that the Cayman GTS is likely going to be incrementally better on a race track won't matter to many people. At the GTS level I think I'd personally prefer roll the dice on owning the lotus. Cayman GTS just doesn't do much for me personally... Now if you can pony up for GT4/Spyder (for me, they Spyder in particular) I wouldn't consider the lotus.
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jorijori (06-12-2023)
06-10-2022, 09:02 PM
#55
"the far better Cayman GTS"
Have you driven the Emira? Do you know something we don't about its long term reliability? Look we get it. You don't like the Lotus. The good news is that you don't have to buy one. You are also well within your rights to continue bashing a car you've never driven or seen in person on the internet. I do however suspect that many people will see otherwise. For the VAST majority of people that buy cars its an emotional purchase. The fact that the Cayman GTS is likely going to be incrementally better on a race track won't matter to many people. At the GTS level I think I'd personally prefer roll the dice on owning the lotus. Cayman GTS just doesn't do much for me personally... Now if you can pony up for GT4/Spyder (for me, they Spyder in particular) I wouldn't consider the lotus.
Have you driven the Emira? Do you know something we don't about its long term reliability? Look we get it. You don't like the Lotus. The good news is that you don't have to buy one. You are also well within your rights to continue bashing a car you've never driven or seen in person on the internet. I do however suspect that many people will see otherwise. For the VAST majority of people that buy cars its an emotional purchase. The fact that the Cayman GTS is likely going to be incrementally better on a race track won't matter to many people. At the GTS level I think I'd personally prefer roll the dice on owning the lotus. Cayman GTS just doesn't do much for me personally... Now if you can pony up for GT4/Spyder (for me, they Spyder in particular) I wouldn't consider the lotus.
The GT4 in stock form isn't that great either from a damping perspective. If the Lotus was PDK GT4 quick and with a dual clutch for the V6 option, I would take it over the GT4. Lotus does damping much better than Porsche.
06-10-2022, 09:25 PM
#56
Pro
"the far better Cayman GTS"
Have you driven the Emira? Do you know something we don't about its long term reliability? Look we get it. You don't like the Lotus. The good news is that you don't have to buy one. You are also well within your rights to continue bashing a car you've never driven or seen in person on the internet. I do however suspect that many people will see otherwise. For the VAST majority of people that buy cars its an emotional purchase. The fact that the Cayman GTS is likely going to be incrementally better on a race track won't matter to many people. At the GTS level I think I'd personally prefer roll the dice on owning the lotus. Cayman GTS just doesn't do much for me personally... Now if you can pony up for GT4/Spyder (for me, they Spyder in particular) I wouldn't consider the lotus.
Have you driven the Emira? Do you know something we don't about its long term reliability? Look we get it. You don't like the Lotus. The good news is that you don't have to buy one. You are also well within your rights to continue bashing a car you've never driven or seen in person on the internet. I do however suspect that many people will see otherwise. For the VAST majority of people that buy cars its an emotional purchase. The fact that the Cayman GTS is likely going to be incrementally better on a race track won't matter to many people. At the GTS level I think I'd personally prefer roll the dice on owning the lotus. Cayman GTS just doesn't do much for me personally... Now if you can pony up for GT4/Spyder (for me, they Spyder in particular) I wouldn't consider the lotus.
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MaddMike (06-10-2022)
06-12-2022, 05:26 PM
#57
I was seriously considering the Lotus Evora GT before deciding on the GT4. At that point, the only two mid engine sports cars that you could buy new with a stick shift. I ultimately went with the GT4 because I preferred the higher revving NA engine. Also had some concerns about the offset pedal box in the Evora with comfort on long drives. Unfortunately it seems like the Emira didn't address those issues, and actually revs lower than the Evora (6800 vs 7100). It's a great looking car, and I hope that they do well, we need more options with stick shift sports cars.
06-12-2022, 07:09 PM
#58
Three Wheelin'
Some great photos in there.... its crazy how the Cayman GTS looks down right pedestrian next to the Emira. Interior of the GTS looks its age as well. I'm assuming the Porsche's drivetrain will end up being superior in most ways, but this is a category where emotion sells cars and that lotus stirs some serious emotion
An Exige rolls up to a cars and coffee or you catch one on the road somewhere- it will turn heads. Many people will buy the car based on the emotion the looks alone provide (it sounds pretty good to)... but I was hoping for more in the driving dynamics department.
Just another Lotus, it seems. Personally, I've just never been intrigued enough to try Lotus. That will continue, at least until the next upgraded version of the Emira is announced.
Because I better listen to a guy on the Internet who drives "real hard and fast on real roads". He definitely knows suspension setups better than Porsche engineers.
And how did this devolve into an aftermarket suspension discussion thread?
Last edited by manifold danger; 06-12-2022 at 07:11 PM.
06-19-2023, 06:45 PM
#59
06-20-2023, 08:38 AM
#60
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I really like the Emira (haven’t driven one yet)… there’s not enough options for a mid engine with a stick. Wish Toyota would bring back a MR2 with all the great cars they’ve been coming out with recently.
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Contact me for the best pricing on Quality Parts
- alex@lepetitgarage.us
LePetitGarage.us // @_lepetitgarage on Instagram