aegiswings

So, I have a 2019 BMW 235i and when the 2019 M2 Competition came out I decided to order one and pick it up in Germany. The only local dealer that had available production slots wanted $5k for a slot. I didn't want to pay that so I put down a deposit at another dealer that didn't charge a premium and got on the waiting list. I've been waiting for several months now and as time goes on I get less and less excited about the M2. It is an upgrade from my current car, but it is basically the same car. My 2 is also in good condition with only 33k miles.

Since I am tired of waiting, I am considering dropping off the waiting list, keeping my 2 and getting a Cayman S. I'm new to the Porsche world, and I'm a little overwhelmed. There are only like 5 colors and 6 options to chose from for the M2, but with Porsche everything is a la cart!

Here are my options so far:

• Buy a new Cayman S off the lot at a local dealer. There is one I was looking at recently: night blue, manual, black/luxor interior, power sport seats, heated seats, chrono package, apple carplay. MSRP $79,460. I might be able to get a good deal as it is on the lot. I love the color and definitely want a manual but it doesn't have all the options I want. Will I really miss PASM? Plus, I won't be able to do euro delivery as its already here.
• Order a new Cayman S. Not sure of the color but maybe night blue and graphite blue interior. Manual transmission, power sport seats, PASM, PTV (do I need PTV?), Bose stereo, apple carplay. 20" Carrera S wheels, chrono package (do I need this if I get a manual?). MSRP: $84,620. Will I miss the premium package? I will definitely do euro delivery.
• Buy a used 2016 Cayman GTS or even GT4. It's hard to find a used GT4 under $90k and I'm not sure I want to spend that much. I've heard bad things about the sound of the 4-cylinder engine, and some friends have recommended finding a used Cayman with a 6-cylinder. I'm not sure I'll be able to find the options I want, though, and I've heard while the engine is disappointing, the handling on the newer models is improved. I'll finally get to test drive a new Cayman S next week and I'll see what I think then.

Are there any must have options that I am missing? Color choice is tough too. I really like the night blue, but I also like the carmine red and miami blue (why are those colors so much more expensive?) I'll also have to figure out where to park my 2 as I don't think I can survive with the Cayman as my only car. It snows here (I have snows for my 2) and there isn't much trunk space in the Cayman. Anyone have experience with snow tires on the Cayman? What is the smallest rim that will fit? Anything else I should know?

donR

If you are coming from BMW then surely the sound of the 718 S/GTS is an improvement or on par, at least when you compare it to an F80 M3? Like the BMWs there is also a soundactor which disabling can improve the sound. The 718 does not howl but the sound is still pleasant and more of a growl.

I think on paper the M2 CPT is a great car albeit a little bit heavy but the S55 engine makes up for the losses, although I think the N55 M2 sounds better. You also have the practicality of four seats and over all it is a better value proposition.

IMO the 718 looks better than the somewhat boxy M2 and is a little more exclusive in GTS form. Performance wise the 718 S/GTS should have the slight edge but I don't think there is a lot in it with the M2 CPT.

If your 235i is tuned then the 6 cylinder 981 Cayman may feel a little slow. If not it should be on par but with better handling although you will need to rev it more. The 981 Cayman S/GTS is a great car but the 718 S/GTS is a little bit improvement in many areas. Arguably on par with the 981 GT4 if you look at track times and take into account the effect of sticky Cup 2 tires which are standard and larger on the GT4.

At approx 3.9s 0-100km/h or 3.7 0-60, and 11.9s 1/4 mile the 718 GTS is the faster of the bunch if that is important to you. Coming from a turbo charged car you may more appreciate the off/on torque and rush/push of the turbo charged 4 cylinder Cayman's over the more linear NA Caymans.

With that said the NA 6 cylinder 981 Cayman S/GTS is definitely the best buying and best performance for $$ spent. I would start there and see if you really need more. They are a lot of car and well regarded. Otherwise the M2 CPT is the sane decision for a new car with the latest tech. If you like the tech in your 2019 BMW you might find the tech in the 2013-2016 981 Cayman's a little dated.

Something else to keep in mind is that nearly all 981s and 718 Ss will have an open differential. Only the 718 GTS comes with PTV/mechanical LSD as standard. Depending on your style of driving it is necessary in some situations otherwise you will lose traction. If your 235i is an M it should have LSD as standard like M2 and M3.

Get busy and let us know how you go on your test drives!

worf928

Seats: 50% of butts feel that there’s a big difference between Sport Seats and Sport Seats Plus. (Powered or manaul, doesn’t matter in this.)

You need to test-sit each architecture or there’s a ~25% chance you’ll hate the seat.

Since you are new to Porsche, I’d recommend buying used and driving until you know precisely what you want before doing ED. ED is awesome and the main reason to buy new. There’s a dedicated sub-forum for it. My first ED is behind the click on ‘991TT’ in my signature.

CaymanSinAR

If you keep the 2, why no love for a Boxster instead of a Cayman? That way you'd have an awesome coupe and an awesome convertible.

The M2 Competition is one heck of a cool car. So is the original M2. I darn near bought an M2C in October but went with a 911 instead.

IMO, if you need back seats the M2C is the best buy on the market.

Regarding the 718, don't listen to what anyone else says about the noise. Since you aren't a Porsche guy I highly recommend you get some seat time in a 718. See if the dealership will let you take one for a few hours. Or rent one on Turo for a couple of days. Once you've had some time in it, if you aren't 100% sold, find a used 981 and drive it. You'll have your answer.

The 718 is the better car. The only dig anyone can make about it is the sound and throttle response. The interior is nicer than the 981 and the multimedia interface (which includes CarPlay) is lightyears ahead of the 981.

The 981 is a heck of a value though. If you are strictly talking about using the car on public roads the ultimate difference in performance between the 718 and 981 is very small. The instantaneous throttle response is phenomenal and the noise is otherwordly.

aegiswings

Thanks for all the advice. I'm going to test drive a 718 (cayman s) at the dealer next weekend. I agree that the M2 is nowhere near as good a looking of a car. My first car ever was a 2000 Audi TT so I've driven turbo 4 cylinders before but I know this is going to be totally different experience.

I realized that most of the options I want: PASM, PTV, sport seat plus, chrono, 20" wheels come standard with the GTS model. An S with all those options is only a few thousand less than an GTS so I think might just go for the GTS.

Right now I'm leaning towards a 2019 GTS with euro delivery. The only additional options I'll add is apple carplay and the bose stereo. The big question left is what color. I really like the bright colors on this car (red, orange, yellow, blue). Night blue and carmine red seems really nice, though. Not a fan of white or black or gray. Not sure I understand why the special colors are so much more expensive. It is a different paint? What colors seem to be the most popular?

I did consider a boxster, but I'm not sure the weather in Boston is good enough much of the year for a convertible. I am buying this mostly as a performance car (thus the no power seats or premium package). I'll probably start autcrossing again once I get and will hopefully take it to the track eventually.

CaymanSinAR

That makes sense in Boston.

You'll appreciate the torque curve (wall) of the 718 for autocross and the track.

worf928

Excellent.

My wife and I put about 200k-miles on 5 different Audi TTs starting with two original MK1s (both with the 'illegal' front control arms.)

There's no comparison with the exception of our '12 TT-RS. The motor was a jewel-like beast. But, it was my wife's purchase of her 981 that made me really realize that all the RS had was 'motor' and nothing else. 981/718 is well worth the extra dollars.

And THIS is how Porsche moves money out of your wallet. It's always 'just a little more' to get the next something. At some point you must stop and decide if xx-k-dolars are really worth it to you for the yy features. Otherwise, you'll be looking at ED for a 992 4S at $165k...

If you option-out an S with what you want and a GTS the same way, you'll probably end up with a $5-ish-k difference. Ask yourself if the extra 15 hp(*) is worth the dough. If you are sticking with a manual the GTS-standard Sport Chrono is a 'meh' option unless you can't rev match. Rev-matching is always on in Sport or Sport+ mode which may annoy you if you can rev-match.

(*) The torque curves for the S and GTS are identical until you get to the upper RPMs where the GTS hold boost for a few hundred rpm more for that extra horsepower number.

(Full disclosure: I don't like the blacked-out front bumper of the GTS either.)

ED is awesome. Make sure to plan it well and read up in the ED sub-forum.

Consider the Fire Extinguisher if you plan to DE. It's cheaper than an after-market solution and will meet PCA requirements for any Zone that requires an FE.

One other thing about the GTS is that you get an upgraded interior. If you like alcantera everywhere... which I don't.

Because it's Porsche. That's why. No other reason. This is much discussed on the other boards.

LOL. There are about 6 days a year 'round here where a convertible isn't useless. IMO.

If you are actually going to drive your 718 inside (or on) route 128 frequently, I would recommend sticking with the S and 19" wheels. That extra 1/2" of side wall will come in handy if you fail to dodge a wheel-eating pothole.

BlueNorther

My opinions:
1. The ala carte pricing on Porsche sports cars is to be appreciated. If you want a relatively simple sports car with manual transmission, you can order one, and it can be a relative bargain. If you want to customize with leather and color and gadgets, you can do that too.
2.The 718 base S and GTS all have the same engine. The real world performance difference between the base and S, and S and GTS is relatively small, unlike in prior generations. Spend some time reading the Car and Driver reviews and road tests, they even do them with manuals, and they like the car.
3. The basic sports plus seat is Porsche's best seat, at least if you are not overweight, have back pain, and regularly share you car with others. You don't need a dozen motors.
4. Once you have a basic idea of options (helps if you have prior Porsches for sure), ordering you own car to spec is well worth the wait and can be a good deal especially if you want manual, a bright color, and specific options. Dealers make good money on options, dealer cars tend to be loaded, tend to have PDK, and tend to have conservative colors.
5. If you want winter/wet traction, you'll want PTV (and then mechanical diff) which means you need to get PASM.
6. Sport Exhaust is now standard, and they have tweaked the exhaust note. See the recent video review on the Boxster 718 by Nick Murray. (He also has a long video on options, about an hour, well worth the time if you are new to Porsche. Or a Porsche Nerd like I am.)
7. Your iPhone will connect automatically and start playing your most recent playlist without CarPlay without taking your phone out of your pocket and take calls too, all via Bluetooth. I have CarPlay and never use it since I'd have to plug it in. Relatively cheap option in 718 though.
8. In my experience the used Porsche is not a bargain, since depreciation is limited, you can't get exactly what you want, and pay for options you don't want need, and have a car with uncertain history,

I've got a base 718 Boxster on order (MT, guards red, PTV/PASM),and thanks to a good discount , not much over MRSP despite the options. It will be plenty fast for the back roads of VT. The dealer is going to get me Hakkapeliitta winter tires (even studded if I want them) to go on extra 18" rims I have from my prior Caymans. It is going to be my snow car and summer back roads fun car. The 911 GTS going to continue doing the routine highway daily commute. I don't need or want another rocket.

worf928

Nope. The 718 base has a 2.0 while the S and GTS have a 2.5.

BlueNorther

Ah yes, of course, my bad, I was thinking 991.2. But still, the real performance differences are surprisingly small between these variants. And with the turbo engines, you have the option of straightforward tuning, if one were so inclined (I'm not).

worf928

Agreed. The noticeable difference between the two is the extra torque from the extra 0.5 liters of the 2.5.

joemis

I was facing the same decision a year ago: Lease on my 2015 M235i BMW was coming to an end - considering M2 or Cayman. Test drove an M2 plus went to the PEC in Atlanta and drove the Cayman - the test drive sealed the deal (plus I’m leasing, residual on Cayman is much, much better).

I ordered a base Cayman with MT, Sport Crono, PASM, PTV, 19 inch wheels among other options. Using the car for weekends, road trips and track days. No regrets. I felt the base has more than enough performance for the street and the only place I might miss the extra torque of an S or GTS is the track. Still a relative newbie on the track (just 6 track days under my belt at this point) so perhaps by the end of this lease I might be ready to move up to something more powerful.

The only thing I feel I gave up by leaving BMW behind was a bit more day to day practicality - less trunk space and cabin storage space in the Cayman - but given how I’m using the Cayman not an issue.

CaymanSinAR

Holy cow. Some lucky bugger is going to hit the driver's car jackpot when that hits the used market. Well done.

RotorOver

I daily a modded 2017 M240i, but after renting a base 718 Cayman from Turo and taking it into the mountains for a couple of hours, I knew a 718 had to be in my life. Was planning on a new GTS in a couple of years, but then started looking at CPO CSs. I wanted a manual, PASM, PTV, PSE and Carrera S wheels at a minimum. I was flexible on color. Ended up finding that configuration in a 2017 white on black/burgundy with 5k miles at a dealership in Chicago. They were great in getting pictures and any info I asked for to make my decision. By the end of the week, flew up there from Atlanta to finish the deal and drive it home.

I’ve got a Wavetrac LSD (with the shorter 3.08 final drive from a manual) in my M240i, performance springs, light-weight custom wheels and 235/265 tires, stage 1 tune and CAI on the car, so it’s more M2 like than M240i, quite a beast. But, the handling on the CS is on another level. I’ve driven stock OG M2, M3/4 at the performance center and those cars are no where close. In the twisties, the mid-engine and PTV with PASM allows the car to do some unnatural things.

So, I’d say get the PTV & PASM if you are going to push the car and if you can find it/spec it. Sport Chrono doesn’t make much of a difference on a manual, but to me it doesn’t make sense to not get it on a PDK car. Also, consider CPO. I think it is the best value going on a low mileage car plus you get to use the remainder of the factory warranty plus 2 more years. Oh, and get the tire and wheel coverage if you get the 20 inch wheels. Since picking the car up at the beginning of January I’ve already replaced two tires, one with a bulge and a lightly bent rim that was repaired, so I’ve already gotten $850 in value of the $1450 I paid for it in 3 months and it’s a 5 year policy.

Good luck on your decision and search!

AutobahnMac911

I went through a similar decision last year (CS vs CGTS). I was coming out of a 997 S, but had owned a dozen or so BMW's in the past including three M3's, a hopped up 135, 335, etc. so I know what you're coming from and getting into. That said, I think you have your answer on BMW vs Porsche so I'll just comment on CS vs GTS. I found a CS spec'd exactly how I wanted a manual with every sport option offered. Right before I pulled the trigger I came across a manual GTS. I thought I wanted the GTS, but ended up going with the S even though they both were equally priced around $95k. Here's why in case helpful:

GTS Cons
- Concerns online about the long term livability of the Alcantra. I read that it doesn't age well and tends to matt at common contact points
- No A/C in the Alcantra seats (I'm in FL) only heated
- I prefer the front bumper design of the S
- I prefer the contrast of the red running/brake lights in the clear housing vs clear / clear on the GTS
- This part doesn't matter to you if ordering, but what put it over the top for me were the exterior color (white vs silver), wheel color (Painted satin vs standard) and interior of the S (carbon fiber vs silver)

GTS Pros
- Has a third radiator (oddly not apparent in Porsche literature)
- +15 hp (though I didn't feel a difference and have been able to run equal times on Sebring to other GTS with similarly experienced driver
- "GTS" badging and brand

Let us know what you end up doing!