Test drove a 718CS today. Yes, it's a real Porsche...
05-28-2018, 03:08 PM
#16
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PASM Sport $290
Bi-Xenon in BLK PDLS $1,500
Auto dimming mirrors $700
And 3 splurge upgrades
GBM $650
Porsche Logo in satin BLK $220
Leather Alcantara interior in Blk with Alcantara seat centers. $2,160
$86,370 as ordered and I would have been just as happy with out the $3,030 in splurge upgrades. If I got prices into the upper $90K range I would have gotten a 911T.
I had a 981 GTS with the same basic options, except leather interior upgrade, and I was happy with overall appearance. Understand that my Porsche's are basically track cars and I would rather spend the $10k to $15k in interior upgrades on tires, wheels and brakes and seat time. Porsche does a wonderful job of getting people to buy options that are standard on cars that are 1/2 the cost.
Peter
05-28-2018, 09:11 PM
#17
Three Wheelin'
I see you use your cars for primarily track use; that's great. Most do not. Me personally, even if I didn't use my car as a primary means of transportation, I don't spend as much time on the track and, as excessive as it sounds, enjoy simple things like never having to pull a key out of my pocket and looking at a contrast stitched leather dash.
I'm not criticizing you for how you chose to option your car, because it's YOUR CAR. I am criticizing you for criticizing what you think others should do with their own money.
The way I see it, my near-perfect spec 718 GTS would come out to about $93k MSRP. It is actually in my opinion too expensive to justify, so I ended up in a very well equipped 981 GTS (which also had an original MSRP of $93k). Maybe in a couple years I do this all over again and get a CPO 718 GTS. I think that's the sweet spot for the best value; a couple years old with a handful of miles and a very long certified warranty. These cars might not be a good value for $90k+, but they sure as hell are for $60k.
05-28-2018, 10:25 PM
#18
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Are we being "option purists" now?
I see you use your cars for primarily track use; that's great. Most do not. Me personally, even if I didn't use my car as a primary means of transportation, I don't spend as much time on the track and, as excessive as it sounds, enjoy simple things like never having to pull a key out of my pocket and looking at a contrast stitched leather dash.
I'm not criticizing you for how you chose to option your car, because it's YOUR CAR. I am criticizing you for criticizing what you think others should do with their own money.
The way I see it, my near-perfect spec 718 GTS would come out to about $93k MSRP. It is actually in my opinion too expensive to justify, so I ended up in a very well equipped 981 GTS (which also had an original MSRP of $93k). Maybe in a couple years I do this all over again and get a CPO 718 GTS. I think that's the sweet spot for the best value; a couple years old with a handful of miles and a very long certified warranty. These cars might not be a good value for $90k+, but they sure as hell are for $60k.
I see you use your cars for primarily track use; that's great. Most do not. Me personally, even if I didn't use my car as a primary means of transportation, I don't spend as much time on the track and, as excessive as it sounds, enjoy simple things like never having to pull a key out of my pocket and looking at a contrast stitched leather dash.
I'm not criticizing you for how you chose to option your car, because it's YOUR CAR. I am criticizing you for criticizing what you think others should do with their own money.
The way I see it, my near-perfect spec 718 GTS would come out to about $93k MSRP. It is actually in my opinion too expensive to justify, so I ended up in a very well equipped 981 GTS (which also had an original MSRP of $93k). Maybe in a couple years I do this all over again and get a CPO 718 GTS. I think that's the sweet spot for the best value; a couple years old with a handful of miles and a very long certified warranty. These cars might not be a good value for $90k+, but they sure as hell are for $60k.
lm not an option purist
just pointing out that the You DONT have to spend over $90k to have an awesome car 
Peter
05-29-2018, 01:31 AM
#19
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I'm always amused by this type of 'dictim': "If you spend more than X$ or X% on options you're an idiot" or irresponsible, or ... whatever.
Along with this:
Porsche is the only mass-market car manufacturer that allows you to pick and choose your options one-by-one. You can get want you want and not get what you don't want.
Like the superfluous BS that comes with the two or three 'packages' that you may choose from if you (can) order a car from any other manufacturer? Where there's one thing that you want but you have to get 7 things you don't want or could live without? Or, worst case you have to accept something you hate in order to get one thing you want?
Everyone thinks their concept of reality, their needs, their desires is the only reality and everyone else is a moron if they don't agree.
I've got news: Porsche has figured this out and its long list of individual options is the response that allows anyone with the means to spec a car that aligns almost perfectly with their desires.
The only thing that's common to these multitudes of realities is the b1tching about option price. If you don't like the pricing you are free to buy a car from a manufacturer and deal with the compromises imposed upon you by that manufacturer's concept of what you should have.
And Porsche enables you to spec exactly what you want. While allowing 'manifold danger' to spec something very different.
What Porsche offers through the option list that no one else offers is: dynamic range. You can spec a focused 'track' car or 'luxury' car or a mix of both. Or, all of both if you can write that check.
And that's the last peice of the Porsche puzzle. Folks that are willing to pay for a bespoke car enable a high-value pre-owned market for those that are willing to compromise their desires to save money.
It's brilliant.
Dealers spec what they think they can sell to walk-on buyers.
When I was test driving the 718 my SA told me something interesting. In summary:
Folks buy Boxsters off the lot. Cayman buyers order.
Thus, he has a lot of Boxsters on the lot, but few Cayman.
Along with this:
Like the superfluous BS that comes with the two or three 'packages' that you may choose from if you (can) order a car from any other manufacturer? Where there's one thing that you want but you have to get 7 things you don't want or could live without? Or, worst case you have to accept something you hate in order to get one thing you want?
Everyone thinks their concept of reality, their needs, their desires is the only reality and everyone else is a moron if they don't agree.
I've got news: Porsche has figured this out and its long list of individual options is the response that allows anyone with the means to spec a car that aligns almost perfectly with their desires.
The only thing that's common to these multitudes of realities is the b1tching about option price. If you don't like the pricing you are free to buy a car from a manufacturer and deal with the compromises imposed upon you by that manufacturer's concept of what you should have.
2018 718 CGTS $79,800
I had a 981 GTS with the same basic options, except leather interior upgrade, and I was happy with overall appearance. Understand that my Porsche's are basically track cars and I would rather spend the $10k to $15k in interior upgrades on tires, wheels and brakes and seat time.
I had a 981 GTS with the same basic options, except leather interior upgrade, and I was happy with overall appearance. Understand that my Porsche's are basically track cars and I would rather spend the $10k to $15k in interior upgrades on tires, wheels and brakes and seat time.
What Porsche offers through the option list that no one else offers is: dynamic range. You can spec a focused 'track' car or 'luxury' car or a mix of both. Or, all of both if you can write that check.
It's brilliant.
When I was test driving the 718 my SA told me something interesting. In summary:
Folks buy Boxsters off the lot. Cayman buyers order.
Thus, he has a lot of Boxsters on the lot, but few Cayman.
05-29-2018, 01:54 AM
#20
05-29-2018, 12:53 PM
#22
2018 718 CGTS $79,800
PASM Sport $290
Bi-Xenon in BLK PDLS $1,500
Auto dimming mirrors $700
And 3 splurge upgrades
GBM $650
Porsche Logo in satin BLK $220
Leather Alcantara interior in Blk with Alcantara seat centers. $2,160
$86,370 as ordered and I would have been just as happy with out the $3,030 in splurge upgrades. If I got prices into the upper $90K range I would have gotten a 911T.
I had a 981 GTS with the same basic options, except leather interior upgrade, and I was happy with overall appearance. Understand that my Porsche's are basically track cars and I would rather spend the $10k to $15k in interior upgrades on tires, wheels and brakes and seat time. Porsche does a wonderful job of getting people to buy options that are standard on cars that are 1/2 the cost.
Peter
PASM Sport $290
Bi-Xenon in BLK PDLS $1,500
Auto dimming mirrors $700
And 3 splurge upgrades
GBM $650
Porsche Logo in satin BLK $220
Leather Alcantara interior in Blk with Alcantara seat centers. $2,160
$86,370 as ordered and I would have been just as happy with out the $3,030 in splurge upgrades. If I got prices into the upper $90K range I would have gotten a 911T.
I had a 981 GTS with the same basic options, except leather interior upgrade, and I was happy with overall appearance. Understand that my Porsche's are basically track cars and I would rather spend the $10k to $15k in interior upgrades on tires, wheels and brakes and seat time. Porsche does a wonderful job of getting people to buy options that are standard on cars that are 1/2 the cost.
Peter
05-29-2018, 04:00 PM
#23
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A lot of misconceptions in this case. My reply was to you can't get one for less than $90k. I disagreed and said yes you can. The 718GTS is one of the best handling Porsches around! The GTS is a tarted up S model with a nicely done interior and handling package at 0 options. Now you might not be able to keep it below $90K with your add ons but that was not the ?
rdmustang you assume a lot about what I can and cannot afford. Yes I would have gotten a .2GT3 if I could have gotten an allocation at MSRP but alas that didn't happen. But to assume the CGTS was a poor 2nd you are sorely mistaken.
worf928 You might think that Porsche would include auto climate control, standard on my dog hauler 2014 Base model WRX, and charging $700
for an auto dimming mirror is 
Peter
rdmustang you assume a lot about what I can and cannot afford.
Yes I would have gotten a .2GT3 if I could have gotten an allocation at MSRP but alas that didn't happen. But to assume the CGTS was a poor 2nd you are sorely mistaken. worf928 You might think that Porsche would include auto climate control, standard on my dog hauler 2014 Base model WRX, and charging $700
for an auto dimming mirror is Peter
05-29-2018, 04:43 PM
#24
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Ah! Thank You for proving my point: See, I *hate* the #$%^ing auto-dimming rear-view mirror. In a Porsche I can order one without it wheres with every other maker I’m either forced to take it or it comes in a package with one or a few things I want.
06-01-2018, 01:34 AM
#26
Burning Brakes
All of us that order our cars pick and choose options we feel that we simply cannot live without. When that first bottom line comes up and we say “Holy Crap” we go back and look at the option list again. Porsche is a finely honed machine when it comes to their list of options. They know if you are able to order a new Porsche for yourself, you are going to order on average $12,000 to $14,000 in options that you simply cannot live without. With basically only two “Free” options, Smokers Package and Floor Net, the rest are going to cost you money.
I did find it interesting that the same option in a 911 cost more than the same option in a Boxster/Cayman. Then within then same model group the price can increase. A PDK in a Cayman S is $500.00 less than a PDK in a Cayman GTS with a 15 horsepower difference. I speced my CGTS to almost 100K and I spent a lot of time on the configerator. I knew that I would spend little time on the track and the majority of my time would be on the street. I keep my cars a long time, 10 plus years on average, so I wanted to get a car that would last that long and that I would want to keep driving for that time.
I did compare my build against a Carrera T and it came out $20,000 more than the CGTS. Pick the car with the options you want and enjoy your car. Life is way too short and can end way too suddenly and unexpectedly. Live it to the fullest and without regret while you are here.
I did find it interesting that the same option in a 911 cost more than the same option in a Boxster/Cayman. Then within then same model group the price can increase. A PDK in a Cayman S is $500.00 less than a PDK in a Cayman GTS with a 15 horsepower difference. I speced my CGTS to almost 100K and I spent a lot of time on the configerator. I knew that I would spend little time on the track and the majority of my time would be on the street. I keep my cars a long time, 10 plus years on average, so I wanted to get a car that would last that long and that I would want to keep driving for that time.
I did compare my build against a Carrera T and it came out $20,000 more than the CGTS. Pick the car with the options you want and enjoy your car. Life is way too short and can end way too suddenly and unexpectedly. Live it to the fullest and without regret while you are here.
06-02-2018, 11:45 AM
#27
I copied all the options and packages to an excel spreadsheet to see if I could game the numbers somehow. All I can say is that Porsche did a pretty good job spec'ing and pricing.
06-04-2018, 01:28 PM
#28
I could have appended this to one of the other threads, but I figure the more 'headlines' the better.
I test drove a 718CS MT this morning.
The short story: I think that
- at least 50% of the people 'dissin' the 718 and its flat-4 have never actually driven one.
- of the remaining 50%, half of them had already decided that they wouldn't like it before driving one.
- it is a real Porsche.
I like the basso growl of the f4 at idle. It sounds like it's having fun as you load it up to its red-line (after properly warming-up the oil of course.) Most cars these days sound like a bag of rocks or a mechanical animal that's being tortured if you give the motor more than 1/3 throttle. Or both.
It's a very driveable motor. Even off boost it's got enough torque to feel not sluggish and with the MT it wants to run-along through town on the boost threashhold (~ 2k rpm). On the highway it's plenty fast.
And of course, it handles.
I test drove a 718CS MT this morning.
The short story: I think that
- at least 50% of the people 'dissin' the 718 and its flat-4 have never actually driven one.
- of the remaining 50%, half of them had already decided that they wouldn't like it before driving one.
- it is a real Porsche.
I like the basso growl of the f4 at idle. It sounds like it's having fun as you load it up to its red-line (after properly warming-up the oil of course.) Most cars these days sound like a bag of rocks or a mechanical animal that's being tortured if you give the motor more than 1/3 throttle. Or both.
It's a very driveable motor. Even off boost it's got enough torque to feel not sluggish and with the MT it wants to run-along through town on the boost threashhold (~ 2k rpm). On the highway it's plenty fast.
And of course, it handles.
Originally just stopped by Porsche dealership while I was out running around so that I could hear the exhaust note(s) side by side and compare; salesman being what he is, he suggested a test drive.... Like I'm going to say "No"???
Thoughts, in no particular order:
- Sound is definitely different. 718 more 'raspy'; 981 more 'throaty.' Is one "better" than the other? Not to me. Sport exhaust still a must have option, IMO.
- The torque curve looks (and feels) like somebody stepped on it (a good thing, IMO). Seriously, max torque is flat from <2K to almost 5K; on my 981, there's a noticeable torque increase when you hit about 4500 rpm or so up to about 6500 rpm. On the 718, there's a lot of torque at a relatively low rpm. It's nice to have. Noticed that I've gotten used to the 981 and actually like having to get the engine to "sing" a bit to feel the nice torque; almost a Pavlovian response with me now, LOL.
- Wonder about long term reliability/dependability with turbos. This isn't specific to the 718; turbos are nice but one more gizmo to fail.
- I don't like Alcantara (my 981 is *all* leather; no ultrasuede anywhere). This is mainly because it wears so poorly, especially on shift **** & steering wheel.
- In a convertible, I still much prefer the look of a Boxster to a 911 Cabrio.
So, I'm happy with my 981 and not looking to trade into a 718 (nor anything else, for that matter). Glad I did the evaluation myself.
06-04-2018, 05:42 PM
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All of us that order our cars pick and choose options we feel that we simply cannot live without. When that first bottom line comes up and we say “Holy Crap” we go back and look at the option list again... Pick the car with the options you want and enjoy your car. Life is way too short and can end way too suddenly and unexpectedly. Live it to the fullest and without regret while you are here.
06-05-2018, 05:57 PM
#30
Three Wheelin'
I own a 2015 981BGTS. Test drove a 718CS this past weekend.
Originally just stopped by Porsche dealership while I was out running around so that I could hear the exhaust note(s) side by side and compare; salesman being what he is, he suggested a test drive.... Like I'm going to say "No"???
Thoughts, in no particular order:
So, I'm happy with my 981 and not looking to trade into a 718 (nor anything else, for that matter). Glad I did the evaluation myself.
Originally just stopped by Porsche dealership while I was out running around so that I could hear the exhaust note(s) side by side and compare; salesman being what he is, he suggested a test drive.... Like I'm going to say "No"???
Thoughts, in no particular order:
- Sound is definitely different. 718 more 'raspy'; 981 more 'throaty.' Is one "better" than the other? Not to me. Sport exhaust still a must have option, IMO.
- The torque curve looks (and feels) like somebody stepped on it (a good thing, IMO). Seriously, max torque is flat from <2K to almost 5K; on my 981, there's a noticeable torque increase when you hit about 4500 rpm or so up to about 6500 rpm. On the 718, there's a lot of torque at a relatively low rpm. It's nice to have. Noticed that I've gotten used to the 981 and actually like having to get the engine to "sing" a bit to feel the nice torque; almost a Pavlovian response with me now, LOL.
- Wonder about long term reliability/dependability with turbos. This isn't specific to the 718; turbos are nice but one more gizmo to fail.
- I don't like Alcantara (my 981 is *all* leather; no ultrasuede anywhere). This is mainly because it wears so poorly, especially on shift **** & steering wheel.
- In a convertible, I still much prefer the look of a Boxster to a 911 Cabrio.
So, I'm happy with my 981 and not looking to trade into a 718 (nor anything else, for that matter). Glad I did the evaluation myself.
- long term reliability with turbos: I've had a plethora of turbo cars, and never once had an issue relating to the turbos themselves. I've only ever HEARD of any of my friends having issues when they try to dump tons of boost on an otherwise factory setup (or all out drag cars)- and then the issue was mostly with blowing things apart in the engine as you may well expect- the turbos held up just fine. In my 335i I had an issue with the high pressure fuel pump that's necessary because of BMW's particular design for that engine, but that's a well known problem that has been traced back ultimately to supply chain issues; can't blame it on turbos. TL;DR, it's an engine component just like anything else, and as such no more prone to failure than any other engine component. If anything, Subarus have proven that long term reliability is absolutely attainable in a turbocharged car; plus, virtually everything is turbocharged these days. Time will tell of course, but I wouldn't worry too much about it.
- Alcantara wears better than leather. 6 months ago I would have had a similar anti-Alcantara stance, and 1 month ago I would have been resigned to agree on the wearability, as the steering wheel and shift **** were darkened and smooth. I had the car detailed about a month ago and the Alcantara is like new, no other way to describe it. Apparently it's very easy to clean and maintain, as long as you don't get horrendous stains like blood, chocolate, ketchup, etc. on it without some sort of protectant... which would be the same sort of situation with leather anyway. Plus you don't have to worry about cracking/fading like you do with leather, so I'm convinced it actually wears better, and I've been converted to an Alcantara fanboy now.
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